Please take note though, of the important terms “an average person”, “most animals”, and “more nearly independent” - these cites aren’t stating absolutes at all.
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Have you read the thread? Several times I and others have pointed out that human high-jumpers clear comparable heights despite being unable to jump more than 1 meter by pivoting the centre of gravity. There seems to be absolutely no doubt that humans cannot jump higher than 1 metre. It has been studied in some detail.
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Have you ever seen a kangaroo jump a high fence? The always scramble in their own bipedal fashion. In fact one of the traditional roo fencing techniques in Australia is a double strand of barb over the sheep netting. The animals always land atop the fence and so often become tangled in the bard and die.
Not a cat, but a dinky little animal all the same:
Blake: Indeed, I’ve read the thread. Humans do it by pivoting their centre of gravity, as you say. Kangaroos don’t, which is why I picked them.
As for scrambling, I haven’t seen a kangaroo do that, but I don’t know much about kangaroos, so if you have a cite that they do this, I’ll accept it. If, however, they land atop the fence, they’ve jumped to that height.
Here`s a video of a cat jumping about 30 feet.
I`ve searched and seen all kinds of speculation that a cat can jump anywhere from 5-7 times his own height (not length).
A 10 inch high cat could jump about 60 inches, add the length of the body (around 18 inches) and you could easily see a cat jump 5 feet and then get the front paws about 18 inches higher than that to pull itself up to a height of 78 inches. All in one fell swoop. Giving the appearance of a six foot high continuous jump, which I have seen cats do. I had a cat that could jump from the floor to the top of the fridge (about 70 inches high), the fridge was covered with the kids papers and magnets and the cat never knocked them off (as would be the case if he “helped himself up”).
Desmostylus,
Personal insults are not allowed in this forum. Don’t do this again.
DrMatrix - GQ Moderator
https://engineering.purdue.edu/CEE/about/ray_documents/ThrowForward.pdf
A former Purdue graduate student held the world record in the Olympic standing high jump (it isn’t an event any more). His record was 5’5".
My 2c worth:
Did the guys who postulate the 2’ theory take into account that animals are built differently? E.g I don’t think an elephant can jump 1 inch, never mind 2’! Elephants CAN’T jump they are physiologically unable to do this. I don’t have a cite for this, but I think all the rangers’ experience/evidence in all the game parks here in South Africa is good enough? Or does all that just count as anecdotal? Another eg: A cat and a kangaroo have differently shaped bodies. Even if the muscles that power their hind legs have the same characteristics, the rest of the body (specifically the mass of the torso) would determine how high those muscles can lift that body. I’d bet on it that a kangaroo will outjump a cat any day, proportionally to their sizes.
Blake has tried to make a distinction about running starts and standing jumps. I think he wants to argue that a running start will achieve a higher jump? How? AFAIK the height is only determined by the amount of force perpendicular to the ground, not by any force parallel to the ground. Furthermore, the height (free height with no scrambling, etc) would be determined by the mass of the animal as if it was concentrated at the centre of gravity. And of course gravitational pull, so a cat on mt Everest should be able to jump higher than a cat in Long Beach, all other things being equal.
I’m thinking (aloud!) of some other examples I’ve seen, although I dare say that Blake will discount these as anecdotal too: A kudu can stand right next to a 6 foot high game fence and jump right accross it, from standing, with no scrabbling etc. All the game ranchers around here use 8’ high fences if they have kudu or eland (An eland can also clear 6’ easily!). The only thing I’m wondering now, is how high a kudu’s centre of gravity is above the ground. Possibly 3’6" or thereabout That means he must move his centre of gravity about 4’ to clear a 6’ fence, taking account of the bits below his CoG. And a kudu knows buggerall about a Fosbury flop. He just goes hup! front feet accros, backfeet accross and away we go!
Here’s something else you guys might relate to easier, and it should be able to get more solid evidence in the form of video footage etc: steeplechasing. How high do horses go in a steeplechase like the Grand National or some such?
Regards,
Dries Venter
South Africa
http://www.olympic.org/uk/athletes/heroes/bio_uk.asp?PAR_I_ID=58689
Pictures of Ewry in the standing high jump. Note that he’s jumping so that he lands on his feet - he’s not diving across the bar and shifting his center of gravity.
Of course, as the event was held in 1900 and I was not there, the evidence is purely anecdotal and should not be taken as authoritative until Mr. Ewry can be exhumend and asked, directly, if the events did, indeed, take place as is recorded on the photographic film. It would also help if the photograph was there to verify the late Mr. Ewry’s claims.
And to address the OP (How high could I jump if my legs were as powerful as a house cat’s hind legs?) a cat’s jumping ability isn’t down to just its leg muscles IIRC the feline back is used (as it is in running - cheaters particularly). A cat preparing to jump seems to compress itself like a spring (I’ve been in a position where a lioness started to do this - with me as the prey; it did the crouch and bum-wiggle thing just like a house kitty with a mouse. I wasn’t too interested in theory at the time)
So for feline performance you basically need to be a cat
Cheetahs:smack: :smack: :smack: Frickin’ Cheetahs!
No. But we can do a little extrapolation. When my housecat stands on his hind legs, his tail is long enough to touch the ground. I think pumas and housecats are pretty close proportionally.
From here
So let’s say eight feet, not counting the front legs. We don’t add the length of the front legs to the total length because of the head, but let’s get liberal and add two feet.
Now then, at 10 feet from “hindclaw to foreclaw, fully extended”, we see that the cat who jumped to an 18 foot limb would need a minimum vertical leap of 8 feet, to the bottom of it hind paws. No amount of twisting your center of gravity or “Fosbury flops” will affect the fact the cat’s back feet were on the ground and now they are 8 feet in the air. And this is IF all the hundreds of cites saying a puma can leap 18 feet straight up failed to mention anything about the cat jumping and barely grabbing on with it’s front claws then pulling itself up.
If this doesn’t convice you, nothing will.
Sorry, Blake, I didn’t know that YOUR Google hits were good, but the Google hits everyone else has provided aren’t good. I’m glad you can tell immediately which sites are accurate and which are mumbo jumbo. It’s really too bad that the rest of us can’t do that. :rolleyes:
So, here, with a cite from US Fish and Wildlife Service: http://www.wonderquest.com/puma-brine-freezes-tadpoles.htm
“The puma wins the gold medal in the high jump. 15 feet (4.6 m)”
Another cite from the Woodland Park Zoo in Seattle, WA (or is that not reputable enough) : http://www.zoo.org/educate/fact_sheets/cougar/cougar.htm
“From a sitting position, cougars have been observed springing upward 18 feet (5.5 m) onto a tree branch.” Given the overall length of around 9 feet tops - heck, I’ll even give you another 2 feet for extended front legs (the rear legs being the approximate length of the tail), that’s a minimum of a 7 foot jump (likely closer to 9), even with ‘scrabbling’.
Or a third cite, from the National Park Service: http://www.nps.gov/bibe/teachers/factsheets/mountainlion.htm
“The backbone is very flexible, allowing it to make vertical leaps of 15 feet and horizontal leaps of 45 feet.” This last one gives a very good description of the specialized body that enables it to jump so high (you did ask)…strong muscles on a light, agile skeleton, flexible backbone, etc, etc…
Or are all of these cites simply not good enough? You have yet to provide ONE CITE proving that mountain lions (cougars, pumas…same animal), cats and the like can NOT jump that high. You wave around a generalized theory…show US some proof…we’ve all provided tons of cites, and I’d say that these 3 are pretty reputable.
Jman
Wrong. You haven’t consulted “every univesity (sic) physiology and physics department,” just a handful of them. How can you claim these few findings are representative? Can you show that their observations and “calculations” are peer-reviewed?
the problem here is Blakes definition of “jump” apperantly means doing nothing to boost height beyond the first leap. which is of course a stupid way to measure a jump since nothing jumps like that. but in his own weird definition of jump he could very well be right.
Walker’s Mammals of the World-Felidae
Felis Serval (serval)
and
Felis concolor (cougar, puma, panther, or mountain lion)
Hell, dudes- my HOUSECATS can & do jump 4>5’ from a standing (well, they crouch first) start.
Back to the OP’s question- less that you can, assuming you were in good shape. You are (I make an assumption here) a Primate- thus pound for pound, you’re stronger than a Carnivore.
Housecats and some other small felines can jump fairly high for their size, yes. But that is because they don’t wiegh all that much, not because they’re particulary strong for their size. Cats also are adapted for jumping & pouncing instead of running (well, except for Cheetahs, which are only arguably cats anyway).
That’s is why a human - IN GOOD SHAPE- can outrun, outjump outlift- and yes- outfight- just about any other animal- except our more primitive Primate cousins who are even stronger. In their wieght class and on dry land, of course.
There is a documented story about a Zoologist who was jumped by a leopard- and managed to strangle the leopard- even tho that scientist had only one arm. Thus, if one of us (in good shape) was attacked by a Puma- and got through the inital surpise attack not too badly injured- we could whup said Puma. Especially given even a half-assed impromptu weapon.
Don’t try this with a Lion, tiger, bear etc- they outweigh us, note. But African natives of the one tribe have to kill a Lion with just a spear as part of their manhood ceremony- or did, anyway. Us Primates are pretty damn tough.
I’ve just worked out where this overwhelming sense of *Deja Vu* is coming from.
Man this thread is just crazy. Blake your stance is completely ludicrous. Virtually anyone that owns a cat knows it. Next time I watch my cat jump onto the fridge I’ll make sure to tell her that she really can’t jump that high.
Also you said humans can’t jump over a meter?
http://www.onlineathens.com/stories/073102/dog_20020731063.shtml
“HOOVER, Ala. – Forty-six inches!
That’s the new school record vertical leap for football players turned in during summer workouts by Georgia senior Boss Bailey”
I can’t help but think that Blake is just taking the piss out of everyone. I’d hate to think that someone can be so devoid of logic.