I’d be interestd to know how many of the ‘America is real diverse’ proponents have travelled.
My point is that I, an American from another part of America, would feel uncomfortable and out of place and they would feel uncomfortable in a group of people from where I live. That is a cultural difference.
And I think deep, diametrically opposed politics are a sign of cultural differences. What are politics, but a way to order our lives and isnt’ ordering our lives what culture is all about?
Hmm. Still, “uncomfortable” feelings aside, a person from San Fransisco could still function (hold a job, maintain a household or a buisness, have expectations of, and familiarity with, the local laws) in Chattanooga Tennessee.
If you drop me into western China, I am a dead duck. I dont speak the lingo, I dont know their laws and values, customs, and so on.
IMO, the US has an overlaying “culture” and value systems we share (more or less), such as valuing democracy versus authoritarian government systems, individual rights that protect them form the government (“Innocent until proven guilty”, miranda rights, warrants, etc.), freedom to choose where we live and work (within the framework of our own talents), consumer protectionism, and so on.
Underneath that overall framework are the “lesser tier” values, such as cuisine, fashion, and music preferences, religion, politics, etc.
In trying to answer the OP’s question “How culturally uniform is the US?”, it depends on how tight you want to focus the microscope…
Or London or Dublin or Alberta or Sidney.
Familiarity with local laws, I wouldn’t agree with. I would quickly get in trouble in LA, San Francisco, Chicago, NY (much of the Eastern Seaboard probably), because I don’t know their local laws.
My one trip to rural Illinois was a shock - them people ain’t right with their soybeans and all the churches and hard liquor in gas stations and stopping at yellow lights.
I have trouble just understanding people from Philly, parts of Louisiana, and the “South” where call centers seem to congregate. Not hardly speaking the same language.
I think I’m beginning to understand why so many people that I meet from the East and California appear so intent on changing the Denver area to be like where they’re from - They want cultural uniformity, they crave it, and perhaps they believed that the US is culturally uniform and it offends them to discover that it isn’t.
An ex-coworker from Maryland never did figure out this part of the country, and ended up moving back because she didn’t get it. She was unable to function long-term with our laws and attitudes and etc.
Her poor little head would have exploded if she ever got outside the city, I’m sure.
You have more familiarity with those laws than you realise. You realise, for example, that walking around with a concealed handgun is either illegal, or it requires a permit. You realise that you are entitled to a lawyer when arrested. You realise that you have the right to sue to redress a (perceived) wrong. You realise that trespassing may have legal (and practical) repurcussions. And so on.
Another point in favor of the deep cultural differences are the instances of domestic terrorism such as the bombing of he Olympics, OK City and abortion clinics (some of those were the same guy as the Olympics, granted), but here you have people who have reached the conclusion that they cannot work within the system and must resort to terror bombings. On the other side you eco-terrorism. Granted, these terrorists probably aren’t in great numbers, they never are, but the rely on the support of a broader sub-culture that tacitly supports or at leasts understands their actions.
I remember in 2004, there was talk about the religous miracles performed by Bush including healing a girl who had lost the ability to speak and the divine intervention of the ballot count in Florida. I have to tell you, I really don’t feel I have much culturally incommon with those people.
Do you have a cite for this? Outside of hardcore churchgoing folk, I would not characterize the Black people I know professionally, socially, or in my family as overwhelmingly opposing gay marriage. I have a very large circle of friends and family from all across the nation and various SES and educational levels. I know that many Black clergy have made statements, but clergy making statements and the congregation doing as the pastor says are two different things.
Again, outside of very religious people I know, I don’t think most of the Black people I encounter are terribly agitated one way or another about gay marriage. I think most people are in a live-and-let-live mindset. I do not know of any Black person who voted Republican because of their opposition to same-sex marriage. There is a sizable Black LGBT population that is quite vocal about the importance of same-sex marriage. I think a lot of Black folks are offended by the comparison of the gay rights movement to the civil rights movement. Personally I don’t really completely understand why, but I think it comes down to some people’s perception that sexual orientation can be hidden while race cannot. (I don’t agree, just putting out the rationale I’ve heard.)
But how representative are you of even of that part of American you’re from? I don’t doubt you’re more representative of that part of America than you are of rural Arkansas, but you may still not be part of the majority. You live in DC, if I recall correctly, a city where almost all the white people are from somewhere else. Have those people gone to DC to escape the culture of their native states? Some of them – let’s say, those who live around Dupont Circle – probably have, but most of them are just looking for opportunity, or have ended up there somewhat accidentally – because of a spouse or a job or a university.
To me this internal migration seems like the norm in this country, not the exception. In fact, I’m motivated to ask, at least for at least the SDMB, if that’s true. Look for a poll on the subject in IMHO.
I’m kinda flattered anyone remembers anything about me. Yes we do live in DC (or my wife does, I’m in Baghdad). I grew up in a neighboring state and moved into the city when I bought a house. I don’t know how typical or atypical that makes me. I’m off to bed though, off to ponder the cultural differences here in Babylon.
Note, However, that Liberal did not claim that “blacks” opposed gay marriage, but that within the perimeters of a number of very “liberal” cities are populations of blacks whose religious beliefs are in conflict with a general left-wing orientation on that particular topic:
One potential Democratic loss could come from black voters, 58% of whom say they would not consider voting for a candidate who doesn’t share their views on the issue of gay marriage.
Note that the claim is not that no blacks support gay rights, only that a substantial portion of the black community does not favor gay marriage.
On a side note, I thought you were headed home, no?
But aren’t those generalities also true in London, Sydney, etc? With a broad enough brush, the TV watching English-speaking world is culturally uniform.
That kinda was my point. There are uniformities, and there are differences (or sub-cultures, if you will), in the US.
What the OP is asking about depends on how much “weight” you wish to give those differences.
For example: I am a finniky eater, but just because you may prefer to eat sushi (which I cant stomach) does not mean to me that we are from different cultures, because, to me, those are personal preferences, not culture. You may disagree, and that’s fine. (I won’t fight about it, unless you take a swing at me…)
Those broad generalities I mentioned before are indeed a culture, IMO. A Euro-American one, I guess. There are some broad generalities that the majority of the citizens of the US share.
One week from tomorrow and I’m already celebrating (hic).
Be careful out there.
Call me a pessimist, but yes, I do think the US is pretty darned culturally uniform. At least, if you take “culture” to mean things such as what people wear, what they eat, where they shop, what music they listen to, how they celebrate, etc. (Attitudes can be pretty different.) My impression is that the uniformity is fairly recent. Throughout most of the country, you can drive through small or medium sized towns that have hallmarks of a distinctive culture (through the architecture, institutions, etc.) but these places are largely deserted. Keep driving through town, though, and you’ll hit a street with a WalMart, a mall, a multiplex, infinite number of chain restaurants. This place is always packed, and it’s always the same street no matter where you go in the country. Drive a little further on and you’ll see new-ish suburban divisions that are also pretty darn similar to every other suburban division.
Lately, I should add, I’ve found some slight hope for cultural diversity in this country. The same mass media that brought about our cultural homogeneity may also be its undoing. Before when there were only 3 or 4 TV channels that everyone watched, everyone who wanted to watch TV was tuned into the common, trans-national culture. Now that there are several hundred channels, there’s may be more room for local cultures to breathe. So, the South can watch the Blue Collar Comedy Tour while New England watches…Antique Road Show (?), and California watches whatever it is they watch.
FWIW, I think cultural homogeneity has come a long way in Europe as well. It’s not nearly as advanced as in the US, of course – linguistic differences and more deeply rooted cultures have slowed the process. But consider that 100 years ago there were still Germans wearing Lederhosen and Parisians wearing berets. Nowadays young Europeans all wear pretty much the same style of clothes, listen to similar types of music (or even the exact same music), use the same currency, watch most of the same movies, watch many of the same TV shows (or versions of the same TV shows), and mostly speak the same second language. And on and on. If it wasn’t for the physical reminders of older, more culturally diverse ages (ie all the castles and cathedrals and ancient cities, etc.) that visibly separate the European countries, Europe would seem a lot, lot more homogeneous to us.
It’s not hard to find. A huge number of blacks are churchgoing, and they vote. Black churches are, in fact, a mainstay of (especially Democratic) political campaigns. Worldwide, opposition to gay rights in general is especially widespread in Islamic countries and Africa.
Whether you like or don’t like sushi is of course a personal preference. but there are also lots of cultural differences, based on all sorts of different cultures. It doesn’t mean that because I’m from NYC I won’t be able to function in Alabama. Of course I’ll be able to function, just as I’d be able to function if I moved to London or Sydney. It would be the little things- like the way I get honked at whenever I leave the city ( we don’t have right-on-red, so I forget to turn ) But there’s lots of little ,everyday, things that would be different
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local food- I’m not talking about whether a particular person likes it or not - certainly, not everyone in Rochester, NY likes the “garbage plate”, but I’ve never seen anything like it anywhere else. I’d be willing to bet that every region of the country has some sort of regional food, cuisine or style of serving a food which isn’t found easily in the other regions.
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laws- Sure, constitutional things like having the right to a lawyer are the same everywhere. Basic things like stealing, assault and murder, too Other things, not so much. For example
The person who wrote this probably doesn’t realize that open carry is illegal and possession (even in your home) of a firearm without a permit is illegal in NYC. And so are fireworks.
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a variety of questions for which the answers appear to depend on location, ethnicity or some other subculture. For example-
Is it polite to ask guests to remove their shoes? Is it rude for someone to park in front of my house? Are children automatically invited to a wedding? Is it acceptable to collect money for someone who's had a death in the family? Is it okay to take your kids out of school to go on vacation? Is cash an acceptable wedding gift?
That was me, and I did realise that it was illegal in NYC (but it’s ok in the rest of the state). District of Columbia too. sigh My point is that due to a greater overlying culture in the US, some things will carry over. (Like our expectation of some form of consumer protection rights.)
What’s interesting is that a lot of these questions are found in books in the “etiquette” category. But where is the dividing line between culture and etiquette?
There is, in my opinion, a general overlying American culture, with tons and tons of sub-cultures mixed in just to keep things hopping.
There isn’t a dividing line. Etiquette is just one component of culture.
I don’t disagree. I’m just not so sure the general American culture makes us more uniform than the general European culture makes Europeans.