Homo Sapiens / Neanderthal hybrids?

New Scientist:


Well they don’t specify Neanderthal in that article but if not Neanderthal what else could it be? I thought the general consensus on this, for some reason controversial, issue was that no such hybridisation had taken place. Which was also the conclusion of another German DNA (mitochondrial) study a few years back. On the other hand Homo Sapiens and Neanderthals did coexists in Europe for many thousands of years and there were some very interesting finds of possible hybrid bones in Portugal a few years back, some speculate red hair and freckles are Neanderthal traits – and let’s just admit it: Homo Sapiens men will screw anything remotely human-like – so why not a Neanderthal?

Let’s just see what happens if they ever do find a living population of Homo florensiensis! There’s already a subgenre of “dwarf porn,” so why not “hobbit porn”? :smiley:

Sorry, that’s Homo floresiensis. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homo_floresiensis

I see no reason for Neanderthals and Cromagnons to not interbreed. If you peel away the charicatures, they probably were not very different in genetic makeup or appearance. Look at the range of human appearance today - tall, short, thin, heavy, muscular, etc. On the average, Neanderthals are believed to be more muscular (better looking?) while Cromagnons are believed to have finer features (better looking?). Besides, red hair and freckles can be kind of cute.

Neandertals and modern humans coexisted in SW Europe for over 10,000 years, as has been known for 25 years now. A cave at Zafarraya, Spain, near Malaga, has Neandertal remains down to about 30,000 YBP.

There seems to be significant evidence for Neandertal/modern hybrids, as referenced in this 1999 article by Tattersall and Schwartz.

Yeah. Not to speak of furries. And it’s got to say something about us when “zoophilia” and “bestiality” returns more than seven million hits on google.

This link (from wikipedia) has a reconstruction of a Neanderthal boy. Looks a bit strange at first, but I recon he could walk down the street without much notice. The Neanderthal theory of autism

Older Wikipedia versions of articles on Neanderthals actually had a fair bit about hybridisation, now any mention of this has been edited out. I should have expected at least a refutation. Is it possible to view older Wikipedia articles – or only the comments?

I seem to recall reading that there is now some evidence that populations of H. sapiens and H. erectus may have co-existed in close proximity, but that evidence is Asian, not European. Still, if you’re looking possibilities that may be another one.

How can anyone know whether the Neanderthals had freckles, or what color their hair was? Or even whether they had hair at all? It wouldn’t be apparent from their bones, would it?

Probalem #1 of this idea is that there is no archaeological evidence supporting interbreeding. No skeletal remains have been found that suggest a Neandetal crossbreeding. Of course, that doesn’t rule it out, but it restricts it to hypothesis.

I’d say it’s more likely Homo Sapiens women are hussies, and will screw anything remotely human-like, as evidenced by some of the knuckle-dragging thugs I’ve seen my women friends date. :wink:

My guess is that there are more genetic similarities between Neanderthals and red-haired human populations than with other groups, but I had never heard that factoid before today.

Where the hell did this “Neandertals had red hair and freckles” meme come from, anyway?

Anyway, looking on actual fact, there are vast differences in bone structure, notably in the skull, around the eyes and jaw, as well as brain size. As I said, there no shred of evidence of any of these traits being found among their contemporaries, or evidence that interbreeding was even possible (given that Neandertal are expected to have longer periods of pregnancy etc)… there are probably a number of things that don’t fit, and absolutely nothing aside from proximity that does fit.

Never heard that before. Cite?

In Robert J. Sawyer’s Neanderthal Parallax trilogy (about the discovery of a parallel-universe Earth where humans went extinct and Neanderthals survived to develop a civilization), it turn out that the two species have different numbers of chromosomes, so interbreeding is impossible without genetic-engineering technology. (There’s absolutely no proof of that, of course, it’s just a plot device, but worth considering as a hypothesis.) The first volume, Hominids, won Sawyer the 2003 Hugo Award for Best Novel.

Um, off the top of my head, The Third Chimpanzee. I could look for others if you are one who finds Dr. Diamond untrustworthy, but I as I mentioned in another thread, I feel horrible, so it is movie and bed time after this post.

We of the Speckled-American community find this sort of sterotyping offensive. Be assured that when we take over, your name is on The List.

You can’t know, but it was one of the speculations that came up. I’ve heard it before, and it is possible. Or, they could have all been dark haired and swarthy (pirates anyone?).

I find myself rather puzzled at the whole neanderthal redhead thing…please correct me if I am wrong, but wasnt the neanderthal bony structure more robust that cromagnon? I do know the skull in the neanderthal is heavier and shaped mildly different from cromagnon…but whenI look at the stereotypical ‘true redhead’ I frequently see very gracile features - long slender faces, delicate bone structure, more ‘elfin’ if you want. I see the reconstructed neanderthals as more like Ron Perlman or Vin Diesel

Actually there is more archaelogical evidence than genetic evidence (evidence, not proof) for hybrids. Link

I read the New Scientist article, and IIRC, there was mention that this data might suggest Erectus/Sapiens hybrids, not Neaderthal/Sapiens.

See the link in my pervious post.

You are probably thinking of ideas postulated in the novel Dance of the Tiger. Speculate is the proper word as there is absolutely no actual evidence support the claim.

Screwing says nothing about the possiblility of producing viable offspring.

And is that a bad thing? Some people think Vin is sort of a hottie.