If he lived in Canada then the likelihood is that he would have had to wait for the same level of service.
He didn’t pay anything into a health system that he desires (and will be forced to pay into). He received a CAT Scan, two ultrasounds, an MRI, an upper GI, countless blood tests, a few x-rays, and a liver biopsy.
Keep reading. Where does he get a job that pays more?
‘It’s OK I make $11/hour’ does not mean that $11/hour is all the OP desires to make. There are no other jobs in his area that pay more.
Um, no.
If he lived in Canada, he would be paying into their universal health care system. He would have been able to get a doctor’s appointment before his tooth went completely septic, and he would have been given the correct antibiotics for the infection. He probably would have received counseling for his drinking and cigarette smoking.
The problem would have been solved long before it required a trip to the ER, a hospital stay, and perhaps $100K in bills.
Funny though - it seems he’s learned his lesson and given up both the booze and cigarettes. But I suppose it’s fine to keep pissing on him because he didn’t make the perfect choice every time.
Has it occurred to you the part of the drinking was because he was in pain? Or don’t you know that alcohol is a painkiller? Gee, a particular week he doesn’t have the money to go to a dentist but he can afford a fifth and kill the pain for an evening. Is that what happened? I don’t know, but it’s so much easier to regard drinking as a sin rather than self-medicating.
Yeah, he made more poor choices. Were those choices so horrific he deserved to suffer for months and wind up in the hospital thinking he was going to die from liver failure?
Seriously, people - if I had the money and knew someone needed to go to a dentist to get a tooth fixed I’d hand them $50 or $100 to help them out. I know this because back when I did have money to burn I would actually do that. Maybe I’m just a softy and don’t get my rocks off gleefully thinking about how those stupid poor bastards deserve to suffer and are getting what’s coming to them. Silly me, thinking it’s better to fix a problem when it’s relatively minor and cheap rather than letting it turn into an emergent catastrophe.
Judging by the reaction people had to a Doper who posted the story of how his drunk driving accident and subsequent surgery resulted in him needing a wheelchair to get around I’d say a lot of these folks would have zero sympathy and probably say he’d deserve worse.
There are some very harsh people in the this world. If you didn’t know that already a thread like this really brings it out.
I know people make bad choices and screw up with life, but I still don’t like to see anyone suffer unnecessarily or be maimed for life. Letting people suffer like that because they “deserve” it for their poor choices just makes it that much harder for those people to do better and make better choices next time.
Unlikely. As soon as he knew he had an infection he would have been able to be seen by a doctor without having to worry about cost. He would have gotten a complete round of fresh antibiotics appropriate for the infection. He wouldn’t have needed to wait for “the same level of service” because most likely it never would have gotten bad enough to NEED that level of service.
In Canada, this probably wouldn’t have gotten far enough to need a CAT scan, ultrasounds, MRI, upper GI, “countless” tests, and a liver biopsy.
You don’t get it - in Canada he probably wouldn’t have gotten that sick. That’s why Canada and Europe and Australia don’t need so many CAT scan and MRI machines - they don’t let as many small problems turn in catastrophes out of some bizarre sense that letting people get to death’s door before helping them is just desserts for being less than perfect human beings.
Even if he had been in Canada or Australia or the UK, if it had gotten that bad that he had to go to the Emergency room for treatment, then he probably wouldn’t have had to wait for the scans and tests and ultrasounds and so forth. If you turn up at the ER and it’s bad enough that you’re admitted, they do all of those tests and scans and so forth as a priority. Yes, as an outpatient you might have to wait - but as an outpatient you’re generally not in danger of losing your life either. As an inpatient you are a priority and you get the scans done as soon as possible, generally within a day or so of being admitted if not the same day.
Well, I do believe in UHC and I think people like the OP would still be entitled to it, regardless of how he got into his predicament.
I just don’t think he needs to be playing up his victimhood…as he seems to be doing by creating this thread. I don’t think he should be ashamed. I’m sure he thought he was doing what he had to do by taking other people’s antibiotics rather than trying to find a cheap option for his teeth problems (maybe he did, but he doesn’t say so in the OP). But I don’t think he should be expecting easy sympathy to come his way, especially around here. In fact, his situation is exactly what anti-UHC people hold up in support of their argument.
If people would only stop having children they can’t afford…
If people would stop engaging in expensive, high-risk behaviors…
If people would stop taking other people’s medications, like all the public service announcements tell us to do…
Then maybe he’d be able to afford care…and perhaps he wouldn’t even need it that often.
I hate that I’m sounding like the “other side”, but their voice is echoing in my head. When I opened the thread, I was all prepared to be, “Yeah, man! That sucks! Down with the establishment!” But I can’t because all I can think is, “You have three kids who depend on you and you’re blasting away on Bacardi?” And then talk about conservatives having fits of rage and spending trillions on wars? Yeah, I hate them, but I ain’t feeling a whole lot of love for you either."
It would be like if a single woman created a thread about how awful welfare reform is, and she talked about driving a Cadillac and eating steaks every week. It’s kind evokes the thought, “Yeah, we’re on the same political page and all, but I wish you weren’t the one trying to carry the banner here!”
I would be careful with this line of reasoning, phouka. Because I’d really hate for someone to look at yours, his, or my personal mistakes and conclude that I’m “sick” or “mentally deficient” or “damaged”. Because it really doesn’t take that much slick in the slope for those words to be morphed into “unfit parent”.
It may be true that a lot of people who shouldn’t be having kids ARE having them. I actually agree with this. But any argument for UHC is going to have to avoid this area completely. Not only because it will open up the question about society being financially dragged down by fucked-up people with intractable problems, but because it also opens up the question of how society plans on fixing this problem for the benefit of its bottom line. And contraceptives are only ONE approach. I’d hate for “mandatory sterilization for questionables” to become one of the bargaining chips progressives have to give to conservatives for UHC to be passed.*
*That it hasn’t happened in other countries with UHC is a relief, but the US does like to take a lead on things, doesn’t it?
I don’t understand what this has to do with Universal Healthcare (most of which isn’t supposed to go into effect until 2013), or how republicans somehow would have made sure this didn’t happen.
Medicaid (or whatever the correct term is now) has been available to people in need since at least the 70s (probably earlier but I didn’t know of it then). Republicans were in office (as president even) for a lot of those years, if they were going to stop healthcare for people in need (even idiots who drink themselves sick and take medicine not prescribed for them), wouldn’t they have done it by now?
Cite that he would have had to wait in Canada for emergency care? I know in Australia (a country with a system very like Canada’s) he would not have had to wait for emergency care. An elective procedure, sure, but not something that’s going to kill you.
Honestly, this pile on the OP is…quite disgusting, actually. We all pay taxes for things we don’t get immediate benefit for, and for things we would really rather not pay for. It sounds as though he’s had the wake up call he needed.
PPACA is not universal healthcare. (Hopefully it will come close, but it is not going to result in 100% coverage.)
Medicaid will not be available solely on the basis of poverty until 2014.
Until then, it is and has been a program for poor people who also qualify some other way, such as being disabled or under 18.
I thought he referred to medicaid in his post, I didn’t see where he’d states he received PPACA. Is that what the new healthcare bill is being referred to as? Based on the news and speeches by the administration, I thought it primarily (for now) dealt with providing insurance? (I don’t recall seeing the acronym before, but then, old age, bad memory :)).
As to the medicaid, the few times I’ve had it, it was exactly that 100%. The last time was 20 years ago though. Both times I used it, my income (or lack thereof rather) was indeed the basis for my eligibility.
I’m not sure where our OP is, but I bet that with an income of $11/hr, he makes too much for Medicaid, even if he isn’t disqualified by other means such as not being disabled, etc.
It’s one of the problems of being working poor–you may not make enough to quite squeak by, but you also make too much to qualify for a lot of the programs that could really help you get on your feet (or stay there in an emergency). At least that’s been my experience walking on the edge.
My mother recently had to take a course of antibiotics which are specific for intestinal infections, because they don’t get absorbed. Taking those will kill the bacteria in your guts, all the bacteria in your guts and nothing but the bacteria in your guts.
What’s going into effect in the US, a.k.a. “Obamacare”, is not the same sort of UHC as is in Canada, Europe, and Australia. It won’t cover everyone, just to start with, so you can’t even call it universal.
Single adults without children in their custody do not get Medicaid in most states, UNLESS it’s an emergency situation such as faced by the OP at hospitalization - it which case it usually becomes retroactive just for that, after the medical crisis is over the person lose the Medicaid and in medically uncovered again. It does not cover preventive care. An adult without a dependent child can’t get it to help cover a doctor or dentist appointment early on in the chain of events. Too many people just don’t know this: ** poverty alone does not make you eligible for Medicaid.** You can be completely destitute and still not qualify. No, it is NOT available to everyone in need. As a single adult without custody of his children the OP would NOT qualify for Medicaid in my state no matter how poor he was, as just one example.
Many states will put a person on Medicaid to cover just a hospitlization for something life-threatening, but the coverage will not occur before things get that bad, and typically won’t continue for anything outside the hospitilization. The exact parameters are dependent on the state in which the OP lives.
Lack of income is no longer what qualifies you. You now need to have less than $2,000 in assets and some additional qualifer to get it, like being under 18, disabled, pregnant (highly unlikely for the OP - he’s a guy, right?) and so on. The rules have changed from 20 years ago.
No other jobs in his area? OK, then relocate to some other area where there are some other jobs that pay more.. People do this all the time.
Unqualified for higher-paying jobs? OK, go out there and get qualified. Take out a student loan and attend school. Example, I’ve seen several times recently in the news that there is currently a shortage of certified welders out there.
Yeah, it’s that easy.
And if everyone did this, no one would be mowing your grass or flipping your burgers. And there would be no shortage of certified welders anymore, either.
Of course, he could do what a co-worker of mine does and do construction work on the weekends as an independent contractor. But man oh man, he better hope that the ladder he uses is a good one, that he has good aim whenever he uses a hammer, and that he knows how to safely operate chainsaws and stuff. Because if he gets injured doing his weekend job, then he’s really screwed.
My coworker has been doing this kind of work for thirty years…for a stretch it was the only income he received and now it’s a way of paying down credit card bills. He regularly talks about how all the homeless/underemployed guys could do like him and bust their asses doing the kind of shitty jobs he has taken on*, but he forgets that he actually has insurance from his day job to cover the various injurious he’s always accumulating. If I didn’t have insurance and I was already working an exhausting 9-to-5+, the last thing I’d want to do is push the envelop by doing work that could easily get me severely injured. Just so I can buy some insurance.
Now that would be a good story emphasizing the need for UHC. Someone who goes the extra mile to make enough money to get coverage, but the “extra mile” is the thing that sends him to the hospital.
*He also takes for granted that he has numerous “good ole boy” contacts that a random homeless dude wouldn’t have. If I need carpentry work, of course I’m going to call him because I know him and know he’s “good people”. Can’t say the same for guy on the road with a “Will work for a food” sign.
Hoo boy - yeah, I’ve been doing construction work as an independent contractor, too.
It’s not just insurance - in many cases there is an issue of “can this person be trusted?” If one of the people on the job site causes major damage or steals something that can result in all sorts of really big problems for everyone else working the jobsite, and especially for whoever is heading up the project. Can a homeless guy pass a background check?
Of course, people who make poor life choices often can not be expected to respond appropriately to a medical problem. See this little story.
Nowhere did I say it was easy; just possible. Moving to a new town is a bitch, and so is scraping together the resources to attend school. And yet, people do this. If you want something badly enough, you bust your ass to get it. I would think the misery of a chronic tooth infection and the associated hospitalization would be a strong motivation to say “shit, my current situation sucks; I gotta do something to build a better life.”
Want to see it in action? Go watch Pursuit of Happyness. Yes, that’s the Hollywood version, but it has its roots in the real story of a guy whose life was a mess and who busted his ass to make things better.
Only a pessimist says “nothing can be done about it.”