Hello, MPSIMSers! Care to psychoanalyze my dog?

Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share
1

This here is a combination introduction of myself and request for advice thread.

Hello - my name is Dawn. I’ve been lurking for over a year and posting very sporadically since May. For the record, I have been personally welcomed to the SDMB by Arnold Winkelried - although I must admit he was not a moderator at that time.

You guys absolutely slay me. I love this place.

Now, on to my dog. He’s a big and strong 9 year old German Shepherd mix, about 140 pounds. He’s kinda smart but very very goofy. The best way to explain him is 'toon-like. Sometimes he’s pretty clumsy. He’s very vocal with a bunch of hilarious moan-groaning sounds we call Happy Noises. He also howls like a wolf, especially if he hears a police or ambulance siren. He’s generally a big, goofy, happy guy.

Lately he’s developed a weird stairs phobia. When I first noticed it I took him to the vet to make sure he doesn’t have hip dysplasia or some other physical problem. He checked out fine. He doesn’t do so bad going down the stairs, but going up he hesitates and makes a bunch of false starts, kind of getting up his courage, putting his paws on the first few steps, then taking several steps back - he does this several times, paces around, whines a little sometimes, looks up at me pleadingly, studies the stairs, and then braces himself and kind of bolts up the stairs. It’s the weirdest damn thing.

Now a new wrinkle has developed. I will wake up in the middle of the night and he will be whining softly, and every once in a while let out a little huffing bark. The first time this happened I didn’t understand - he was standing on the first-floor landing of the stair leading up the the bedrooms. I went down - “What’s wrong, big guy?” -and led him upstairs with me. Then he started doing this EVERY NIGHT. He will either be in the basement or the first floor landing, whining, and he won’t go up the stairs until I turn on the lights.

So now I have this huge lug of a dog who is scared of the dark and also stairs. I really don’t want to confine him. He is an excellent watchdog and has always made his rounds around every room of the house at night while we sleep. Also there are about 10 steps leading to the front door. I have to practically DRAG HIM up there now. I try to be patient but sometimes we’re in a hurry!

I don’t know what to do. Should I resort to baby gates in the house? Work on stairs training, being very firm with him? Or should I be gentle and understanding? How did this develop? This has all happened over the last few months. Does he have some deep, dark stairs tragedy in his past that I’m unaware of? Are there monsters under there?

If anyone understands dogs or has ideas, I’d love to hear what you have to day. The vet pooh-poohs me but the dog and I are both getting frayed nerves. We are going nuts here!!

-sulla

2

your dog may feel that you are moving away from him, and as such is scared of haviong his own independence. the stairs symbolicaly mean moving on from a certain phase in life and his reluctance to complete the ascendance displays his inability to accept change.

either that or he’s faking the whole thing and is loving the attention. :wink:

dont worry, just love him all the more!

3

Go check out the movie ‘The Sixth Sense’.

Then get chummy with your local priest.

4

Hummmm…

Sounds like your dog may be experiencing side effects from the Grey Alien mind control beams. I’d recommend contructing an aluminum foil crainial isolation device for him.

:wink:

5

Have you had this dog’s vision checked recently?

There is some reason why he doesn’t like the stairs, we just gotta figure it out. Did he maybe fall recently? When no-one was home? Is there a chance someone else was at your house and was mean to him? I mean, something started all of this. If it’s not physical, it’s something that happened. And it had to be pretty traumatic, because dogs don’t really have short term memory and can’t think in the abstract.

6

I’ll bet he hated his mother…

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His vision is fine. The vet checked him thoroughly. I haven’t noticed any injuries, but then he is very stoic. I really have no idea what could have happened. It wasn’t all of a sudden, kind of started as a mild nervousness with the stairs and keeps getting worse.

Let me ask you this: Can a dog be afraid of falling, even if he never has? Kind of like an elderly person? Maybe he’s getting clumsier as he ages. Nine isn’t young for an old dog…although he’s very strong, vigorous and healthy.

We’ve always had a strong bond and I can usually tell what he’s thinking - or at least what he’s reacting to and how he’ll react.

That soft whining in the middle of the night is really starting to creep me out and that soft, chuffing bark is something he has never ever done. Like he’s trying to get someone’s attention but doesn’t want to alert anyone else. Then when he gets upstairs with me he acts abashed and apologetic with ears laid back, but relieved at the same time, and stays very close to me.

Vestal Blue, I know you’re kidding but when I see this it isn’t too hard to imagine that there’s some supernatural explanation. It’s strange and unsettling.

8

Go see a different vet for a second opinion.

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I know what you mean. I have this big, cowardly German Shepard that seems to become more of a weenie every year. Now that July Fourth is upon us the behavior starts to get really bad. The fireworks scare the crap out of him, plus he is jumpy for days after things settle down. Shell shock? I can picture him years from now sitting at the bar at the local VFW paws trembling almost too much to drink his beer.

What’s worse is all the noises. Groaning when he gets up or lays down, snoring, and last but not least the flatulence. I swear its like living with Walter Matthau.

10

Your dog may have stumbled and it scared him. Afterward, he discovered that whining and acting scared got him attention and comfort. Dogs are shamelss oportunists.

He may also have an inner ear infection that distorts his balance. Did the vet check for that?

I really would suggest taking him to another vet. A vet should NEVER pooh-pooh your concerns. If I had a doctor that did that, I would find another one before you can say “Bad Doctor!” I would look into getting another vet, one that cares about your pet, and listens to you. You know your dog best and he may be trying to tell you he’s uncomfortable. Carefully press his abdomen and all over his body to see if that causes any discomfort, or if anything feels unusual.

If the dog is perfectly healthy and has just developed an aversion to climbing the stairs, I would try putting a dog biscuit or yummy treat at the top of the stairs and walking away. Do this every now and then, and see if the aversion dissapears.

Considering he’s an older dog, it could just be plain old laziness.

Good luck!

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A pox on all those who think this is an act. Anyone who knows their dog knows what the fake “oh poor me” looks like, and this doesn’t sound like that at all. I will however admit that if the fake act works they will use it til the day they die!!
I’m with the get another vet group. Permanently. This one is a jerk. This is a pretty major problem, it’s effecting your daily life and even if he thinks it’s nothing, he should give you advice on how to stop it. In the mean time try leaving the most favorite treats on the stairs. Not only at the top but every stair or two. Then every third or so. See if that helps. And be there praising every step up.
As for the supernatural, my dog used to wake up from a sound sleep and stare intently at a spot just over the front door frame. After my SO died. Other things told me that Michael was probably around so I’ve always figured that was what Cody saw. Cody knew Michael, so he wasn’t afraid. Just confused. Or that’s my theory.
But try a new vet before an exorcist.

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Sulla, I am only partially kidding; Dogs have senses far beyond our own, and the stairs notwithstanding, something is alerting him; that low chuffing bark is a dead giveaway.

I don’t say this to creep you out.

Also, I too am firmly in the get another vet camp.

Keep us posted, huh?

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I’d like to know more about the stairs themselves. Are the basement stairs the backless, open kind? (I’ve seen animals, cats and dogs, who really don’t like the open kind of stairway but are unfazed by more solid steps.) I’m also guessing the basement set isn’t carpeted. He might have slipped on those steps if so - easy for a paw to slip “through” and then wham! - and hurt himself enough to remember it, but not enough to show any real damage. Maybe you could keep him out of the basement for a while; possibly the memory will fade if he’s not confronted with those particular steps.

As for his late night performance - I wouldn’t get out of bed, I’d call him and keep calling him until he makes it up the stairs himself. I’d possibly keep some treats on the bedside table and I’d praise him lavishly for every successful ascent.

Good luck - other than driving you crazy, he sounds like a great dog!

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Just got off the phone - this afternoon I’m taking him to see my old vet, who’s retired. He is a really good doctor and is seeing us as a favor. I want to be absolutely sure he’s physically OK but for some reason I have a feeling he won’t find anything.

dragonlady is right - he is definitely not faking this. He acts apologetic and embarrassed, and obviously feels bad about inconveniencing me. At the same time he is definitely very nervous, if not downright scared. Also the sounds he makes at night are soft. In fact I can hardly hear him when he is in the basement and I wonder how this could possibly wake me up at all.

aseymayo, those are very good suggestions. I probably should try to stay in bed, but I can never get back to sleep with that soft, pleading whine and occasional chuffing sound. It’s downright eerie. I will try that, though, and see if I can get him to come. Treats would be great but with our other 2 dogs they wouldn’t last long.

The deck stairs outside are open. The basement ones have astroturf-type carpet, and the ones to the 2nd floor are hardwood.

Well, Monday we are loading up a big rental truck and moving to North Carolina (this started long before we even knew we were moving so that’s not related.) It will be interesting to see if this stairs problem continues.

-sulla

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Now you have to come to the next NC dopers meeting!

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Ultress responded to my moving situation on another MB and graciously invited me to e-mail her with NC questions.

I’d love to meet you guys.

JohnLarrigan - Impressive psychoanalysis! I kind of missed your post earlier. Now that you’ve done my dog, could you do me? I’ve always had this irrational fear of clowns, you see …:slight_smile:

17

My sister rescued a chocolate lab (Shorty) from the pound who is missing one of his front legs. He had the exact same problem with tile floors. He would circle and whine at the edge of the carpet, but if you were forceful, he would sprint across a narrow part and then act really embarrassed afterwards. At first, she actually had to put a rug across the hallway, just to get him to cross over. In his case, he definitely has fallen (and still does), but has never received any injuries as a result.

It took several months, and a considerable amount of patience, but my sister has managed to get him to completely get over his fear with gradual, gentle encouragement. The most important thing for her was to remember how self conscious dogs can get, if you make a big deal out of it. [My parents once had a sheepdog that would mope for a week after getting a haircut.] IMHO, overemphasizing the issue by pushing too hard or giving excessive rewards at the top of the stairs will only reinforce the belief that this is a major hurdle, and should be feared.

My sister found that it was also important to discourage Shorty from sprinting across in stark terror, since he was even more likely to fall or hurt himself again. Try calling him from a few steps up, rather than the top of the stairway. If you can find some wide steps or a stairway with a landing that the two of you can just sit on and smell the roses for a while, this should help too.

Finally, be persistent but patient. If you spend a few minutes working on it and he just isn’t going for it, shrug it off and go up the stairs without him. If you let your frustration show, it will be counterproductive.

Now if we could just keep Shorty from doing running dives into our laps. That bony stump gives the most painful charliehorses… Hope everything checks out at the vet today, keep us posted.

On a similar note, a co-worker of mine has a dog that will bolt in fear and hide under the bed anytime he smells lamb cooking. No other food does this, and he won’t come out for hours. Has anyone heard of a pet phobia like this?

Sigh. I wish my landlord would let me have a dog.

18

Dogs are weird.

My dog went through a weird phase when she was terrified of storm drains. She’s not a afraid of them anymore, thanks to clicker training.

Is your German shepherd food-motivated? What’s his name, by the way?

If so, you might consider clicker training. Make going up the stairs a fun and rewarding activity for him. Put a piece of food far enough up the steps that he has to go up a bit to get it. After he eats it, put another piece further up the steps, again far enough away that he has to go up to get it. He’ll hestitate and whine at first but will eventually say to himself, “Hey, I get food if I go up the steps. Going up the steps ain’t so bad!” If you do this exercise for five minutes twice a day for five days, I bet you’ll see improvement. When you’ve got him doing it without whining or hesitating, when he’s going up the steps like his old self, give him a big ol’ treat. For a while, every time he goes up the stairs with enthusiasm, give him a treat.

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Did she see that Stephen King movie * It, * too? I’ll tell ya, for the longest time, I kept peering down them as I passed, looking for a evil clown.

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Sulla

I know of another dog with this kind of problem. This dog had a vision problem - one that a simple neighbourhood vet can’t diagnose.

Take your dog to the local (or not so local) veterinary ophtalmologist and get his eyes checked out by that vet for PRA. Go to http://www.vet.purdue.edu:80/~yshen/cerf.html

Progressive Retinal Atrophy often starts out as night blindness - which could explain his fear of stairs, and this whole climing UP the stairs thing at night.

Also, ask your vet about his ears - his balance might be part of the cause.

My best guess would be to check his eyes for ANY sign of PRA. You’ll need someone clued in for this - slit lamp exam and ERG.

E. - mother of many dogs, and around breeders for many years