Let me restate: I have no problem with teachers engaging in porn for any misguided morality code, I simply believe it would disrupt student learning.
Evidence? I have none. But, I can imagine myself as a preadolescent in class after watching porn shots of the teacher in front of me, and being distracted by that.
Most aren’t paid sufficiently though. Not enough for lower standards of conduct either. And I would describe it as a large majority of teachers are underpaid in primary and secondary education here in the US. So in light of that how do you feel about the matter of teachers engaging with OnlyFans to supplement their income?
On a side note, when I was growing up in the 60s everyone knew a kid who went to another school where one of the teachers had posed in Playboy magazine.
You are making an analogy between doing something on OnlyFans and pedophilia or robbing banks?
You lost the plot mate.
And in my imagination, having been an adolescent male myself, it wouldn’t make any difference if I watched random porn, teacher porn, or just used my imagination while feeling horny, in class. Especially now when I can get any porn I want at any time. As a preadolescent, I doubt I would have cared at all.
I mean, this is classic begging the question. We can’t let this happen because it disrupts the kids. Do we have any evidence of that? Can we get access to grades or test scores before and after the kids found out about this (unfortunately, we probably don’t have enough data for after-the-fact.) I’d entertain the idea the kids do better in attractive teachers classes (and apparently there are studies showing just that, just not with the porn angle.) No, it’s just moral policing, plain and simple. And some people are fine with that, and I understand. I just don’t agree with it.
Some innate prudishness still has me thinking teachers engaging in porn is not quite right, but I’m not sure my vague personal feelings - or anyone else’s - ought to be sufficient basis alone for judging someone incapable of performing their job. I know “whataboutism” is not a great rhetorical device, but there are so many other behaviors that could be considered to “set a poor example.” Say a teacher is arrested for public intoxication, or DWI - or any number of other crimes/offenses. Or they pose provocatively while scantily clad - but not naked. Or they post profane, sex-related, or other non-hate speech. Or they publicly advocate legal marijuana use.
For that matter - how do we define porn? Nudity alone? Lingerie/bikinis? Naked with sexual acts? I’ve never been on OnlyFans, but my impression is that some of it falls in the category of “softcore”, with less than full nudity and overt sex acts.
Like I said, I think it ill-advised for an educator to post porn, but I don’t think it establishes that they are incapable of teaching. Nor can I come up with any workable standard.
For those who say “porn” is fireable - seriously, how do you phrase a workable standard? And are there fireable behaviors other than “porn”?
This is somewhat similar to workplace dress codes. You would like to think that it would be sufficient to say, “Dress appropriately/professionally.” But you run the risk of each employee defining those terms how they wish. If you don’t say, for example, “no skirts above the knee,” you end up with entirely subjective, “That skirt is too short.” How important is it to the core elements of that job/workplace to enforce what degree of standards?
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So, we have 2 data points: 1 = distracted; 1 = not distracted. Both valid, as far as I know.
Yes, as far as anecdotes or feelings, of course both are valid. But, especially here on the SDMB, we have shown many times how anecdotes and common wisdom often don’t correspond to reality. Without solid data, it’s impossible to show who is right, and I’m going to give people the benefit of a doubt as a rule rather than fire them for what I just “feel” will impact academic performance. Were they good teachers in the classroom? Then I feel it’s a shame to dismiss them. But, once again, I don’t think this has anything to do with academics.
I don’t believe the teachers involved should be fired. I think they should be warned, and asked to take down the online photos.
That would be a more reasonable halfway point, I will say.
Wow, I can’t believe how much fun this thread turned out to be! I sincerely want to thank everyone who’s chimed in, because you all have great points of view – even when they’re 180 degrees from each other.
All your opinions have helped me edge closer to the MYOB camp – that schools have no business firing teachers for moonlighting in porn unless they’re violating a very specifically defined rule that was in place beforehand. Which the Missouri teachers clearly weren’t.
Data point: As a high school freshman I was frequently distracted by my Spanish teacher’s nipples protruding slightly through her sweater. If I’d been able to go home and watch porn with her in it, I might have lost my mind entirely. However …
All that said … I’ve advocated on these boards for disregarding job applicants if they support Trump on social media. In my mind that’s far more immoral than posting homemade porn, but it just goes to show how fluid these definitions can get.
That’s not what I said. And, even if it was, a sarcastic reply wouldn’t show it to be wrong.
What I said was this: the only reason that kids make a big deal out of this is because their parents and other adults in society do. It is specifically the outrage that these people have that turns it into a big deal for the kids. My evidence was other examples of sexualization that blows over when adults don’t make a big deal out of it. Even if it’s not as sexual, you would expect it to be just be less distracting, but it completely becomes a non-issue.
Sure, I’ll agree with you that kids are immature. And I agree that, after a certain age, they are very into sex-related things. But they also tend to move on the the next thing rather quickly.
I don’t buy that this is not a moral issue. Every time these stories come out, there is a clear moral tinge on all of it, arguing that it’s horrible that the teacher is doing this, that it says something bad about her. Just like all those other things like being divorced, marrying someone of a different color, being gay, etc.
It’s usually parents making a big deal that leads to the officials reacting. Or the officials themselves. I can’t think of a single time where there’s actually any example of this disruption that resulted in the firing.
People want to say they’re not doing it for any moral reason? Then show the receipts. Show me that this isn’t like all the other things that teachers would get fired for that they don’t know, and still don’t cause disruptions. Show you’ve actually tried to let the teacher stay, but that they couldn’t do their job.
Because everything I’m seeing points to it being because they believe that the teacher’s actions are wrong, and the rest is just justification.
Well, there was the recent story of the Orange is the New Black actress who caused X to erupt in gleeful contempt after she made public her two recent enthusiasms: supporting Trump (which she somehow claimed was a “punk” thing to do), and engaging in oral/anal eroticism with her married lover. She was dragged pretty heavily for that. I just hope she insisted on a shower before the latter activity, and took a long hot one after the former. MAGAlingus should be kept to oneself, IMHO.
So much for what I said a few minutes ago about everyone contributing such outstanding points of view! 
Given the recent digressions about “what if one if the students found the teacher’s porn video?” and distractions and attractive teachers etc, I think it’s important to point out that IMHO it’s not about that at all. It’s about the fact that the teacher thought this was a good idea, and what that says about their values.
If some teachers are literally prostituting themselves because they’re not being adequately paid – and indeed in a great many places they’re not – that’s an entirely different issue. There’s an obvious answer to that problem, and setting up a pornography business on the side is not it.
I, for one, have no problem with the porn industry, or sex work in general. In fact, I have a close family member who worked in a well-known legal brothel in Nevada for a time. When she told me of her plans, my only concern was for her safety, but she assured me they had great security. She made a lot of money in a short period of time, then quit and went back to college.
Heck, I’d have taken a job at the brothel myself, but apparently there isn’t much demand for geriatric guys.
Yes, but teachers aren’t hired to teach “values.” Parents are hired for that (and many are pretty bad.)
Teachers are required to be professional. That’s good character within a certain arena, the workplace. We don’t, can’t, and shouldn’t require them to hold other values, and we couldn’t police them if they did.
In the USA, “values” is often code for “religious values,” which is probably why that word sets off alarm bells for me.
This is like everything else… those who stick up in any way get hammered down. And teachers are under more scrutiny for what others believe they should do and how they should behave. So they tend to get hammered down for less, and get hammered down harder for it.
Your beer example is a great one; some bluenose Baptist probably had it in his head that alcohol was bad, so in his mind, since teachers are one of the primary role models for kids they should be held to a higher standard, and seeing your teacher drinking a beer violated his personal idea of what is and isn’t appropriate.
And my biggest problem is more that while I as a regular white collar worker am mostly immune to retribution to whatever I do outside of my workplace, provided it’s not criminal or egregiously involving my employer, teachers aren’t afforded that same privilege. If they’re not going to extend that privilege, they (school districts) need to codify what is and isn’t acceptable out-of-classroom behavior in a concise and clear fashion. No “moral turpitude” type catch-all clauses or nonsense like that. Right now, it’s neither a privilege that’s extended to them, nor codified in a way that makes it clear that this might be a fireable-type thing either. That’s a weird place to be as an employee.
If you look at the snippet from the school board code of conduct that I quoted, it’s evident that they absolutely are. And the fact that parents are often pretty bad at it is precisely why it’s important.
Yes, but the fact that the lunatic right has appropriated certain words and phrases as dog whistles isn’t necessarily a reason to avoid them or question their traditional meaning in legitimate contexts. I’m certainly not talking about religious values here, but about basic secular moral character.
I’m idly curious how you’d feel if the teacher had been hired to teach ethics.
Is there something unethical about Only Fans? Why would I care? I don’t even think there’s anything “secularly immoral” about OF.