Help! Problems stemming from an oil change...

Factual Questions
1

This is a great message board and I have learned quite a bit from lurking. As fate would have it, I actually have a problem that is both car-related and perhaps legal too!

I have a 1990 Acura Integra, 181,000 miles, loving cared for (mechanically at least) though it has acquired many dings and dents here in Boston. I usually go to Jiffy Lube up the road and they sent their “come get your oil changed” coupon in the mail, so I headed down there.

As soon as I sat down, the crew asked me to come to the car (never a good sign!). They started to explain that as soon as they started to loosen the filler plug, they knew it was stripped - and the oil pan as well. They next said, “Your last oil change, they didn’t set the plug properly and stripped it. We can’t open the oil pan because it won’t seal, and if we did open it and seal it, it would eventually break and your engine would seize. You need to go to the place where they last changed your oil and they should replace the pan and the plug.” They also put a “tamp seal” to hold it in place. Sounds fair. I used to change my oil myself (probably about 8 years ago) and I know you have to set the plug properly, etc.

So I waltz (actually, drive) over to the Speedy/Monro place where I had my oil changed on January 28, 2005. (My car wouldn’t start after being buried in a blizzard for a few days, and it needed a tune up. I had them change the oil since they had it there.) There was a different guy at the desk than usual, and what follows is our exchange:

He: Can I help you?
Me: Yeah, I had you guys change the oil in my car on January 28. I just took it to Jiffy Lube for an oil change, and immediately, they told me that the pan and filler plug were stripped. They wouldn’t open it and told me I should come back to the place where I last had my oil changed - which was here.
He: Well, sometimes plugs get stripped…
Me: I’ve never heard of that. Plugs get stripped by not being seated properly, and overtorqued, but I don’t see how it could just happen.
(We go back and forth for a while. He sees that I’m not buying his “sometimes this happens” line.)
He: Well, what do you think should be done?
Me: I think you should take a look at it and see if it’s stripped yourself. If it is, I think you should replace the pan and the plug.
He: (shakes his head) Well, we can look at it. But you should come in when the regular manager is here, just because he handled it last time. Come by Friday.
Me: Thanks, I will…

So I have several questions:

  1. Is the explanation from Jiffy Lube logical? Seeing as the filler plug is inaccessible and untouched by anyone since the last change, I would point the finger at Speedy. The car hasn’t leaked oil, ever. The Jiffy Lube folks had my car on the floor exactly long enough for me to exit my car, go into the waiting room, and read a paragraph of a paper I was grading - about 5 minutes. I can’t imagine how they could possibly strip a filler plug while removing it. In fact, they didn’t continue to loosen it as soon as they noticed it resisted. I think all fingers point to Speedy, but those of you who know cars can steer me correct if I’m wrong here.

  2. No one at Speedy mentioned anything about my plug being stripped at the last change. It seems that they would notice that and let me know, am I correct?

  3. The invoice states that there is a 90 day warranty on parts & labor. It’s been 96 days between the change and today. Are they off the hook at Speedy for stripping my filler plug?

  4. Let’s suppose the manager gives me grief and says that there isn’t anything he can do about it. What should be my next step? Do letters to corporate types work in this kind of instance? I am being very reasonable: if in the process of changing my oil, they stripped my oil pan and plug, I want it replaced. Nothing more, nothing less.

  5. Is my car in any immediate danger? If I don’t change the oil, do I have to worry about the oil gushing out and my engine seizing up?

  6. Any other advice from you smart people?

Thanks a million for any advice you can lend… I will wait patiently for your wise responses!

2

I am not a car mechanic, but I have performed several oil changes while working at my father’s gas station.

In all those years I have only encountered one (1) car with a stripped plug and it wasn’t due to incorrect tightening. The driver had driven over a rock or something and there was a big dent exactly where the oil plug was.

Also, I don’t understand how the guys at Jiffy Lube figured out that the plug is stripped. Maybe the plug resisted because the car engine was still too hot?

3

I’m sure it can be fixed without getting a new pan. You might have to just have the whole tapped to a bigger size and get a new drain plug. Trying to find out whose fault it is is futile. No one is going to pay for it. Get it fixed and move on.

4

I recently went through this stripped-plug thing with my car ('98 Prelude). So here’s my take:

  1. Is this logical ? Yes. Oil pans are not all that thick - so not all that many threads for the filler plug to “grab”. At 181k miles with an average oil change every 5k miles (“loving care”, right ?) says that filler plug’s probably been removed/replaced more than any other bolt on your engine. 35 times may not seem like much, but given 1) the oil pan is not all that thick and 2) given that there is usually residual old oil still dripping out when the plug is being replaced, not the most “care” is always spent when replacing one (there’s a reason these places refer to themselves as “Speedy” and “Jiffy”).

  2. and 5. There’s “stripped” and there’s “stripped”. That is, the plug could have been “okay” as far as the last guy who put it in (it screwed in and wasn’t necessarily loose), but when removed, one could see the threads were shot. It is possible the plug was in place okay, but not forming the best seal. So some leakage could occur. Best case, only a small, slow leak. Worst case, the plug actually falls out and you are up sh*t creek ! (yes your engine will die a fast, ugly death).

  3. & 4. Some 15 years and 181,000 miles later, provided you had regular oil changes amounts to “normal wear and tear”. You can’t blame the “last guy who touched it” for something that just wears out. Think tires. Is the last guy who checked/inflated them responsible for the wear ? It is possible that the guy at Speedy did a sloppy job, but you could never prove it.

  4. Bite the bullet and fix the oil pan (and pay for it). Either have the hole tapped out, or just replace the entire oil pan (what I opted for). If the car is running fine and you intend to hold onto it for a while, I’d just replace the pan.

5

Oil drain plug threads can deform over time. Overtightening can hasten the process, but I see it often enough to consider it normal wear and tear. A sharp mechanic will notice the deformed threads and get a new drain plug while doing the oil change.

There’s no way to be sure that the threads in the pan are damaged without removing the plug and inspecting the pan. I am wondering on what basis Jiffy Lube determined the pan was stripped. Anyway, if you’re lucky, all you need is a new plug (approx. $5).

If the threads in the pan are damaged, it doesn’t necessarily require a new pan to fix it. Sometimes oversized drain plugs are available (and just the fact that they exist testifies that this is not an extremely rare situation) and might be all that is needed to solve the problem. In a worst case though, if the pan is too damaged to reliably hold a plug, the pan will have to be replaced.

It’s hard to definitely determine responsibility. Only the person who last installed the plug is in a position to know if he overtightened it or if the plug threads were deformed. There may have been no indication of a problem, or there may have been but it wasn’t noticed. But either way, there’s probably no way to find out for sure.

A customer-oriented business would probably give you the benefit of the doubt and take care of it on the basis that it might be their fault. Large corporations will often take care of such things because it’s expedient – it doesn’t happen often enough to be a significant expense to them, and if it gets to court judges tend to sympathize with the customer.

The plug will probably stay in place if it’s not disturbed, but that’s not a certainty. The potential consequences of its falling out are severe, so dealing with it ASAP is probably the wisest course.

6

Oil drain plugs strip out all the time. The plugs are actually made of pretty soft metal so that the plug will strip out rather than the oil pan. I’d be suspect of Jiffy Lube saying the pan itself is stripped. I’ve replaced a lot of plugs, but not a lot of pans. But if it has 180k miles on it, thats about sixty oil changes, and it could happen. They make oversized drain plugs that cut their own threads, but your pan is probably aluminum, and I wouldn’t recommend them on it. They also make rubber plugs that use a special tool to remove, but they are more likely to fall out. I’ve also seen people use helicoils on drainplug holes, but they would have to be reinstalled every time the oil is changed.

7

I know that the threads in an oil pan can be stripped or cross threaded because I did it myself once in my younger days. That was a '67 Ford with a steel oilpan; fortunately, the pan could be replaced without pulling the engine or dropping the suspension. My Miata has an aluminum oil pan and a steel drain plug (though the plug isn’t stock; it’s possible that the original wasn’t steel).

I doubt you’ll get the oil change place to repair the damage, though. Even you know to a moral certainty that they did it, There’s no way to prove that someone else didn’t do it after they last serviced your car.

8

If it’s pricy, I’d just negotiate with both shops, then negotiate up the chain with their corporate ladders.
Then I’d probably threaten to sue both shops in small claims court, then I’d ACTUALLY sue them both, separately.
That’s assuming the repair is actually a big deal, not if it’s a $150 deal. In that case, I’d just push up stream at both companies, and I’d be calling someone with “Vice President” in his title before I let up.

9

And don’t forget you can start a somecompany-sucks.com website to blow off steam.