Help me decide where to live!

In My Humble Opinion
1

Hello Doper friends! Here is your chance to give me advice that will change my life!

I have about had it with the whole living-in-Japan deal. I want to come back to the States and enjoy real quality of life (er, living in a house that’s bigger than a rathole, buying food for reasonable prices, and enjoying a bit of Nature). At the same time, I’m sick of being held back from fulfilling my potential (or falling flat on my face, as the case may be) by ignorant managers. I’ve saved up a little bit of moolah and am willing to put my money where my mouth is: I want to start my own company. This company would start off with a rather eclectic business model: marketing consulting, advertising, and specialized translation (English-Japanese).

I will probably start out with some work I bring home from Japan: enough to survive on, I think. So, in essence, I can live anywhere I choose. I’d like to tell you my non-candidate and candidate places. You can also suggest (or warn against) places not on my lists. You are free to argue in favor of or against any of those I have on my lists, but first I’d like to tell you my

Basic Conditions

  1. Not a very expensive place to live: I will start out with some savings and a limited income. I want to begin with a rather low burn rate.

  2. Nice, peaceful environment. I don’t want to live in an extremely congested/inconvenient city. I want a place that I can get around easily. I want more or less easy access to trees and bodies of water (ie, Nature).

  3. Can build my business. I am not very picky here. I think a basic, semi-large city will provide enough of a base—I just don’t want to live in the middle of the desert, far from an airport or potential customers.

  4. Has some Japanese people. My wife is Japanese, and I’d like for her to be able to make some friends here, so that she doesn’t freak out or get completely homesick. Again, most semi-large cities probably have a big enough population to work with.

OK, let’s move onto the Non-Candidates. Remember that you are free to argue for these places if you choose!

  1. The West Coast. Don’t get me wrong—I think there are many great cities out there, but the West Coast has never attracted me or been my cup of tea. It is too cut off from the Midwest, which is my spiritual home, so to speak. And everywhere is so far from everywhere else. If you live in LA, doesn’t it take about 5 hours just to reach SF? And if you want to reach NY, it’s about 5 days on the road! It seems that you’re just so cut off from everywhere else. In contrast, east of the Mississippi, you can go from anywhere to just about anywhere in 24 hours.

  2. Other states west of the Mississippi. About the only candidate for a city would be St. Louis—but I have never been there and have no reason to go there. I’m sure there are other places that are great if you’ve lived there all your life.

  3. Mississipi/Alabama. Not to be a jerk, but these states (although I’ve never set foot in them) have always struck me as likely being the most backward and uninteresting in the country. If I’m wrong, please let me know!

  4. Florida Florida is warm and beautiful—but I just don’t feel drawn to it.

  5. North Carolina/Virginia/W. Virginia/Maryland/Ohio/Pennsylvania/Wisconsin/Michigan. These states are fine; however, they are close to my candidate states, so I would probably go with a candidate state first. Still, if I am missing something, please let me know.

OK, let’s go to the Candidates.

  1. Indianapolis, Indiana. I was born here and lived here 1971-1978. It is the 12th-largest city in the US, last time I checked, bigger than San Francisco and a lot of other cities you’d think would beat it. The city is easy to get around in and has some lovely areas for both living and working. It is also in driving distance from Chicago and many other cities in the Midwest. Since all our stuff is in Crown Point, IN, a move there would be simple and easy. Probably my #1 candidate at this point, but there are…

Cons. The economy here seems to be especially on the rocks. It is not considered a “cool” city like NY for marketing and advertising. There is no access to the ocean or other large body of water. Also, it could not bring new adventure to my life.

  1. Crown Point, Indiana. This would be a cheap and easy option. We could live at home with my mommy here a bit and live somewhere else later. It is also very near Chicago, which I could use to build business. This is essentially a corollary of option #1.

Cons. A lack of adventure and cool.

  1. NYC area. I really live NYC, where I spent a lot of time while interning in NJ in 1999 (what a great and yet so distant year!). My best friend and collaborator on many projects is also here—a big plus. This is the ultimate city, of course, for advertising, too. My friend will definitely push for me to move directly to NY. Options for living include New Jersey and NY suburbs, Connecticut, etc.

Cons. My biggest concern is burn rate. It is hard to find a decent apartment in the city, and in the burbs there are no apartments at all—you are stuck buying a crappy house for megabucks (yeah, I know there are expensive apartments in Hoboken, too). There is also the issue of congestion and the general aura of panic/nervousness that seems to go with NYC.

  1. Savannah, Georgia/South Carolina islands. We have spent many happy vacation days in this area, and part of my heart is always there. Winters are mild, the ocean is wide and noisy, and it is a distinctly noncommercial and peaceful area. One can really think here.

Cons. It is not a great center of commerce, and there are probably not too many Japanese people around.

  1. Kentucky or Tennessee. The semi-major cities of these two states afford a good combo of city/country living. The air is fresh and one is literally buried in the heart of the country—trees! mountains! There tend to be Japanese people here and there because of the auto plants, and there are Japanese companies serving them (a chance for business, etc.). The cost of living is low, and life is peaceable.

Cons. Not near water. One is in the boondocks.

  1. The Northeast. Mightn’t it be nice to live up there? I imagine quaint little towns and a decent cost of living. I’ve never been there, though.

  2. Juneau, Alaska. I’ve never been here, either, but my love of romance makes me think it could be a “cool” place to live.

  3. Hawaii. I should have put this higher up on my candidate list. Hawaii has great weather. I would probably skip Honolulu and go for the Big Island itself. Just chill. It is closer to Japan, and of course there are many Japanese people there. The one con is that it would be expensive to move my stuff there.

  4. Chicago, Illinois. Ah, Chicago. The small town that thinks it’s a big city and it is and isn’t at the same time. Great ethnic neighborhoods, great downtown architecture, but there’s something depressing and dingy about it too. I went to Loyola, so I lived there for three years. One bad thing about Chicago that few seem to recognize is how spread out the good parts of it are; it is not compact like Manhattan. There are a handful of cool/pretty places, and then mile upon mile of boring/dangerous/dirty neighborhoods. Also, there is no way to get out of the city. You are trapped forever within by ring upon ring of hideous suburbs like Cicero. Come to think of it, I don’t think Chicago is a candidate at all.

Thank you for your help and opinions!

2

Being quite familiar with Georgia, “not too many Japanese people around” is a bit of an understatement. I think you might have a helluva hard time attracting new business in Savannah.

I’ll throw my vote in for Hawaii. You can’t go wrong with Hawaii. And even if it does cost a little bit extra to move there - just wait 'till the first day you blow off your new business and hit the beach. Ah, bliss.

  • Peter Wiggen
3

BTW sorry to double post - but I was feeling a bit guilty about my unsubstantiated claim that there were very few Japanese people in Savannah - so I pulled up Georgia census numbers from 2000:

http://quickfacts.census.gov/qfd/states/13000.html

Note that Asians are only 2.1% of the population (which, although again unsubstantiated, I suspect are mostly located in Atlanta).

As for the census numbers for Asian percentage for the other alternatives:
Indiana - 1.0%
New York - 5.5%
South Carolina - .9%
KY - .7%
Tenn - 1.0%
Alaska - 4.0%
Hawaii - 41.6%
Illinois - 3.4%

See these numbers at: http://quickfacts.census.gov/qfd/

So for what it’s worth, Hawaii has the largest (self-described) Asian population.

  • Peter Wiggen :smack: :smack:
4

I reccomend Austin, TX to everyone.

  1. Not a very expensive place to live:

Parts of Austin are incredibly expensive. But an apartment in Pflugerville or Round Rock will run $500-600. I’m getting a beautiful 1bdrm, 715sq ft apt for $510/mo, with in-unit dishwasher, dryer, and washing machine.

  1. Nice, peaceful environment.

Austin’s a big city that still thinks it’s small. It’s very casual - I’ve gone to some of the best restaurants in town wearing Tshirts and jeans without anyone even glancing at me. There are a few lakes and foresty areas. It’s in the Hill Country, so that means it’s not a desert.

  1. Can build my business.

Austin-Bergstrom Int’l Airport’s in town.

  1. Has some Japanese people.

Check. If you can think of a country, there are peobably people from that country. I know there are a lot of Asian people, but I couldn’t say Japanese/Chinese/Korean/etc.
Austin has a lot of culture to it. There are art festivals, hippie gatherings, Mexican spiciness, college town feel, just a huge variety. The people are really friendly. It’s relatively safe (some parts of town are scary, tho. But there’s always a Scary Area). The Texas State Pride is an amusing thing.

Downsides:

Crazy Traffic: Afternoon rush hour is about 4:30-7pm. That means the highways aren’t going anywhere. People don’t let you merge. Cut you off. Some strange, strange road designs.

Heat: It gets HOT in the summer. At least, I think it does. Anything over 80 makes me want to die, and it’ll get into the 100’s.

The rest of Texas: The rest of Texas is a bit too Bible Belt conservative for me.

5

I know some people who live in Savannah and they tell me it can be a pretty rough place after dark. You may want to consider Atlanta, if you want to be in Georgia.

  1. Not a very expensive place to live
    It depends on where you want to live. If you want to live inside the Perimeter or downtown, then forget it, but our apartment out here in the 'burbs is pretty reasonable. With some careful spending, my GF and I managed to have a nice, reasonably safe one bedroom apartment (started out kinda ghetto, is now kinda upscale with no major change in the rent prices) and drive a new car on 2 hourly retail incomes. But we live out in the suburbs.

  2. Nice, peaceful environment. I don’t want to live in an extremely congested/inconvenient city. I want a place that I can get around easily. I want more or less easy access to trees and bodies of water (ie, Nature).
    This is going to depend where you live. Traffic’s a friggin nightmare if you have to go downtown for anything…

That said, we live out in the Roswell area and there’s a couple natural parks/recreation areas and access to the Chattahoochee about a mile down the road from our apartment. There’s a couple nearby complexes right on the river itself, if that’s your bag. You have the mountains a couple hours to the north, too. Check out the Roswell/Sandy Springs/Dunwoody/North Fulton area.

It’s a kind of compromise, too. It’s about a 2 hour drive to Chattanooga and some of TN, so you can go up there for the scenery, while having all the business advantages of a Major Metro Area.

  1. Can build my business. I am not very picky here. I think a basic, semi-large city will provide enough of a base—I just don’t want to live in the middle of the desert, far from an airport or potential customers.

Atlanta also has a ton of businesses, from Fortune 500s to Mom N Pops, so I imagine it’d be a good place to get your start, and airfares from Hartsfield are mucho cheap. You also have access to Charlotte (2 hours away) and Birmingham (which I’m told is growing) for a not-too-bad drive.

I will warn you, as someone who drove to Savannah, there’s friggin’ nothing between Macon (not a huge, bustling burg as it is) and Savannah.

  1. Has some Japanese people.

We have a pretty decent Asian population, I think.

I’m moving to Durham, NC, which I know is one of the non-Candidate states, but the Research Triangle Park area has a lot of tech firms and the COL seems pretty low to me and everyone I’ve talked to loves it there.

6

Nashville, Tennessee!

You’ve got the Country music Capital, an international airport, a minor league baseball team, an NFL team, and you are never far from water. There’s the Kentucky Lake, which streches more than 120 miles, with great fishing, boating and camping. And very peaceful rural areas.

7

Well, you thought wrong, my friend. :wink:

For starters, there’s a huge Asian population here.

Secondly, Loyola is in one of the shittiest areas of the city/suburbs. Most of the good stuff is on the North side. Yes, it’s a city of neighborhoods, but there are a lot of good ones really close together. If you do some investigating.

Finally, you can do a suburban thing, which will give you the advantages of the city, without the disadvantages.

Don’t write us off yet. We are a force to be reckoned with!

8

I’ve lived in two of the places you’ve mentioned, so I will offer my $.02, FWIW.

I grew up in northern NJ, near NYC. If you are looking for cheap, uncongested places with good public transportation, that ain’t it. Don’t get me wrong–I love NJ, but some of the most expensive places to live in the US are in the NYC area–Hunterdon and Bergen counties. Not to mention NYC itself.

You could live more toward southern NJ, near the Philly side. (Some folks will say this is central NJ but whatever). I have several friends who live in the Mercer county area. It is certainly cheaper and still within NYC commuting distance (and Philly distance) but I am not really sure there is much of an Asian population. Perhaps near Princeton there is, but then you lose the whole affordable aspect of your quest.

I have lived in Chicago for 6 years so I think I can answer this part, as well. Chicago is a wonderful place to live, with its ethnic (though not really Japanese) neighborhoods. However, it’s not at all cheap and you’re right, there is no real way to get out of the city (though, why would you want to?). So from that aspect, you are probably right to cross it off your list (though it’s really a great city, I swear).

I’ve been to the Champaign/Urbana IL area several times on in-law visits and I am thinking that might be a good place. It is very cheap to live there, there is a huge university with an international population and you can get a lot of land in your backyard. It is only about 3 hours from Chicago and I think about the same from Indianapolis, so if you still have friends and family there, you’d still be pretty close. So I think it is worth looking into on your end. (Sorry I can’t provide any links but look up Univeristy of Illinois at Urbana-Champaign and I am sure they will mention the towns.)

Good luck!

9

If you want country/city living, you can’t go wrong with Lexington, KY. It’s booming, it’s absolutely gorgeous and there’s things to do there.

West Virginia is a great state as far as the beauty and the people. The taxes are horrible, though and there are no jobs. I mention WV, though, because there is a Toyota plant in Point Pleasant, WV. There aren’t a ton of Japanese people running around here but most of them live near there. Start a business that caters to them and you’d be gold. Plus, Point Pleasant is on the border. You could live in Ohio and take advantage of the lower cost of living there and just be a hop, skip and a jump from WV.

You could also make a killing in either state by teaching Japanese. Lots of private schools want Japanese teachers – forget about the public schools, though, they do well to offer Spanish. If you didn’t want to go the school route, you could be a private tutor on the side while you build your business.

10

I wasn’t aware you could classify a city of 3,000,000 as a “small town.” :rolleyes:

I’m going to suggest against Arizona for you. Not because it woudn’t fit your needs, but because we’re probably not big enough.

Might I suggest Rio de Janeiro?

11

I was just coming here to pimp my city :slight_smile: Austin is gorgeous.

  1. There’s a great river with lots of wildlife running right through downtown. Other great outdoor-type places are within easy driving distance and there are a lot of outdoor clubs and sports team. (I just have to mention my sport, rowing, which is amazing in Austin and my club has intro classes :slight_smile: )

  2. Medium size city with decent airport service. Southwest flies here so it’s not too expensive.

  3. I can ride my bike everywhere.

  4. It’s a college town which has a nice vibe. There’s lots of interesting stuff going on all the time. There are literally festivals every weekend. Here’s a page of events for Saturday. You have the hippie fest “Eeyore’s Birthday” which is always fun, you have Dragon Boat racing sponsored by the Asian American Community Partnership (I see these guys on the lake a lot and it looks really cool), you have the Pecan Street Festival which is a great outdoor arts show, etc, etc…

  5. There are definitely Japanese people as there are some Japanese companies located here since Austin is a very “techy” city. I’ve taken a couple of Japanese courses at the local community college and the teachers are all native speakers. Plus, by a weird coincidence, my landlord is Japanese. I know she mostly hangs out with Japanese people so there must be some Japanese social groups in town. I can probalby find out more info for you if you’re interested.

  6. Yes, some of it is expensive but there’s a housing glut right now and things are getting cheaper. I live on 13th street (right near downtown and the river) and I pay $650 for a two bedroom. Granted it’s a small, older two bedroom with out any extras (i.e. no dishwasher or washer/dryerconnections) but it’s much larger than a typical Japanese apartment.

Downsides are what Silver Serpentine mentioned.

Traffic can be bad but compared to many big cities, it’s not bad. I used to live in Atlanta and Austin is much, much better.

It does get pretty hot in the summer but I’d personally rather be hot than cold so it doesn’t really bother me. Sweat never killed anyone. I see Yokohama is just south of Tokyo so you guys are probably used to heat. It is less humid than you’re probalby used to tho’.

12

Much to ponder here. Anyone else in favor of Hawaii? No one like Indy?

13

I like the Big Island - Hilo certainly fits the bill of a small city/large town. It has amenities ( restaurants, bookstores, large supermarkets, etc. ) without being overwhelmingly urban. However…

  1. Island fever would be a real issue for me, dunno about you. Beautiful as it is, it is only so big and claustrophobia could set in. But maybe living in Japan has primed you to accept that - me, I like being able to drive 5 hours to LA or the Oregon border ;).

  2. More importantly, the economy sucks. Outside of tourism ( and even that I believe is down ) it seems Hawaii, especially the Big Island is hurting pretty badly these days. Starting a new business is liable to be rather difficult I would think. It also isn’t enormously cheap because of the effect of the tourist-oriented economy. Cheaper than where I live, it’s true. But everywhere is cheaper than that :).

  • Tamerlane
14

Let me give a shout out for my current home, Hartsdale, NY. If you like apartment living, there are plenty of apartments available. If you get one of the places “in town”, you will be walking distance from the train station (nice access to NYC), and numerous Japanese businesses, from the Japanese grocery store, Sake store, Sushi store and Japanese restaurants. I don’t really know the size of the Japanese population, but they sure have a lock on retail space!

It’s a small town in the middle of Westchester county, right next to White Plains and Scarsdale, if you know the area. If you weren’t coming with your wife, I’d suggest buying my apartment (studio), since my current buyers don’t seem to be fairing too well with the co-op board :mad:

15

I’d like Hawaii as a retirement home, but I don’t know if I’d wanna start a business there. You’ve got a relatively small population to work with, COL is kinda high, and you’re a good flight from anywhere on the mainland. Whereas some of the cities we’re talking about have access to huge metro areas or a handful of good-sized towns. Why limit yourself, especially when you’re starting from scratch?

As for Indy, on one of the boards I read, one of the posters called it “The Small Town That Thinks It’s Big”, which holds no appeal for me.

16

Well, having been born in one area already mentioned (south NJ, commuting distance from Philly), having most of my extended family and having gone to college in another one (NY and northern/central NJ), having gone to grad school near a third (Bloomington, IN, near Indy) and having grown up near and currently living in a fourth (Chicago), here’s what I think…

Southern NJ: either too rural to have any cultural interest, or Land of Strip Malls. Unless you’re living in Philadelphia, which ain’t cheap. Philly is historically interesting, nice architecture in some spots, and some cultural diversity, but not cheap. Also some really icky neighborhoods. On the other hand, you’re not far from the Jersey shore and Atlantic City, or the pine barrens, if you’re into that sort of thing.

NY: well, I think you already have that down. I like NY for a few days at a time, and there are few places in the world that are more culturally diverse (or have a larger Asian population outside of Asia), but it’s ridiculously expensive, especially if you want to live commuting distance from Manhattan but don’t want to live in a shoebox. After a few days, NY just stresses me out and I want to go home. But of you want some more info on NY, the NY-area Dopers are probably better qualified to provide advice.

Indianapolis: bores me to tears. Bloomington: nice college town, pretty trees and rolling hills, and more culture than a lot of Midwestern towns that size. The job market there sucks, even worse than in Indy, but if your work is coming from elsewhere then you won’t have to worry about that. And the housing will be cheaper than in a major metro area. But your wife will feel very ethnic. Heck, I’m no WASP, but I’m more or less white, and I felt ethnic there; I really felt sorry for, say, the Kazakh exchange studets. Much less ethnically diverse than other Midwestern university towns, like Champaign-Urbana.

Chicago: the weather here can really suck, but I like it; to me, it’s just home. Much less insane cost of living than other major urban areas its size, perhaps in part because of the sprawl. (I personally like the sprawl; I think it’s what gives the place a more relaxed feel.) You have a lake, all the cultural diversity you could ask for, and a few blocks from me in Uptown, the Japanese Cultural Center! There is also a big Japanese community in a far northwestern suburb, Arlington Heights.

More info on request…

17

Oh, and by the way the north suburbs of Chicago are less than an hour’s drive from Wisconsin, and the south suburbs are not far from the Indiana Dunes if you want nature. (Plus there are other forest preserves closer in. How much nature are we talking about? Sorry, I can’t really offer mountains, though.) Plus, we do have a big lake and a fairly extensive public transportation system.

18

South Jersey:
[ul]
[li]Relatively inexpensive[/li][li]Commuting distance from major metro areas[/li][li]Uncongested[/li][li]Large Asian population in the Atlantic City area[/li][/ul]
I believe that covers your four criteria. :slight_smile:

Good luck in your search!

19

I’m not sure why you think the only city west of the Mississippi is St. Louis. KC, Denver, Phoenix, Las Vegas…

Anyway, I think the front range of Colorado (Pueblo-CO Springs-Denver-Boulder-Ft. Collins) fits quite a few of your criteria.

We got nature out the wazoo.

A big Japanese population. Japanese-American, I should say. In the 2nd World War, when people of Japanese descent were being evicted from their homes on the West Coast, Colorado was the only state that accepted the refugees and preserved their rights as American citizens, thanks to governor Ralph Carr (Why don’t they make Republicans like that anymore?) Many of the Japanese remained after the war and there is a very large Japanese community here. Downtown Denver has a “Sakura Square”, a block of Japanese shops and businesses.

It is still relatively easy to get around. For a large population, it is pretty congestion free.

It is kinda expensive. You aren’t going to find a 2000 square foot home on land for $100K like you can in the Midwest. Not unless you go far east of the mountains.

20

My advice won’t be very popular with you, but that’s OK-- you can just skip it and go to the next post. :wink:

Don’t choose Indianapolis. All the disadvantages of a big city (except bad traffic) with none of the advantages (except major league basketball and football).

Horrible weather (IMO), hot and humid in the summer, cold and dreary in the winter. Only April and October are bearable there. And…

…Lots of crime; horrible architecture; virtually no culture whatsoever; plenty of racists (great for your wife), which helps lead to “white flight” that just won’t quit; rampant conservative attitudes–not just politically, but in every way imaginable; and property taxes have gone way up recently (I hear).

I could think of more, but you get my drift; plus, you lived there. Just my two cents. Bloomington or Lafayette beats the heck out of Indy-- hell, so does Crown Point.