Well, if the plan is to reduce the burden on businesses (which will translate, in theory, to them hiring more workers), how do you feel about single-payer health insurance, comparable to the Canadian model? This would lift a considerable burden from business.
No, but if he’s going to threaten violence I’m his huckleberry.
Total percentage? What are you asking?
Total number of dollars. Though presumably, if a person’s total number of dollars paid went up, their total percentage would, too.
Businessmen are sitting on 3 trillion dollars. They are not hiring because there is not excess demand for their products. If you zeroed out their taxes, they still would not hire. They hire when they can not keep up with demand.
That is not a hard concept to understand, ABLOY.
How bad a businessman would you have to be if you just started hiring workers with nothing for them to make, just because you were sitting on a pile of money? They do not care about the state of America’s economy. They do not care about the unemployment problem. They hire when they have unfulfilled demand.
Productivity has gone up rapidly the last couple decades. Workers have had flat or dropping wages. The difference has been that companies have had skyrocketing profits, which they chose not to share with their workers. They are not short on cash. Cutting taxes even more, will simply put more money in their pockets.
I’m having trouble finding any cite or piece of evidence that shows that workers spend less when they receive more money in their paycheck, if only from the drop in income tax rates, so, please, could you prove me wrong?
So, Abloy, how do you (and Cain) feel about single-payer heath insurance? It’d help businesses, no?
And how does a massive cut in the corporate tax rate put more money in the workers’ paychecks again?
Preface: I do not speak or represent Cain, so consider this response limited only to myself.
Sure, but I believe there are other, better, options.
Besides, from the consensus in this thread, it seems as if any money saved by businesses go directly into the pockets of those who run and/or own the company, so, we shouldn’t even discuss it.
Notice my reference to the income tax rate drop? They’ll at least have more money in their paycheck from that. I believe, along with many others, that money saved from the corporate tax rate drop factors into things such as raises and possibly new hires but, apparently, I’m wrong in that train of thought.
Nevertheless, workers will have more money in their paycheck from the drop of income taxes, even if it’s the only change to their paychecks.
Some workers may get a few bucks in their paychecks. The rich will make out like bandits getting huge amounts of money .
If I get 5 bucks a week, why do I care if a millionaire gets 80 thou. ?
Good thinking again. We have to raise revenue. We are broke due to ridiculous tax cuts for the rich. You say they should get even more.
Then let’s just go ahead and abandon capitalism.
If any increase in income for a company is going to be straight pocketed by those in charge, what is the point?
Yes, all those small business owners out there, the ones responsible for over half of this countries’ employed workers, are going to take this 23% break and totally fuck over their employees and businesses. No raises, no investments, no new hires, no that shit is going straight in their pocket! Outstanding logic. Just immaculate. Damn you small businesses!
We did that long ago. You are probably too young to remember when we actually had competition. Most people have never experienced it.
Gas stations used to cut prices and add services to lure customers in. Now they buy up the competition until there a re a few major companies that dominate an industry. Oil companies divide the spoils up,. They do not compete. Try and get a new cell phone package. The services and prices are practically identical.
The banks bought up all their competition.
We have oligarchy. A few companies dominate an industry to their benefit.
Are you familiar with "purchases and acquisitions’. Companies had departments with that as their goal.
Competition helps the consumer and the country. Prices are lower . Companies have to innovate to keep ahead of the competitors. But since we have eliminated competition, Companies just compete with advertising.
You will note that we don’t even make the list of countries with highest speed internet. Ours is slower and much more expensive. That of course is because there is no factor pushing them to invest in cutting edge connections. Why invest if your competitors offer the same shit you do?
Experienced it? Nah, wasn’t alive in the time period you indicate, or at least not rational enough to make sense of it all. I’ve done by reading, if that’s any consolation.
I guess they don’t have companies like Metro PCS and Straight Talk who went against the norm and offered plans without long term contracts? Well, it’s catching on.
Ok, is there any reason they can’t or shouldn’t?
Oh yes, just like Microsoft dominates the PC market (Apple doesn’t stand a chance!), or GM and Ford must keep foreign competitors at bay, or Yahoo! will remain the search engine king, Myspace is too important for Facebook, etc. Want more? I can do this all day.
Oh shut the fuck up. History and the economy are full of rags to riches stories.
Cool! Explain all the big, major corporations that are independent and don’t have sister companies or major owners?
I hope you aren’t a proponent of universal health care with that mindset.
Competition exists, you’re just either to ignorant or arrogant to see it.
That’s horseshit.
If that were the case we would have never seen DSL, Cable, or Fiber Optic technologies emerge in the consumer market.
There’s more to the reason why we have slower internet speeds than Europe, Japan, South Korea, and even Canada, and it’s not because of lack of competition. There are more ISP providers in the U.S. than Japan and South Korea combined. The competition is there.
There are a list of reasons why we are slower than other countries and regions.
I mean, first of all, we’re a big fucking country, and that takes time and money to wire up with the latest trend. Phone lines were here prior to the internet, so were cable lines. Fiber optic? No. Same case with Japan - which country do you think it’s faster and cheaper to install fiber optic lines int?
There are theoretical limits to phone and cable that are well below fiber optics. We aren’t going to be able to compete with Japan and other faster nations until we can install and utilize the technology they are now. That shit costs money, and takes time.
There’s also the nature of demand. Of Verizon’s serviceable area, less than 1/3 of consumers are electing to go with the service. It’s known as “take-up” rates in the industry.
Rural areas and low income places are also the last to get cutting edge technology, simply because the costs of installation don’t reflect on the return on investment. There’s a chunk of the population.
Then you also have government influence and regulation. The Netherlands were able to fund their entire network with private money, because the government really didn’t restrict them. Rhetorical question, which do you think is faster and cheaper to equip with fiber optics? The U.S. or Netherlands?
I can do this all day. There are a number of factors. I really feel silly having to explain Internet Economics 101 to someone as old as yourself. You should know better. Occam’s Razor, really, because yes, competition could easily explain the slow/expensive internet we have compared to the rest of the world, but in reality, that’s far, far from being the truth. I mean, did you HONESTLY expect one reason above any other to be responsible for such a complex portion of the economy?
I really cannot believe I’m having to explain this. This is silly. You cannot be this fucking stupid. You can’t. I don’t care if I’m going to get banned for this but it just boggles my mind how fucking clueless someone could be about this. And then to use it as a point? Jesus Christ.
Also, just went and saw Herman Cain speak in Atlanta. Thousands showed up. Interesting story I learned from the campaign staff - prior to the Straw Poll, Wal Mart did not want to sell the book. After the straw poll, they purchased 50,000 volumes.
I knew you would say stupid crap like that.
Our fiber optics have been integrated very slowly and only when replacement was needed due to failure. The list of countries with faster internet and cable include countries who had to make the whole thing from scratch in a short time.
Our cable companies convinced the government to allow them to add 5 bucks to cable bills to update the lines. They just kept it. They have no intention of upgrading.
in Europe, the phone , cable and internet are much faster and much cheaper. That is because they actually force the companies to upgrade. They also have competition and the companies fight for customers. That was true in America long ago.
The competition in America only exists in your right wing imagination. I understand you have never seen it.
AbloyProtec, I’m giving your a formal warning here. Your comments are way out of line for this forum.
This is also inappropriate for this forum, gonzomax. Don’t do it again.
And as a general note to everyone, comments about violence toward other posters are not welcome on this site.
Screw the consensus. What better options can you suggest and, if none of them were available for some reason, should Cain support single-payer?
Because when they do, the result is a few banks which are too big to fail, and must be bailed out at taxpayer expense when they do something stupid, lest they destroy the economy even more.
The demand is not there.
Remember when you said demand drives an economy? Verizon is publically stating that of the customers that could switch to fiber optics, only 1/3 are doing so. Do you think they, or any other ISP, is going to bother investing time and money into equipping their areas when people aren’t buying the service? Do you understand simple economics? ROI?
You know, do I need to show you this:
Come on, I can’t believe we’re debating this. They aren’t going to equip the U.S. with the latest technology if no one’s buying it simply because we need to keep up with the rest of the world.
Start a thread. I’m not turning this into a thread about my ideas and why you and anyone else disagrees with them. This thread is about Herman Cain, hence the title.
When you create the other thread, PM the link and I’ll share my views.
Fine. What is Cain’s position on health care, and is he willing to embrace options that make things easier for business (as his overall platform premise seems to be that making thing better for business makes things better for America). Is the extent of his plan only tax cuts and deregulation?
Is Google or Yahoo down for you? I’m pretty sure when I Google “Herman Cain Healthcare” I get the same responses as you.