I’m a straight guy who doesn’t mind when gay men hit on me. Doesn’t happen much now that I’m married (the ring’s a giveaway), but one of my gay friends mock-flirts with me regularly. I think it’s fun and speaks to a level of trust and comfort.
This might sound a little strange, but there’s definitely a part of me that hopes, when my wife and I get around to reproducing, that one of our kids winds up gay or lesbian, just so I can be exactly the sort of loving and supportive parent not enough gay/lesbian kids have. I know that’s kind of a weird thing to say, but it’s true. I’m not sure exactly where the impulse comes from; I might be projecting my own abusive childhood onto the stories I’ve heard from my gay and lesbian friends about their traumatic coming-out stories and consequent family schisms.
But enough about me. The point is, it’s long past time for people to get over this as an issue. Stick around, foxfiregrrl, I think you’ll like it here.
gobear, I don’t know what I did to make you so pissy at me, but i sure as heck don’t ever remember saying I treat same-sex relationships more casually than opposite-sex ones.
I’m quite selective about ALL my relationships. There have been only two girls in my entire life that I’ve considered a serious relationship with because I don’t connect with females very well and if I get into a relationship with a female I DO NOT want it to be a casual affair like most of the same-sex relationships here (between the LESBIANS) are.
I simply have a huge problem with people telling me that I’m a “fence rider,” and yes, when people like you decide I’m promiscuous or somehow fickle because I LIKE BOTH SEXES.
That’s so offensive to me–I don’t go around making remarks about gay men to the effect of “They’ve just never met the right woman.” I don’t even THINK that. That’s vile beyond words. Yet that’s the level of offense I’m getting from comments like yours.
I really don’t want to Pit you over this because I admire you but can you not admit that some of us bisexuals are not just out for sex?
I don’t think that there is anything wrong with being gay, so long as you don’t do anything that is gay.
Okay, I don’t really feel that way. I’m like everybody else on this board. Gay, straight, whatever. So long as you are a decent human being. But the above was told to me by a priest whom I asked the very same question asked by the OP. I was just curious as to his (the Church’s) stance on this nowadays. So he quotes the above which to me is an absolute insult. I’m no Einstein but I can tell what he is really saying: we still think gays are wrong and we pray they would change but since such a viewpoint would get us knocked over by the masses who think that being gay is okay, we are going to pretend that we like homos.
This viewpoint is not as bad as that of the evil Fred Phelps out there but it is, in my opinion, close to being as sleazy because it dresses up their prejudices with feigned acceptance. Of course, Fred Phelps is worse because he is actually evil and sick and should be thrown into a lion’s cage after being smeared with A1 Steak Sauce.
Now that you’ve expanded on your post, and if you ereally do take same-sex relationships seriously, then I’ll say that not every bisexual is out for sex, aand that my previous post did not apply to you.
As much as you are offended by the “fence rider” epithet, I am offended by bi guys (usually closeted) who will sex up gay guys, but only get serious about women. It’s not right to get the pleasures of gay life, yet enjoy the hetero privilege, such as legal marriage and joint tax-filing, denied us.
Furthermore, I dated two bi guys, both of whom cheatred on me with women. Friends have have had the same experience. Bi guys are just not worth the risk of getting your heart stepped on.
You sound a little bitter, gobear. I feel confidant that you see the flaw in your own logic here. If we were to use this logic and apply it to all relationships then no one would be able to trust anyone. Have you ever been hurt by a gay guy who cheated with another guy? Well, then, you can’t trust the gays. If a straight guy was ever hurt by a girlfriend, then he can’t trust women again. If a lesbian was hurt by her girlfriend cheating with another women, then she can’t trust the lesbians. And on and on until no one is left to trust.
You are smart enough to know you can’t generalize your two experiences to the entire bisexual population. Getting your heart stepped on is a risk we all face, not matter what sexuality we are.
Not so. With gay guys, sure you might get hurt, but you also stand a chance of having a fulfilling relationship. A bi guy, generally, has his primary emotional connections with women, but just plays with guys. Sure, I thought I was in a relationship, but I was just a side dish, not an entree. My experience is not unigue; I’ve had this discussion with lots of gay friends, and the answer is always the same: trick with bi guys, but don’t get involved.
The sexual dynamic between women is different, I know, but I have heard some sad stories about gettiing involved with “junior-year dykes” in college. I also know that a lot of lesbians really dislike straight women coming on to them as an “experiment.” but I’m not a dyke, so I can’t really address the female experience.
Can I make valid claims about every bisexual? Well, of course not, but I don’t think that I’m completely off-base here, either.
This has been in my mind since 1983, when I was working briefly in Rantoul, Illinois. A small town; but only 20 miles or so away from Champaign, Illinois. I was in a bar on Green Street on July 4, waiting for the fireworks to start. A friend of mine was dancing with a gal, and I was trying to work up the nerve to ask this great-looking brunette to dance with me…when a GUY came up and asked me if I wanted to dance with him!
Champaign-Urbana had (probably still does?) a very strong gay population. I was “hit on” constantly, to the point where I was wondering if I was somehow “radiating” a message that I was gay. This, of course, during a time where it seemed like I couldn’t buy a date…double sigh…
I never have been even the slightest bit interested in a homosexual experience, yet there I was, fending off constant passes.
I can honestly say that I have always been in favor of equal rights for all people: women, gays, hell…name them all. But still, somehow, when I see a gay couple (male or female), my skin itches.
…crawls off to await the piling on for being non-PC…
I really don’t want to know what you do in your bedroom and don’t care unless it’s with me which is unlikely because of your tendencies and I’m married.
Marriage is a union between a man and women - that’s how it’s defined. If you wish to create a new term for a same sex union then go ahead - if it’s accepted then I’d use it if the occasion comes up.
Also maybe legally marriage is a legal contract but for many if not most it’s more. For me the legal aspect is not even considered until something like this thread brings it up. It’s more a moral contract/commitment that God has witnessed.
gobear, that is an unfortunate tale when you are expecting something more than just some sexual encounters, but I think it is clear that gay, straight, or bi: we all get that shaft now and again. We expect a lot from other people, and they don’t always deliver. Same at work as in sex, and in the restaruant, grocery store, etc etc etc.
Re: the OP: eh, I have only ever known one gay person, and he didn’t bother me. We were ok friends. But I can’t imagine anything particularly unifying about homosexuality that enables me to extrapolate this isolated experience to all gays everywhere. So I guess I have a decidedly uninterested opinion on the matter. It does bother me that homosexual marriages aren’t recognized, but honestly not enough to do anything about it.
I guess I just think the state should be taken out of marriage, not insinuated into it more.
Toaster52-
No worries!
I don’t think you’re non-PC. It is your right to be uncomfortable around certain types of behavior, as long as you respect everyone and do not persecute or discriminate against them for being merely different, which you stated that you do not.
“Bi folks get all the privileges of hetero relationships, but they also want to have some same-sex fun without the complications.”
Except for their hetero mates constantly worrying about being ditched for a same-sex relationship.
And straight people sneering at us because we’re not straight.
And gay people sneering at us for “not being gay enough.”
You’re totally right. I should stop being bisexual this instant because I’m married to a man. I’m deliberately using my status as a married woman to get “straight girl” priviledges, and I’m only bisexual because a little pussy on the side sounds like a fun lark.
Be irked at the boys who dissed you and your friends. Leave the rest of us out of it. I’m so sick of having to defend my bisexuality - to GAY PEOPLE - because to so many of them STRAIGHT is natural, GAY is natural, but BISEXUALITY is a friggin’ GAME.
Hi:) 'member me? I know we’ve met before: I remember you assuring me when porcupine came to DC that the beer-battered onion rings did not contain any alcohol and as such wouldn’t make me vomit.
I seem to remember you posting in another thread something to the effect of “I can speak from bitter personal experience that some bisexual men aren’t satisfied with only one partner.” Would it be presumptuous of me to assume that your personal experience might be embittering you toward bisexuals? That would be a rather sad and mildly hurtful generalization:(
As for my personal experiences with bi guys, the one I ever got to know decently well who was available (I’ve gotten to know two decently well, and one’s engaged) is definitely someone I’d be interested in seeing on a daily basis were such a possibility.
I … can’t even think of anything to say, gobear.
Anyway. How I feel. Basically it boils down to “whatever works for you”. I’m cool with people being gay, straight, bi, a, whatever. I’m attracted to both men and women. And as much as I may talk about it being “so much fun” … that’s who I am. I don’t do it because it’s fun, I do it because it’s who I am. I have hazel eyes. I have brown hair. I am bisexual. I don’t fence-sit; it’s not that I can’t decide?I’ve already decided. I am attracted to both.
Dude, we’ve hung out at every Dopefest I’ve been to over the past year. OF COURSE, I know you.
Patrick, you know I like you, and I think you’re swell. Perhaps my experiences have colored my views, but I asked around (my BF, gay neighbors) and they all agreed that they would never date a bi guy for the reasons I enumerated. I have no problem with people being attracted to both genders, and I agree that you should be true to your nature. I also know the way that I feel and the track record I’ve seen. I’m monogamous by nature, and I see no reason to be emotionally involved with someone who will inevitably step out on me.
I’m not attracted to women, so I’m not going to want to do a 3-way with a woman. I’m not into open relationships, so I’m not willing to have a BF who also sleeps with women, or wants women when he is with me. YMMV.
I never said it was a game or that your attraction to both genders wasn’t genuine. If you are 100 percent committed to a monogamous relationship with either gender, then I apologize. If you are married but getting some chick action on the side, however, then you just supported my position.
“If you are married but getting some chick action on the side, however, then you just supported my position.”
How about if I’m married, but not strictly monogamous, and she/they are bisexual as well?
This is all opinion, and in the right forum for it obviously…but you can’t categorize people that neatly.
I wouldn’t dream of leading a bisexual woman or lesbian to believe that I was able to be in an exclusive relationship with her. I think that is the difference between me and the people you’re deriding.
Honesty is a Good Thing no matter WHAT your orientation, and I’m sorry a bunch of lying crapcones have given those of us who DON’T misrepresent ourselves a bad name.
Gobear, how can you be gay and not know how hurtful generalizations are? Do you know every bisexual person? Do you know that they all cheat on their husbands/wives behind their backs? (Do you know their husbands/wives all disapprove?) What difference does it make, if you’re cheating on your spouse, what gender the other person is? Do you know they all treat “real” gay people :rolleyes: as an adventure? Is this kind of like how all lesbians bring a U-Haul on the second date and how all trannies are out to deceive cisgendered people?
I really like you, but this kind of thing is part of the reason the gay rights movement remains in difficulty, and I think your unfortunate past experiences are clouding you to this.
Don’t make me sic my roommate Moishe on you.
(j/k)
That is exactly the point. If you’re with a partner who also likes to play and you’re both honest about your desires, then more power to you. My apologies.
Matt, scroll up to to where I said, “Can I make valid claims about every bisexual? Well, of course not, but I don’t think that I’m completely off-base here, either.”
Sorry, man, but I stand by my opinion. I would never get serious about a bi guy because he would always yearn for what I could never give him.
“If you’re with a partner who also likes to play and you’re both honest about your desires, then more power to you. My apologies.”
Thank you. But it sucks that you had already made as many assumptions as you had, and that I had to get as specific as I did, for you to admit that maybe getting some girl-love on the side isn’t automatically a capital offense.
“I would never get serious about a bi guy because he would always yearn for what I could never give him.”
And neither would a LOT of women. There goes that whole “twice as many chances for a date on a Saturday night” theory…more like “a tenth as many.”
I understand that being burned by bi guys several times would color your opinion of them. I sympathize for so many having treated you poorly.
It just seems that a LOT of times people crow, “Equality! Tolerance! Unless you’re bisexual!” Fat people and bisexuals…the only folks the populace is still allowed to make fun of. I’m exaggerating, yeah…but I’m sure you see the gist.
I mean, straight girls have the VERY happy bonus of never hearing some cretinous yutz leer, “Can I watch?”
The whole “bisexuals get all the benefits of heterosexuality without the problems of homosexuality” is a complete and total barrel of excrement. There are people worse off than me financially, so I shouldn’t complain when I’m broke. There are people who don’t have a place to live, so I shouldn’t bitch about my house. There are people who are beaten up every day for being gay, so I shouldn’t complain about my treatment as a bisexual?
I’m another “don’t care” person. Unless I am having sex with that person, I cannot imagine how their gender preference would affect me. I can’t decide whether this makes me broad-minded or incredibly shallow.
Other than that, there needs to be more to a person to interest me. Sexual habits alone, however shocking, do not a personality make.
