Partly inspired by recent events in Florida…
On TV, detectives will search a suspect’s house and find what they are looking for in a few minutes, or quickly realize that there is nothing to see.
But how does it work in the real world?
If police are looking for a murder weapon, or a cache of documents, how long will they spend in a typical apartment? What about a larger house?
I’ve learned from here on the Dope that search warrants are specific and (ideally) not to be deviated from. So if, for example, the authorities are looking for stolen TVs, they can’t go looking in desk drawers or other places that can’t reasonably be expected to contain a stolen TV. Or something. So if they came to my house looking for stolen TVs, they’d be in an out in less than ten minutes because there are only so many places they could even be (and my house is only like 1100 sqft). If they were looking for documents, they’d probably be here for an hour or so, looking in every nook and cranny.
I don’t know how big You-Know-Who’s mansion in You-Know-Where is, but I imagine since they were looking for something comparatively small*, they were probably there for a while.
*If the search warrant says “boxes of documents,” could they search for a place where loose documents could be found (viz, his desk drawer)? Or would they have to restrict their search to spaces where boxes of documents could be found (closets and (large) safes and such)?
I should probably add that everything would, presumably, need to be documented to hell and back, in triplicate. As in, “Agent Smith recovered a box labeled Nuclear Secrets: Only Sell To Russia in a closet along the west wall, on the second floor, at the bottom of several other boxes containing sex dolls, and then, escorted by Agent Jones, carried the box approximately 1,000 feet to Van #177830-4, which was occupied by Agents Bugs and Daffy, who secured it in a cage with a padlock…”
On the other hand, they were looking to search a specific location and I’m guessing were not given free reign to search the entire property. This could also be a factor: “Sam Crimelord’s nephew says Sam has boxes of incriminating evidence in his second floor office” might lead to a narrow warrant that doesn’t allow them to search the garage and laundry room. In the newsworthy case, they weren’t combing the entire resort and no outraged complaints of them going though underwear drawers.
I’m also assuming they couldn’t just grab a box of documents and cart it off. They had to go through each one to determine whether what it contained was on their list. Given the volume of documents, that alone could take many hours. Of course, if that’s true, why did they take his three passports, one expired, unless that was explicitly called out on their list?
Please don’t base reality on anything you see on TV. Remember, they only have a limited amount of time to tell their story, and a house search can’t take more than a few minutes of screen time. The detective enters the house, notices the evidence he’s looking for, tells someone else, and then leaves. IRL, that rarely, if ever, happens.
In the case of theScarborough Rapist - who ended up raping and killing at least 3 people with his wife helping, including his wife’s sister - the cops searched his house and missed video tape evidence that would have guaranteed a conviction of both with a life sentence. His wife ended up taking a plea deal for a shorter sentence because they didn’t find it until after the trial.
So to answer your question, sometimes not long enough.
You’re a funny guy!
The actual FBI warrant is visible here.
The locations to be search include the “45 Office,” all storage rooms, and all other rooms or areas within the premises used or available to be used by FPOTUS and his staff and in which boxes or documents could be stored, including all structures or buildings on the estate.
The next page states that the search was for documents marked classified and for “communications in any form” that could contain classified information. IOW, the search was not for a particular item, and was not limited in extent. The information could be anywhere and a full house search was necessary.
AFAICT, the search started in the morning and lasted all day. That seems pretty short, actually. Searches in other types of investigations have lasted days.
Even on television, the searches almost never last 10 minutes. The ones I’ve seen usually show random search scenes cut together and then a find, indicating that lots of time has passed.
How did they manage to take his passports? Were they “other documents”?
The warrant covers it with “…as well as any other containers/boxes that are collectively stored or found together with the aforementioned containers and container/boxes.”
From news reports, the passports were with the boxes of classifed documents found.
Thank you!
As an added bonus, if/when he’s indicted, a judge won’t have to tell him to surrender his passports since they’ve already been de facto surrendered.
As I recall reading, the police thoroughly trashed the place, ripping off drywall and going through everything. When they were done, Bernardo’s lawyer went in and in a matter of a few minutes, lifted the light fixture in a bathroom and retrieved the video tapes hidden in the ceiling.
Basically, the wife had pulled to “I was abused and forced to participate” and the videos proved that she was a eager participant in the two rapes and murders, plus the drugging and raping of her sister who died of the drugs.
The passports, from what I read - two were expired, they returned the valid one, I understand. One was his diplomatic passport so no linger valid and also expired and probably part of the presidential records. Note the FBI had earlier subpoena’ed video of the MaL security, so they had a good idea what they were looking for and what was being done with it.
Depending on jurisdiction, the state may or may not reimburse for damages done during a search, particularly if no incriminating evidence was found. Or… put in an application and wait a few months for reimbursement.
Your summary is correct. Police can only search where the items they are seeking are expected to be found. But, for that reason, police have learned to include “catch all” phrases that will give them broad access.
Oftentimes police seeking to enter a home will include reference to “identification documents” (on the theory that they are seeking to confirm the defendant’s relationship to the home in which they live). At that point, they are able to look through your mail, and access anyplace something like a utility bill can be found.
The warrant says the “mansion” has 58 bedrooms and 33 bathrooms. And the warrant did not cover private guest suites and areas for Mar-a-Lago members. The estate is listed at 17 acres.
As I said, I’m surprised they only stayed a day.
That was my reaction too. When I think of how long it sometimes takes me to find something in my own house, I imagine that it would take an enormous amount of time to search someone else’s place, especially if it’s big.
For those who’ve packed up their entire house for a move and had professional movers do the same thing (on another occasion), it’s pretty amazing how fast, efficient, and dispassionate the professionals are. They don’t linger. They aren’t sentimental. They don’t reminisce.
I have to guess that there’s an element of this at work when the professionals conduct a thorough search.
When professionals move your house, they will put everything into boxes of the same sizes they have on them, unless you specify otherwise. Obviously, this takes a fraction of the time that a search for what’s in these boxes would take.
The search of Mar-a-Lago was for materials thought to be hidden, because there had been previous removal of documents and a signed letter from a lawyer saying that all had been removed, a flat lie.
The FBI absolutely, positively needed to linger. They were looking for things that were deliberately kept from them earlier, that could be anywhere and in any form. They would be the Platonic opposite of a professional mover.
Finding the passports where the classified material can be used to prove he (45) was there and aware of the classified material (no “Never saw any classified stuff, not me, nope”). The passports were turned over to the State Department (who issues them) and returned to 45.
In spite of his blathering, he learned his passports were discovered and taken by the FBI when the SD notified him to pick them up (“hey, we got your passports”).
All the above from the Politics and Elections thread on the FBI Mar-a-Lardo search.
Thank you for clarifying.