Yeah. That’s why I said what I said.
Sorry, most folks don’t know.
Don’t say, “Is this seat taken?”
Just to reiterate or clarify though, this WILL NOT apply at an “interfaith liberal Seder” as you are currently contemplating attending. This would only apply if you are invited into a fairly Orthodox person’s home.
I don’t really have any Jewish friends - nobody I know well enough to ask them to invite me into their home, anyway - so it looks to me like a public Seder would have to do.
I hadn’t heard of Chabad before, but upon Googling they have a branch right here in Olympia which is holding a public Seder locally. I’m writing an email tonight to the head of that group to ask if I would be welcome to attend. I gather from the reference that Chabad is a more conservative-leaning organization - I assume their services would involve a bit more Hebrew than the Seattle one I was looking at earlier?
I hope you get a chance to attend a seder. I went to one a few years ago, with a guy I was dating, at his family’s house – they were very welcoming, and I found it to be surprisingly moving. Coming from a Christian background, I was certainly familiar with the Biblical references, but it struck me, sitting at this table, that for these people, this was an extended family history. It kind of gave me chills, in a good way. I don’t recall being expected to do anything at all, aside from paying attention to the readings. It was, in many ways, far simpler than following a Catholic mass.
Mazel tov.
I’ve never been to any of their services, but they are really nice folks.
The drunken Rabbi who hugged me at Purim was Chabad.
Yeah, and don’t sit in Elijah’s seat and drink his wine. :o
Yeah, but if you’re at the Chabad house…
Chabadink have their own purpose. I wouldn’t join that sect, but I have grown rather fond of them. Just keep in mind that they really are their own group. But very nice and open and loving. I think the OP will enjoy.
The Chabad are like…I don’t know. They are good at reaching out to Jews, though. They had the best Internet sites back in the day, the newest technology, spread throughout the country, set up shops near college campuses…it’s nice. (:
Shoot me a private GQ email and a chair is reserved for you. With cushions!
They actually had a Seder at my “fundamentalist” church a few years ago, but I was unable to attend. We don’t have any Jewish people in our church–we just sometimes want to get back to the Judaic roots of Christianity. And, yes, we had a real live Jewish family (from out of state) come host (or whatever it’s called).
I have tasted the bitter herbs and matzo before, though, when we were studying Passover in Sunday School. The bread’s not bad, but the herbs? Bleh. I guess they really serve their purpose.
I am hoping next year to try and make a fairly authentic recreation of the Last Supper. Of course, I say that every year.
All very good ideas and advice… A couple more things:
- If you are a teetotaler (or driving home), non-alcoholic grape juice is perfectly acceptable instead of wine, and most Seders will have some laid out for those who want/need it (at worst, snag some from the kiddies’ table… :))
- Chabad is not merely “more conservative-leaning” – they are full-out ultra-orthodox. If you are female you will need to dress modestly, and (regardless of gender) the no-intergender-touching will apply in spades.
- In some circles the empty chair will be “reserved” for Gilad Shalit rather than for Elijah, and some mention of his story may be made by the hosts. (Probably not if you go to the Chabad seder, though)
Lubavitchers in NYC knock on your door and bug you – even worse than Jehovah’s Witnesses – but only if you’re Jewish. Jews don’t proselytyze but Lubavitchers have determined that harassing other Jews about their practice is a technical exception. I can’t stand them.
That said they are generally friendly and knowledgable. If you want to engage in learned debate you will find a wealth of it there! However, due to the language barrier I don’t think you would get much out of their seder. A Chabad Seder will be almost exclusively in Hebrew. It might even be completely in Yiddish, depending on the sect. As noted Chabad-Lubavitch is an ultra-orthodox group, a specific branch called “Hasidic,” famous for wearing their very distinctive dark clothes and hats.
As a Christian hoping to learn something from the experience, and not just observe it as an anthropological exercise, I would steer you away from Chabad. Its not a good example of how “average” Jews practice Passover. They are a fringe group considered restrictive even by other ultra-orthodox. Some of their views are extremely out of the mainstream (such as that their deceased rebbe, Menachim Schneerson, was mashiach.)
Couldn’t you just find a Jewish household and pop in claiming to be Elijah? I think many people symbolically put out an extra place-setting for him.
I had a raccoon show up on the porch upon opening the door for Elijah at my first home Seder.
This isn’t quite accurate. Chabad is considerably less restrictive than most “Ultra-Orthodox” groups, in terms of dress, openness to secular education, use of technology, etc. They are looked down on by other Hassidim because their extreme focus on outreach/proselytizing means that they are a much less insular community. And, as you mention, their Messianic ideas are seen as too Christian-like.
In any case, the OP will probably not be well served by attending a Chabad seder. Although Chabad does have some interest in non-Jews (ie their campaign for the 7 Laws of Noah) they are almost entirely focused on outreach to Jews. I think the OP would feel more comfortable attending a community seder hosted by a heterodox Jewish group, such as the one in Seattle.
Oh, and you might want to watch this movie.
Is there tradition for larger community Seders in actual Judaism?
I had been thinking of it as pretty much a family ritual; I’m not Jewish but have attended a few Seders with families. I didn’t wish to discourage Smapti’s cultural explorations, but I was wondering how much of the typical experience is felt to be the family context, not just the doctrinal meaning.
In my limited Conservative experience, there are usually two Seders so you can attend a community one and either your own or a friend’s.
Yes, absolutely. While Passover is an important family holiday it’s – not quite a sin but a horrifying faux pas – to know of a Jew who doesn’t have a seder to go to, and not invite them.
Haggadah directs you tell the story to all who choose to listen, and states, “Let ALL who are hungry, come and eat.”
Arguably, Jewish tradition, at least as stated in the Haggadah and it is consistent with my experience, not only allows but requires that the community as a whole do something about people who don’t have family to celebrate with. Thus the tradition of community seders, to serve people who lack local family, or can’t cook for themselves, or are elderly, etc. sprung up. Many people attend them even if they do have family local (as above, going to two nights or more of seders).
By all means attend the community seder. Don’t bring anything.
It is my understanding that the current thinking is that the Last Supper was NOT a seder.
I have mixed feelings on the comments about Gentiles interacting with Chabad. I mean, the person wanted to go to a Seder. A Reform will be different than Reconstructionist or Hillel or Hasidic or child-friendly or Chocolate Seder and so forth. As long as the OP understands that different Jews do things different ways, he/she will be fine. You know what I like about the Chabad? If you’re hungry, they will help. If you can’t afford Hebrew lessons for your child, they will help. If you need certain ritualistic items and can’t afford them, well, they will get you a free mezuzah. I’m also in love with chabad.org.
I don’t want to make this a discussion about Chabad, but I just don’t think it’s fair to write off the Chabad as not a true Jewish experience.
It’s OK if people are different.
I mean, I’m extremely secular, but I HATE Reform services. I feel like I’m in church. Some people like tradition. If it works for you, it works for you, but since the OP isn’t Jewish, well, who are we to direct him to what is a “mainstream” Jewish experience? And who says “mainstream” is preferable, anyway?