Five years and 60k miles on a car is most certainly NOT old and nowhere near replacement age.
So the warranty runs out- so what? The purchase of a new car just to get the warranty is not economically sound.
A $1k repair bill at the 60k mark is not entirely unusual either.
Like others have said more eloquently, you have a lot of use left in your car, and there is little likelihood that necessary repairs will mount up so quickly on a car this age that it is an economic imperative to sell and buy new.
Sure. But I wasn’t trying to have this guy promise me something that I would hold him to later. Instead, I was appealing to his expertise and experience - which are far greater than mine - to provide me a few more, very general, ballpark details. At the very least, he could have said “Well, once this kinda thing starts happening, it tends to be one thing after another.” Or, “The types of things you might experience at 90K are ABC. And you might expect to replace XYZ to get another 75K miles out of them.”
As it was, when I described my concerns and asked follow-up questions he WAS able to give me considerable more info. I guess his initial response reminded me of something that I’ve experienced a lot lately and kinda ticks me off - when you ask someone for general information and they respond, “I can’t tell you that” because they don’t want to be pinned down to a specific price or guarantee.
For an example in a completely different context, I recently had a foot operation. I asked my surgeon approximately what I might expect it to cost. I thought it a relevant question, as I have to pay a percentage, and had no idea if it would cost $2K or $20K. His initial response was “I can’t tell you that.” Bullshit! He’s done hundreds of this procedure and he’s gonna tell me he has NO idea how much they cost such that he can’t even give me a $5K range? As it turned out, the total billed amount - doctor, anesthesia, and hospital was around $12K. I would have been PERFECTLY happy with him if he had said “barring complications, these generally run between $10-15K.” Really bugs me when you have to pry so little info out of people. But I digress…
Well, I know what a battery is, but even if I remembered the other specific names, I really don’t think they would mean much more to me than the ones I used. This is from a guy who used to be able to change and gap points and plugs, adjust timing, change oil, etc. no problem. As a kid I swapped out radiators, alternators, and more. But surely you’ll acknowledge that cars 25 years ago were a far cry from today, where everything is electronic-this, or computerized-that.
These things weren’t something like an air filter, but instead, were an air-flow, sensor, controller something or another. I’ll post the specific names when I pick up the car and invoice tonight. But we’re talking about something WAY more specific than the basics of a modern internal combustion engine.
In all seriousness, I have zero interest in learning anything about how my car works. I don’t care if under the hood is a cage of hamsters or a nuclear generator. I just want the damn thing to start when I turn the key, and get me where I want to go. Same way I don’t care why my computer does what it does, I just want it to do it reliably. There are many MANY other things I would rather spend my time learning and doing. I am very happy to spend money to avoid learning that, and to have someone else handle it for me.
A friend had a Ford Pickup that he didn’t change the oil on for the first 40,000 miles, and that made it to 100,000 before he started seeing the first major problems. At 60K your card has essentially no miles on it. Trading it now would be about the worst cost-effective way to ensure good transportation.
Sure, some things may need replacement/repairs, and a $1000 bill isn’t really very much in the grand scheme of things for a modern car. There are very few if any better options out there for the price you could get for your car. With 2 still pretty young cards you should be putting some money aside for upkeep (you’ll need timing belts, brakes, and occasional things like CV boots and tires) and learn what is important to fix ASAP and what can wait.
Ya know, I think that is really what surprised us. We budget pretty carefully and are pretty good about putting money aside for expected expenses as well as unanticipated “emergencies.” I think, in essence, yesterday’s experience essentially exposed a blindspot in our budgeting process. When the cars are under warranty, you don’t need to anticipate dropping a grand here or there on car repair.
Seriously, thanks for all the info and reassurances. As of now I’m really comfortable hanging onto both cars for some time yet. I guess it just kinda surprised me because that was a thousand bucks I wasn’t planning on shilling out that particular Tuesday. I think what we really need to do is adjust our thinking about what we anticipate our cars costing on a regular basis, and adjusting our budget to reflect that.
Of course, if the missus wants a new car for whatever reason, and that will make her happy, I’m fine with that as well.
Then when the kids get outta the house, I’ll get me a car I understand without all them thingamajigs and doohickeys. Maybe a 72 Cutlass. Or a 62 Galaxie…
As others have indicated, plenty of people hang onto cars for a lot longer than you have, with no real trouble. After over 15 years of car ownership, I’m still only on my second car (both bought used), and so far it hasn’t given me any reason to question its reliability (knock wood).
A Toyota with 60K miles on it? That’s a practically new car.
A $1000 maintenance can certainly happen even to a Toyota, especially when they do the timing belt. What’s strange is that the mechanic told you you can expect the water pump to go after about 90K. Often, it’s advisable to replace that when you’re doing the timing belt, since it cuts down on the cost of labour (they’re in the same vicinity and a pump isn’t that expensive).
At any rate, I bet that car hasn’t cost you $1000 a year to maintain yet. That means it’s a good runner. But even good runners need costly repairs every now and then. I wouldn’t replace it yet, no way.
But then, I’m not one to listen to really. I throw shedloads of money at impossible to maintain cars, just because I happen to like them. No way my current car will cost me as little as $1000 a year in maintenance. On the other hand, it’s a better looker than most Toyotas.
Still, if reliable and cost-effective transport is your goal, you can’t beat that old Toyota by replacing it. Depreciation on new cars is absolute madness, and greatly offsets the odd high maintenance bill for a slightly older - yet reliable - car.
I’ve made a habit of continuing to pay (albeit into a savings account) my car payments for several months after my car is paid off. I’m not used to having the extra money, and if it doesn’t break down, it just sits and earns interest. My last vehicle died in such a manner that I used the money for a down payment on my current one. Ten more months and That will be paid off, 14 more months and I’ll have my emergency reserve.
If you can still even get a new Toyota or Honda for $20,000 your car payments over 4 years are like what… $500 a month?
That’s a grand every two months.
Now do you really forsee having to spend $1000 every two months on repair bills for a Toyota with 60K miles on it? Highly doubtful.
Over the lifetime of a vehicle (10 years/160K miles is pretty typical) you’ve got the cost of the vehicle + maintenance/repairs. The bulk of that is paid over the first 4 years. Why would you then want to dump a vehicle that may cost you (say $1200 a year in repairs) $100 a month to drive?
Sweet ride, Coldie, but you sure you don’t see a resemblance?
For the techies out there, the actual parts were:
-mass air flow meter
-belt tensioner
-timing chain tensioner
-and battery
Total charge, $900 and change.
Best of all, the car runs like a top.
I think some of those problems had been slowly progressing over the past few months, such that the car had not been driving a well as it should. After this work, my wife is remembering how much she likes that car.
Score one for me winning a debate and forestalling an expensive expenditure! Can’t remember the last time that happened! She must have given me that one for Valentine’s Day!
A mechanic who regularly looks after my parents’ cars recommended Dad get rid of the two Volvo estates he owned when they got near a certain mileage, in his experience they usually had steering problems after that.
Do all cars have unique Achilles Heels (I almost unconsciously called that an Achilles wheel :rolleyes: ), that on average at a certain age or mileage they can be expected to break in a certain way?
It didn’t make it to the States, I’m afraid. Alfa Romeo’s last car sold in the US was the 164, which they stopped selling there in the mid 90’s IIRC. But they’re due back in 2009 I believe, starting with the 159 and the Brera, later adding the to be released 169.
That little blue one I have is a '95 Spider V6, first of the “modern” Spiders. It’s loads of fun!
There are few engines in the world that sound nicer that a 12 valve Alfa V6, IMHO. And it’s a light car, so its 192 BHP make it quite quick. It is a bit of a high maintenance car. Not so much the engine, those will last 300,000 kilometers (mine’s done 150,000) easy. Electrics, suspension, and a few other things will haunt you frequently. I bought mine just a few weeks ago from a private seller, and am in the process of getting it in top shape. Although it’s been well maintained, it has a few flaws still (two unstraight rims and a humming distribution belt are next on the list).
I just like Alfas, what can I say. Used to own a 2000 Alfa 166 V6, which I still think is one of the best looking sedans of the last 20 years. What a looker she was.
Then there’s my company car, which is a 2006 Alfa GT. It has the dreaded four cilinder engine, which really is blasphemous in an Alfa to be honest. Then again, some people sin even more and go for the diesel versions. :eek: Here’s that GT.
Anyways! Back to Toyotas. Yeah, Dinsdale, that Sienna looks just like mine!
Seriously, nothing wrong with cars like that for reliable and roomy transport. Good on you to opt for the repairs on your current car though. $900 doesn’t sound like much for all that work to be honest, but that could be me being used to European prices. At any rate, that Toyota will keep you happy for a few years more to be sure!
I actually had the experience soon after we bought it where I was stopped at a red light. Looked to my left and saw a hottie in the car next to me. Started to make sure I had my cool on – and realized I was driving a friggin minivan and therefore was invisible to anything other than perhaps a soccer mom!
One of those moments you are never quite prepared for until it hits.
One of my buddies had a little red alpha spider in college back in 1983 or so. Good for him he was a mechanic on foreign sports cars! I can still remember taking that out on the expressway, and looking over and finding I was at exactly the height of the wheels on the semi I was passing!
Yes, the old classic Spiders. They’re even more unreliable.
I had one of those minivan moments myself. While my work car was in the shop for repairs, I got some godawfully boring Ford Focus C-Max or something as a replacement. Nothing really wrong with it, it drove, and it was only for a couple of days. But in a traffic jam, the friendly smile I threw the nice girl in the Mini Cooper next to me was responded to with a disapproving, almost sorry frown. Confused me for 2 seconds (I’m no Casanova, but I usually get at least a smile :)) until I realized that I was sitting in a car that screams I HAVE REPRODUCED SEVERAL TIMES AND MY WIFE WON’T LET ME DRIVE ANYTHING FUN ANYMORE.
I remember the first time I saw one of those on the street, the driver was just getting in so I slowed down as I walked past to enjoy the sound of what I hoped was a V6. Disappointingly all I got was a bbbrrrdrrrrrrrrrr of the diesel under the bonnet.
The “airflow sensor dohicky” is a Mass Airflow, or “MAF” sensor a nnd should be in your air intake line just downstream of the air cleaner. The part should be considerably< $300 aftermarket, and a blind monkey could probably change it in 15-20 minutes, tops.
Batteries are a normal wear item that go bad every 5-8 years. A good one should be < $100, and unless Toyota locates their batteries in other than an underhood location, half-hour with simple handtools gets it swapped out.
If the “timer thingamajig” is the timing belt and the mechanic found no major cracks, you can wait a while despite the owner’s manual’s 60K mileage recommendation.
This job WILL cost you. Most cars, at minimum, require the drainage and removal of the radiator, the drive belt(s) for AC, alternator, etc., to get at a $14 timing belt! Lots of labor here! This job is also "normal maintenance"that any timing belt-equipped car needs every 5 years or so.
So, the only thing that’s actually “gone wrong” in 6 years is a lousy MAF sensor. That’s outstanding reliability!
