Human trafficking *in the US* - Huge issue involving huge numbers or highly overblown?

It’s 2014 and in 2007 this article appeared in the Washington Post questioning the real world prevalence of human trafficking in *the US *based on reported crime stat numbers and confirmed cases of this activity being discovered and prosecuted. A lot of the responses to the article seemed to be along the lines of “Well it’s a hidden problem” and “Even one case is too many”.

The article looked closely at the statistics being quoted re human trafficking and found most were simply cobbled together guesstimates and overblown nonsense. A lot of legislation has been passed since then and hundreds of millions of dollars raised to fight this problem. Awareness campaigns for this are everywhere lately.

Websites like this one cite huge numbers.

A US Government reportof sex trafficking in the US had these numbers (page 398)

This National Council of State Legislatures website defines human trafficking as follows

It kind of seems that the original “human trafficking” picture of exploited child prostitutes presented originally has morphed into including run of the mill pimping of volitional sex workers. Since then and now have the article’s findings that (in the US) this is in reality a relatively tiny problem with a lot of dollars and PR chasing it been disproved or not?

What the hell is “run of the mill pimping?”

If you can’t quit without the threat of violence, it’s trafficking. Even if you are a sex worker, you get to choose.

I agree that many numbers are inflated, but it definitely happens. They’ve been busting nail salons and “massage” parlors (where the owner holds everyone’s passport “for safekeeping”) left and right around here.

I still remember seeing documentary footage of good ole Pablo Escobar’s PATH train type ceramic-walled tunnel under the US-Mexican border. It went undetected for years because when each laborer finished their task,
they were each sent out to a location for a Tap! Tap! final pay off.

There’s a really good reason why McCain forced all that “South West Border” AML regulation. Its not his fault that w/i two months of implementing it, all their US money men had moved north to Seattle or East to Chicago.
(you were wondering why that Huge spurt o’ murders happened last year? Thank the Cartels).

In truth, if 100% of the SW border AML regs were adopted in all 50 states, the cartels would have to move their money men trying to send drug & human trafficking money to locations outside of the US in Canada, Europe or Asia.

We’ve had threads on this topic before and they get vitriolic. 16-year old coerced girl? “Whine, we just defined underage as 15 or less.” Woman coerced by drugs, threats, debts, or emotional weakness? “Whine, no handcuffs? no outside lock on her bedroom? no coercion!”

We have one Doper who reported her experinece as a homeless youth; she could count her acquaintances who were working the streets and extrapolate. “Nanner, nanner, nanner. Anecdote’s not the singular of data!” The ignorance was stifling.

Many Dopers obviously have spent little time in “certain parts of a city.” No one knows the exact numbers and you’ll need to define your terms. Do 18-year olds captive to their own immaturity count or only 15-year olds literally kept chained up? Anyway, the high estimates are probably too high. But the low estimates are way way too low.

I have actually been wanting to post a thread like this, because NGOs will just roll up in a random country and announce “100,000 citizens have been kidnapped and trafficked into the sex industry” and they never once provide any kind of basis for this figure.

It is ludicrous, I’m not about to defend pimps or human traffickers but you can’t just pull a number out of your butthole.

Here’s the thing. If I wanted to find myself a grown-up prostitute, I think I could do so quite easily. I have done so a couple of times it in the past, though, admittedly not since several decades ago, and I never made a habit of it, but although the world has changed quite a lot since then, and although I have not made any deliberate efforts to keep up with how one finds oneself a prostitute, I have very little doubt that I could figure it out again quite easily if I wanted to. It was not hard to figure out, back when I was young and very naïve.

I have also (again admittedly, long in the past) quite a few times been to bars or walked down streets where prostitutes would solicit business from me or other passing guys, sometimes quite persistently. (With just a couple of exceptions, I always either ignored them or turned them down, even though some were quite persistent.)

I never saw anything, however, to suggest that any of them were being forced to prostitute themselves by men, or forced in any way, except perhaps by economic need. I suppose, in some cases, there may have been pimps in the background somewhere, but if so they were well out of sight, and in many cases I really find it very hard to believe that there was anything like that going on at all. The women (with maybe one exception - an offer I turned down) seemed to be in business for themselves, and fairly well in control of the transactions. (One of them I remember, had a large dog, presumably to keep the “Johns” in line.)

More to the point, however, I was never solicited by anyone who could conceivably have been underage, and never heard a ghost of a hint of anyone who might be offering to find me sex with underage girls. Although, as I said, I think I could probably quite easily figure out how to find myself a grown-up prostitute right now, if I wanted to, I have absolutely no idea how I would find myself an underage prostitute. The only possible ways I can think of to even look for one (like Googling), would, I should think, quite quickly get me arrested, and even if they somehow didn’t get me arrested, I have absolutely no confidence that they would actually work.

I do not doubt that underage prostitutes (and, also, technically adult, but young and vulnerable, women forced into “sexual slavery”) do exist, but it seems to me that if they existed in large numbers, there would have to be a large market and some degree of not-too-thoroughly-concealed marketing for them. You would see some signs of it if (as I once occasionally did) you hung around places where prostitution goes on. I never saw any such signs. I can only imagine that if you really do want to find an underage “enslaved” prostitute, you have to know someone, who knows someone, who knows someone … and all those someones will have to have some degree of trust in the next guy down the line. Business does sometimes get done in that sort of way, I suppose, especially criminal business, but it does not get done efficiently, in mass amounts.

It seems to me that if trafficked, underage prostitutes existed in large numbers in our society, many of us, or at least many men, and most men with any experience of the world of prostitution (even my quite limited sort of experience, as an observer and, on a very small handful of occasions, a client), would have occasionally been offered their services, or would know someone who had, or at least would have a pretty shrewd idea about how to go about finding them. I have never had a hint of such an offer (despite many “offers” from adult prostitutes - almost all refused), and I have no idea how I might go about finding such services. I conclude that they are very hard to come by, are probably only ever found via considerable persistence, and the taking of some serious risks, by people (who must, surely, be a tiny minority of men) who really, really crave such services, and that the numbers of people who provide the services (both the numbers of those who control the business, and the numbers of “slaves” they have to offer) are, therefore, quite small.

In short, if there were thousands upon thousand of people involved in this trade, we would all know about it, and many or even most men would either have been offered the services, or would know someone who had. We all know about the illegal drug trade after all, and most people, even if they have never bought illegal drugs themselves, have been offered them or at least know people who have been offered them. It just does not seem to be like that with the “sex trafficking” trade, presumably because it does not exist on anything remotely approaching the same scale.

…I know the exact thread you are referencing: and there was no ignorance involved.

I would politely request that you not misrepresent what was said in that thread. If anyone wants to know what actually went down, I suggest they read the thread in question.

This is the kind of thing that signals “hype” and not reality. Note that the line sounds like but does not say that there are 300,000 child prostitutes in the US. It says that there are 300,000 instances where some undefined risk factor for being prostituted exists, and what that risk factor might be is not mentioned.

Couple that with the actual statistic of 222 cases that were definitely established of sex trafficking. Notice also that the 222 is not confined only to child prostitution, but all sex trafficking.

It seems to me much more like “stranger danger” and the notion of the typical child molestor being a weirdo in a raincoat luring children into his car with candy. I am sure there are some cases of this, and they are as dreadful as they might be. But that doesn’t mean it isn’t mostly hype and hysteria. Same here, AFAICT.

Regards,
Shodan

Around here (Dallas and Houston), the primary mentions of this sort of thing are almost invariably in the context of immigrant women being transported here with promises of domestic help jobs, etc… and then being forced into sex work. Most commonly, it’s Mexican girls and teenagers (not women) being hoodwinked in Mexico, then forcibly transported here and set to work in sketchy brothels and in the back of Mexican bars. Or it’s Asian women having much the same kind of thing happen in massage parlors.

I’d be curious to see if there’s really much in the way of human trafficking outside of the immigrant angles AND not including “run of the mill pimping”.

A large dog isn’t going to help if the client has a gun. He can just shoot the dog and then rape the prostitute.

The ‘anecdotes are no substitute for evidence’ thing works both ways, you know. I tend to agree that the estimates of forced prostitution / child trafficking are exaggerated by lobbying interests (as a great many social problems are), but just because the prostitutes you saw seemed to be in control of the situation, doesn’t mean all or most of them are.

I shop at Target all the time. Doesn’t make me an expert on international commerce.

From the other thread that was linked to, here’s an article on the source of that 300K number:
http://www.villagevoice.com/2011-06-29/news/real-men-get-their-facts-straight-sex-trafficking-ashton-kutcher-demi-moore/

I wasn’t referring to that thread specifically, but please do read it. It contains posts like this one:

I remember driving through San Francisco’s theater district decades ago and seeing at least 100 streetwalkers. Perhaps there were other red-light districts as well. Add to this those “on other shifts”, several hundred working in advertised massage parlors, bars, as well as those more hidden and it’s easy to conclude that there are at least 1000 prostitutes working in San Francisco at any one time, probably much more. Because of the high turnover, you’d need to multiply by a largish factor to get women who have ever worked as prostitutes. Extrapolate to the entire U.S.A. and the number of prostitutes is certainly in 6 digits, and, even accounting that places like S.F. will have much more than “their share,” likely over a million altogether.

How many of these are “coerced” or “underage”? I don’t know but the most criminal encounters will not be easily advertised or seen.

And there are many 18-year olds who, through immaturity, drugs, debt, or threats are easily coerced. Are these not victims, or do only 15-year olds count?

I’ve already stipulated that some of the most alarming numbers seem way off the mark. But one can reject specific numbers and still recognize that the problem is serious.

Despite being mis-used, “at risk of _____” is a useful thing to assess…it’s not just a meaningless number. I work on programs for people who undertake a pretty specific high-risk act. Knowing the risk factors and the numbers behind them help us understand if it makes more sense to put our resources into prevention or in to helping people who are already caught up in problems.

Have you actually spoken to some of those entrepreneurs you had dealings with? Coercion takes many forms, physical, mental, emotional, pharmaceutical… Just because you didn’t see it doesn’t mean it isn’t there.

True, but it’s also fair to ask where this (claimed) huge cohort of exploited underage sex workers is located. Based on news articles I’ve read on the topic, and even some discussions here prostitutes mainly use the web to market themselves these days and do not use pimps, and the notion of a pimp with a stable of prostitutes he is controlling is increasingly rare. If these underage sex workers are not on the street, not on the web, and more or less invisible to people like njtt who travel in areas where they are aggressively solicited by sex workers, and they aren’t showing up in crime statistics … where is this army of underage prostitutes?

Thanks for this. It appears to be at best a wild exaggeration, as I expected.

Certainly, but if one assesses risk factors and finds that one of them is having access to a car and living near Canada, and that the study was never peer-reviewed, then I wouldn’t make any decisions based on it at all.

Regards,
Shodan

Well, the risk factors in my case are basically being under 30 and from a certain country, so yeah, it can be rather broad. It’s still helpful to know how many people at risk there are and where they are conceptrated. It’s also helpful to have that baseline so you can do further study on who goes on the the risky thing and start to tease out why.

Yes, better science would be better, but better science is expensive and nobody wants to fund studying human trafficking over actually combatting human trafficking.

That’s often the problem, isn’t it - people want to spend tax money fixing a problem before they even know if it exists.

Regards,
Shodan

…you called out the other posters in that thread as ignorant. They were not. Quoting a particular post does not change that.

And lets just leave it at that.