How do you compare standards of living across generations?

Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share
1

This morning I was reading a letter from my uncle, describing his youth in a smallish city in Iowa in the 1930s-40s. Compared to today, it reads like something from “Little House on the Prairie” - or at least “A Christmas Story.” Tho they knew they were poor, the felt fortunate that their father - a mail carrier - had a steady job.

It made me compare my youth, and that of my children/grandchildren. And I wondered if we were doing better or worse - however you define that - than prior generations.

I and my 3 sisters were raised in a Chicago bungalow in the 1950s-60s. My dad always had a good job, but I have no idea how much he earned. We felt we were well off compared to our neighbors/schoolfellows. My parents regularly drove us to Florida for vacations, and periodically took us to plays and concerts. But my dad always drove a company car that he parked on the street - as we had no garage. Our bungalow was well maintained - but it WAS a bungalow. 1 and 1/2 baths. Only one shower. I remember when we all had to get bathed and dressed to go somewhere, my dad and I would hook a hose up to the slop sink in the unfinished basement, run it over some pipes and “shower” down there. And when I see photos of us, we all wore hand me downs. We look like street urchins. But - like I said - we felt we were well off.

So how do I compare the standard of living I provided my children to the prior generations? After a modest starter home, we lived in a house that was not ostentatious, but was considerably larger than my parents’. And we lived in the burbs instead of the city. My parents sent all of us to public schools and state colleges - as we did our 3 kids.

All 3 of our kids are gainfully employed - 2 earning considerably more than the 3d. But the 2 higher earning couples have no kids. All 3 are in longterm relationships and own homes.

So how do you really compare whether you are better or worse off than your parents/grandparents?

I’m thinking things have been pretty steady across the most recent 3 generations of my wife and me, our parents, and our children. How about you?

2

This is a very difficult comparison to make, as tastes, opportunities, customs, and more change a lot between generations. My father had a grade 8 education, which was what most male Canadians had up to the 1950s–it was standard, normal, etc. No such thing as a cell phone, but now it may well be considered essential—how do we factor that into the calculations?
The renaissance economic historian John Munro suggested looking at the income of a skilled worker as a benchmark for comparisons over time. In Canada in the 1860s, an income of $400/year would let a skilled male worker–printer, railway engineer, carpenter–support a family nicely. Today, what “nicely support” means is a lot different, but in parts of Canada, it might mean $80-90,000/year.

3

I believe that previous generations were more content. They did not feel the need compete with the Joneses down the street or across town based upon the possessions they owned.

I believe that current generations are more likely to spend beyond their means when compared to past generations. Consumer advertising and easier access to consumer credit contribute to this. People are less likely to wait until they can better financially afford such purchases. Consumer credit has risen consistently over the past 50 years, with the exception after the great recession, but picked up steam again a few years after.

Similarly, personal bankruptcies in the US have been on a steady rise over the last 50 years.

The American Dream of owning a house and a car, has turned into much more including lavish vacations, designer clothes, (even for your kids), everyone feels that they deserve to live, or at least look like they are wealthy, even if they aren’t.

4

One thing to note is that this is during the Depression and into the war years so I’m sure that they were indeed aware that they were exceptionally fortunate that their father had a steady and reliable job.

To echo others I’m not sure how to even compare standards of living across generations. Additionally standards of living in rural, agricultural-dependent communities would vary greatly from those in urban areas. And even within those areas different people had different standards.

In, say, rural Montana in 1950 there would likely be two or more generations living in one house. Oftentimes children would share not only bedrooms but beds. A well-equipped house would have a coal or oil - fired heat source and a sibgle bathroom. This was normal and expected. Property ownership was what was important, as farmers who owned their own property had much more control over their profits.

Today the idea of 2 generations of one family living in a one-bath house with young siblings sharing beds is almost emblematic of our cultural idea of poverty. Today a high standard of living is having multiple vehicles, nice clothes, the latest iPhone, taking expensive vacations, and qualifying for ever-increasing amounts of debt.

So how do you compare them? It’s not an apples to apples comparison.

5

I realized after posting that you said much the same as I did, but better.

Really, I think Omar_Little nailed it.

6

When were these previous generations? Austen novels (1810s) have people comparing themselves with neighbors based on their possessions. The actual phrase “Keep Up With the Joneses” is itself 100 years old. When are you placing the time that people weren’t doing this?

7

I’m referring to early 20th century United States actual people similar to those described by the OP, not Jane Austen characters of a fictional British gentry, a period in which roughly half of the British population were illiterate.

Your comparison is the same as saying that the US population in the late 1960’s was 4/7 male and 3/7 female, 2/7 in the maritime industry, 2/7 wealthy beyond imagine, 1/7 very scientific, 1/7 in show business, and 1/7 from a farming community.

8

Human nature does not change.

Now, there may have been a somewhat larger percentage of contented (at least outwardly-contented) people back then, simply because most people were outwardly religious and went to church, and thus would have been familiar with the biblical admonitions to be contented, not to covet, etc. But there would have been lots and lots of people who did in fact covet, scheme, and so forth.

9

I think to decide if you did better than your parents or if your kids are doing better than you, you can’t look at things like new technology and say “I have a higher standard of living than Grampa because he had only three channels of TV and I’ve got eleventy billion channels and six streaming services.” You have to do exactly what was mentioned in the OP -compare both times( and places) to the surrounding society.

I’m a little younger than you, @Dinsdale , but probably not much. I grew up in the 60s-70s - and I can tell just by the OP that the family I grew up in had a lower standard of living than the one you grew up in. My parents also had four children - we had one bathroom for the six of us, and my two sisters and I shared a single bedroom. I went on one vacation before I was old enough to pay for one myself - and the only reason for that one was because my grandmother wanted to take us on a vacation before she died. No plays, no concerts, maybe a drive-in movie or two a year. My parents didn’t send us to college - we could live at home without paying room and board, but we had to come up with tuition ourselves. I was the oldest of three girls and still mostly wore hand-me-downs from a cousin. Any activities that involved buying equipment would have been the cheapest possible equipment - and only what was necessary. If my brother’s baseball team had shared bats for everyone to use , my parents would not have bought him one. Gloves weren’t shared, so they would have bought the cheapest one possible - if they couldn’t get a hand-me-down.

So it’s really easy for me to see that my husband and I have a higher standard of living than my parents ever did. First, we live in a single-family house *. The bedroom situation is different because I have only two kids so they each have their own and I’m not 100% sure if I would have upgraded if I had more kids. We went on at least two vacations and a couple of weekend trips every year. They engaged in multiple activities and the quality of the equipment depended on their interest and talent , not just the price. I gave each of them a car - one when I bought a new one and one when my husband did. My parents couldn’t afford to give anyone a car - if it was still running, they were still driving it. We paid my daughter’s tuition for a bachelor’s and master’s degree and my son’s for an associate’s.

My daughter- she and her husband are apparently doing even better. They have a three bedroom house and two kids. She hasn’t worked since Sept 2020 when her job wanted everyone to go back in-office and they are talking about remodeling the house and adding a couple of more bedrooms - something I couldn’t have dreamed of at 32.

* My parents lived on the second floor of my grandparent’s two-family house. Which was better than the second floor of someone else’s two family house , but I owned a house before they did.

10

It IS from the early 20th century United States.

Keeping up with the Joneses - Wikipedia

11

Ms. P and I came from different socioeconomic classes, so the answer is more complicated in our case. My family was definitely working class. We had a working farm, so vacations were rare. We qualified for food stamps some years, but didn’t need them since most of our food came from the farm. We’re definitely better off than my parents were. My wife’s parents are at least upper middle class. They helped pay for our son to attend an expensive college, which has worked out very well for him. They’ve helped our daughter as well, as she has struggled to make a go of college. They give us sizeable checks on birthdays and Christmas/Hanukkah. My parents offer the emotional support my inlaws aren’t capable of. My wife feels closer to my parents than hers.

Kids aren’t likely to live more comfortably than we do. Daughter wants to work in the business/distribution end of the film industry. She’d probably be happy living in a small apartment. Son wants to write for tv/movies. A well known screenwriter (as in multiple Emmy awards and an Oscar nomination has told him that his work is better than some professionals he’s worked with, so he definitely has the talent. However, LA is expensive.

12

Your parents grew up in a time when children died of scarlet fever and smallpox (and other diseases) and were paralyzed by polio, and when more than 1 in every 20 child born died before his or her first birthday. By the standards of 1920 or 1930 or so, we’re doing really well.

13

ive said before that there are things that’s considered normal today that were luxuries even back in the 80s

Like 2 or more good cars usually, moms car was dads rustbucket that eked out a few more years before dad traded up again Now mom can buy her own car with the payments in her name from her account Or 2 phone lines… when I had a 2nd phone line installed in my room before cable/DSL to go online the phone installer thought I was wealthy In fact even tho my first PC was a Walmart packbell POS she was amazed I owned one since a 486 4 meg of ram VGA ran about 1200 and up

Now everyone has one same with TVs when I was a kid my first tv was a kmc black and white tv bought at a yard sale so I could play atari …Now everyone has wide screens in the house and buy the old CRT TVs at thrift stores and yard sales to play everything from the ps2 on down …

I remember when people were agahst at someone needing anything over a 2 bedroom house and having a 2nd bathroom with a tub and or shower in each one was luxe

Now people with no kids own 4 bedrooms 2 bath houses and anything smaller that that is for the poors or old people who don’t want a big house to clean after they retire

In fact I remember when retirement was a rare thing in its self

14

I disagree. My mother used to tell the story of a family in her town (in the '30’s) that would have this elaborate Christmas for the kids, then return all the presents after the neighbors saw what they’d been given. Of course, everyone apparently knew what they were doing, so it didn’t show the parents in a good light.

My mother was one of 11 and my father one of 6. They shared rooms and beds with their siblings. My maternal grandfather was a Detroit cop in the Depression, when they paid the cops in local scrip instead of currency. They usually had relatives living with them, because at least my grandfather had a job. My paternal grandfather owned a church-goods store and did quite well, but they didn’t live lavishly. My parents started with a small starter house and graduated up from there. There were 5 of us kids and we shared bedrooms and sometimes beds. I never married and own my home. My siblings are a mixed bag, financially. Some never figured out how to stay in a job and save, some worked hard and managed reasonably well. My nieces and nephews aren’t likely to do terribly well, except for one. Most of my nieces and nephews (not coincidentally) come from the siblings that never managed their money.

StG

15

Our pie is so much bigger and tastier than our parents’ that it doesn’t matter much how big my piece is vs my neighbors’. The “standard” in standard of living has improved.

16

I use the Inflation Calendar.

As you can see, it is very easy to use. I keyed in the amount of money about which I was curious (my yearly net income), chose a start year, and then an end year. Voila, I’d of been a rich chick! LOL

Twenty years earlier than that (1950), it would have been worth $775,092.70.

17

This reminds me of a story my now-95 year old mother told me. Back in the 90s she was visiting one of those living museums where they recreate homes from periods across history. She was standing in an old Victorian terrace, with one wooden chair and a rag rug in front of the fire, when the well-dressed older woman next to her said ‘ah, but they were happier then’, and my Mum turned round and said ‘You might have been but I bloody wasn’t’.

Point is, My mother grew up in the 1930s, an RAF brat living in basic accommodation with vinyl floors and no central heating, whilst her grandparents lived in a damp medieval house with gas lighting downstairs and candles in the bedrooms. She’s now comfortably middle-class and has NO romantic ideas about those years. She always says the war years were restrictive, the food was awful, and life was actually quite boring as nobody had any money to actually do anything aside from knit cardigans.

There’s a certainly a debate to be had about consumerism and its impact on society, but I think it’s a mistake to have romantic ideas about the past. It’s what old people do on Facebook groups because their favourite greengrocers has become an organic plastic free food emporium.

18

My mom was born in 1934. The household she grew up in consisted of her parents, her dad’s youngest brother, her mom’s sister and youngest brother, and her two younger brothers. She said at one point, she was sharing a bed with her aunt because she had to. Oh, and my grandfather was the only one working for a period of time. They lived in a row house in east Baltimore. Mom had to argue with her dad to be allowed to go to high school - he didn’t see the point.

I was born in '54. In '56, I had a sister and Mom was pregnant with my brother when my folks bought their first house (with the help of an uncle) in the Baltimore suburbs. It was an end row house with one of the bigger yards in the neighborhood. By '65, I had 2 more sisters, so 7 of us were in a 3/2, 1000 sq ft house until I left in '73. For most of the time, we had one car, so Mom had a wagon that she pulled to the grocery store. When I was in elementary school, she started making some extra money by doing alterations for several women, and one year, she made and sold Barbie clothes.

I figured we were solid middle class, but looking back now, we were definitely lower on the economic scale. But we never went hungry and we always had heat and decent clothes, and we’d take occasional road trips to visit relatives in PA and WV. One year we even spent a few days at the ocean in a hotel!!!

I bought my first house when I was 27 and my second at 29 (yep, I owned 2 at once.) When I got married, we bought a waterfront house in Florida. We had only one daughter, and we were able to let her participate in different activities, and she got to go to summer camp several years. We planned ahead, and between our savings, her scholarship, and her part time jobs, she was able to graduate college without any student loans. But here’s where things changed.

My husband and I are now retired, and between our SS, my pension, and the investments our financial guy set up for us, we’ve got a very comfortable income. My daughter and her husband bought their first house a couple of years ago, with our help, and they’re scraping by. Having 2 kids has a bit to do with it. SIL has a part-time job (he’s not the most ambitious of men) and our daughter is teaching at a small private school, so not making much at all (tho she plans to seek a better job at the end of the school year.) Honestly, I don’t see them matching our standard of living until we die and leave her everything, and depending on our health and the economy, everything might not be much.

The grandkids are still pre-school, so who knows what’s in store for them.

19

I’ve been thinking about this, and think money is only one part of it. I think you would need to consider multiple factors. Perhaps you could calculate bell curves for your community concerning income/wealth, education, and health/life expectancy, you could plot where you sit on those scales.

For me:

Grandparents - no college, middle class (police officer/postman), 3/4 died before 70

Parents - 2/4 college grad, upper middle class, 2/4 died in mid-late 70s, 1/4 young 80s, 1/4 92

My generation - post grad degrees, upper middle class, currently healthy in young 60s

Children - college/grad degrees, middle-upper middle class, healthy in young 30s

As I look at that, I’d say my parents did somewhat better than their parents on all 3 measures, but I’m not able to say there was a huge difference between my parents, my wife and me, and our kids.

I don’t think things like improved health care or new technology renders such comparisons difficult. Instead, the question is whether you had access to the health care and tech available at that time. So today, everyone has a cell phone. Did your parents have a TV? Radio? Car?

20

Thank you. You said this better than I could.

From younger relatives I’ve occasionally encountered the whine: “But in the 60s your family could live on one income…”. Then I point out to the complainer that he can too.

The house I grew up in is in a small midwestern town. It sold last year for $33,000 (I just checked). If he wants to live in a 3 BR 1 bath house with no air conditioning, no dishwasher, no cable, and a single land-line phone he can manage it easily. He’ll need to drive an old stick-shift with no air conditioner or any luxuries, and his wife can stay home with the kids like my Mom did. There’s a UPS facility a few miles away, they’re hiring right now (I just checked this too), and will provide a driver with $23.00/hour, full benefits and vacation. He and his family can live exactly like we did on a single, uneducated truck driver salary. A back of the envelope calculation puts income around $48K/year which is substantially above that of my parent’s household at the time (adjusting for inflation). So it’s easily do-able.

Now if he insists on 4 BRs, 3 baths, a multi-car garage with new(-ish) cars for everyone in the family, nice furniture, central air, cable/streaming for 4 wide-screen TVs, built-in dishwasher, disposal, high-end smart phones for everyone along with expensive meals out and tropical vacations while living in a large urban city – then you’re describing an entirely different lifestyle. And it’s ludicrous to expect that lifestyle to happen on a typical single-earner’s income. It can’t now, and it never could.

The “standard” of living today is light-years from that of the 60s. But if you want it, you’ll need to expend a lot more effort in the form of education/training/preparation, with both spouses working full time, going into substantially more debt – and likely never retire (or at least work many more years than in the past).