Merged additional thread about recounts, etc.
I see I screwed up the sequence threading (I was specifically cautioned about this, alas).
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That’s not what Democrats said. They said our elections’ integrity should not be questioned. If shenanigans are a real possibility then there’s nothing wrong with saying there might be shenanigans beforehand.
That’s pretty plainly wrong. It presumes that the misinformation that the RW media (and passionate Sanders fans) post on facebook is factual.
Clinton is plenty progressive.
They said that questioning it without evidence of any malfeasance is shitty.
If you accept the idea of the supposed statistical anomalies, especially after Trump, the FBI and Putin have been felching each other’s tapioca, it’s not the same.
The Usurping Games. Let the usurping begin.
We ***told ***Donald not to piss off that 400lb hacker sitting on his bed.
All the “my side is right, your side is wrong” back and forth doesn’t advance this question even one little bit.
What I want to know is how one goes about auditing the output of an electronic voting machine? If 1000 voters use a given machine, and the machine says that 600 voted for candidate A and 350 voted for B, and the other 50 voted for C or didn’t make a choice on that race, how does anyone tell if the machine reported correctly?
Seems to me that a simple line or two of programming that changes every 6th Hillary vote into anything else, could, with modern technology, be inserted electronically by the same guy who steals your credit card information while walking past you in the mall.
Anyone smart enough to accomplish this could do it for every voting machine in the state, just by gaining access to the warehouse where they are kept. And, not a problem, make it work only on election day.
All partisanship aside, my main question is, how do you know if an electronic machine is reporting incorrectly on the day that votes are taken? How can it be audited?
Some observers have claimed that one way they are audited is by exit polling, and, as you know, exit polling was off by 4 or 5 % in the states that swung this election to Trump.
Russian programmers are certainly able to pull this off, probably without being detected. We know they were involved in the election on Trump’s side, we don’t know how deeply, do we?
Is there an expert in the house who can answer my question?
We don’t even know how they were involved. It’s just an American Truism that when bad things happen, there’s a villainous Russki under the bed.
Crucible, I’m no expert but it depends on the machine. Some produce a paper trail and some don’t. If not you’d have to rely on a forensic analysis of the machine. And no “only do this on election day” doesn’t make hacking invisible.
I have to conclude, based on the rest of the world, that the reason voting is so obtuse is so it CAN be manipulated. If I buy an oil filter at the auto parts store I get a detailed receipt detailing every element of the transaction. Hell, even a simple old fashioned carbon copy phone log provides more of a verified record than our so called “secret ballot”. Even without the electoral college adding to the confusion, this system is outdated. The only reason I see it continuing is that it benefits the so called “establishment” in that it perpetuates their hold on power.
My guess is that the Democrats won’t take part in this circus. Hillary lost and the party will have no appetite for clutching at straws.
Just making sure, are you saying the only reason for “so called” secret ballots is so that the establishment can fake up the results they want? And a less “outdated” system would print up reciepts and record which candidates people voted for?
Indeed, some of them are merely stupid racists.
And still others are merely stupid, with no particular racialist views.
It’s a rich tapestry, covered in vomit.
How would the Russian hackers erase their code from all the machines?
I’m rather curious about this, myself. Are the machines ever tested with a simulated election where the (say) 1000-vote input is precisely known to have 614 votes for Candidate A, 341 for Candidate B, 15 for Candidate C, and 30 votes that are deliberately spoiled or otherwise unreadable/ambiguous and should be put aside for human examination?
Would it be particularly burdensome to run tests like this before and after an election?
Most likely avenue would be to hack the transmission of results, rather than effectively reprogram the machinery. Which, as you suggest, would be a daunting task.
Stein has raised her goal of $2.5 million and now has over $4.5, and the goal has been increased to $7 million, which I think she will reach.
https://jillstein.nationbuilder.com/recount
I like the suggestion that the Democrats have urged her to do this. It makes a lot of sense.
The code could erase itself after doing the deed.
It might be lost on the average person (and thus look bad politically), but there is a difference between a priori saying the system must be rigged, and, after the fact, seeing some unusual results and just wanting to check to make sure.
That said, it wasn’t rigged. The likelihood is much lower than even Sam Wang gave Trump.