I don't know how to be a good son.

One of the downsides of being a terminal social leper is the rare times when I really feel the need to vent off emotion; inanimate objects and small animals don’t really provide a satisfying sounding board. My ability to successfully understand and communicate with people is practically nonexistent, and always has been. Whatever psychic antennae other people use to interpret the actions and intentions of their fellows, I either never had, or else lost at an early age.

I’ve seen others post about all sorts of emotionally charged events, full of tragedy and anger and personal revelation, all for an audience of internet strangers to witness. I never could fathom why anyone would want to do such a thing. Now I find myself with absolutely no other outlet, so I’m going to stand here in the town square to whine and scream for a while. I figure the worst I can do is poison the well irrevocably and I’ll be out a subscription fee.

Any hoo. Ten years ago, my mom got remarried. She had been living by herself for a few years, and got involved with a fellow named Jimmy, a security guard at her apartment complex. Mom was lonely, he was always at the front gate with a smile, etc. From the start I admit I wasn’t keen on the guy, but on the other hand I didn’t want to stand in the way of Mom’s happiness either. So I bit my tongue and tried to act supportive.

So they got married. However, this meant that Mom had to move out of her newly purchased apartment, because the complex frowned on resident/staff relationships and Jimmy was afraid he’d lose his job. So she sold the place at a loss and took out a mortgage on a new house. Then she purchased him a brand new SUV as a wedding present, because she knew how embarrassed he was by his crappy used car.

It transpired that Jimmy was a drunk. Mom knew this beforehand, but thought that she could change him after marriage. Another thing she knew beforehand and neglected to share with me was that Jimmy’s previous marriage broke up amid domestic battery issues. She sensed that this information might upset me.

So. For some years, she and the drunk have maintained a generally stable co-existence (the term “marriage” hasn’t really applied in spirit for a while; Mom revealed to me after one of their arguments that they haven’t actually been physically intimate since the first year of marriage, when he infected her with herpes). He hasn’t been overtly abusive, you see; like any good freeloader, he knows which side his bread is buttered on, because she owns the house.

So he has limited himself to relatively minor displays of disrespect, such as the huge collection of pinup girls he has plastered the garage walls with, and his insistence on driving her car to work so that his precious SUV won’t get rained on (!!), and his habit of throwing out her stuff without asking, and the fact that he killed her hearing-ear service dog through overfeeding even though she repeatedly begged him not to.

Throughout all of this, I have been too dense to understand how to address the matter effectively. My concern was for her happiness, and discussing the subject made her unhappy; she didn’t want to hear it, please change the subject now. Sometimes, after one of their arguments, she’d talk about telling him to take a walk, and I admit I took those opportunities to try and encourage her along that line of thought.

But it’s never happened, obviously. At this point, she seems more upset at the thought of being alone. Somewhere along the line she’s become agoraphobic, and on some level she seems to believe that she needs him to run errands and go shopping for her. After my dad died, I was amazed and so proud of how she came out from under his shadow, taking charge of the household, keeping the family going. Now she seems like a borderline invalid, and I don’t even know how much is genuine physical infirmity and how much is just in her mind.

Shortly before Christmas I stopped in for a visit, and they got into an argument over some trivial thing or other. He was drunk, of course, and eventually started shouting at her so loudly that she fled into the garage, crying; he followed, screaming slurred obscenities for the whole neighborhood to hear about how much he did for her.

I was right there when it happened, and I didn’t do a. fucking. thing.

I was genuinely stunned; he’d never, ever allowed himself to go off like that in my presence before. After he staggered back into the house, Mom broke out of her crying jag and begged me not to follow him. She was okay, she was fine, don’t talk about it, change the subject. And I let her. I couldn’t think of any good options. Confront him? What the hell would the point be, when he’s roaring drunk and won’t even remember what he said in ten minutes?

So I visited with mom instead, and he stayed hidden in the back room. What else should I have done? Yelled my head off at the bleary, barely conscious drunk? Definitely; probably; maybe; answer unclear, ask again later. Over and over in my mind, to no purpose, and it won’t stop. I know I fucked up. I know I should have done something.

Mom often calls in the evenings: how was work, what are you up to, etc. A couple of days ago we’re chatting pleasantly, same old conversation, and just apropos of nothing, perfectly normal tone of voice: “You know, I probably shouldn’t be telling you this, but Jimmy hit me the other night.”

A couple of nights ago. Really. Why? Oh, we were arguing. About what? His drinking. How hard did he hit you? Oh, hard enough to leave a red mark for about 15 minutes. Did it leave a bruise? No. Did you take a picture? No. What did you do? Hit him back. It’s all over now; things have settled down, he said he was sorry, it’s fine. * Has he hit you again? No. Is he there now? Yes, why? Is he drunk? He’s getting ready for work. * Put him on the phone. Why? Because I want to talk to him. No, I don’t want him to know I told you. Things are fine; don’t get me upset; change the subject; change the subject.

So I got in the car and started driving to St. Pete, intending to catch him at work, the one place he isn’t drunk. He hit my mom. She won’t be there. I’ll just have a talk with him, let him know that I know what he did, that a repeat of this behavior isn’t acceptable. He hit my mom.

I got about twenty miles out before the second-guessing started. First and foremost, the ironclad certainty that I would inevitably fuck things up even worse. * Is this really the right thing to do? I can’t read people. He hit my mom. Can I act reasonably when I’m this mad? I’m going to screw this up, aren’t I? It’s been ten years and this has never happened before; what if he’s as shocked as I am, and resolved to never let it happen again? It’s already been two days; they’ve already made up with each other. If I do this, Mom will never confide in me again.*

I turned around.

As it turned out, the next day I had an appointment with the doctor who prescribes the meds that keep me from putting a hammer through my skull. We chatted for an hour; unfortunately, we spent the first 45 minutes working out whether she would be ethically required to file a report of spouse abuse if I described the problem. Eventually, after third-party arbitration was called in, we determined that such a minor isolated incident wouldn’t fall under those parameters. She advised me to read up on domestic battery and Al-Anon, here’s your renewed prescription, see you in three weeks.

So, my psychiatric counselor doesn’t appear to think it’s a big enough deal to worry about. Fair enough; it’s not her mom, after all. But then, my mom also doesn’t seem to think it’s big enough to worry about.

My birthday’s a couple days from now, and Mom wants us both to go to the “History of Dogs” exhibit at the Florida International Museum. I expect Mom to cry at least once at some reminder of her late service dog, whom she really loved. Perhaps the exhibit will have some literature about the history of overfeeding dogs until they get too fat to urinate and have to be put to sleep.

She called yesterday to make plans. Again, apropos of nothing: “By the way, Jimmy knows you’re upset with him.”

Oh? Really? How would he know that? *Well, I told him that you know about him hitting me. (why did she do this? totally forgot to ask) * He said if you’re angry about it, you should talk to him. Really. If I’m angry about him hitting you, Mom? IF I’m angry? Well. By all means, put him on the phone right now, please. *No; don’t make me upset. *

What does any of that even mean? First she lets slip to me that he hit her; then, after I do nothing at her explicit request, she lets slip to him that I know he hit her. Is this intentional? I’m 36 fucking years old, and I don’t even know how my own Mom thinks.

Obviously I’ll need to confront him, but how far does she want me to take it? Does she need me to force the issue because she can’t bring herself to eject the shitbag?

All I can think of is this other time long ago, shortly after my dad died. My younger brother was going through this angry, abusive phase, and Mom kept dropping all these hints that he was out of control, that she couldn’t discipline him effectively by herself, etc. So one time he was doing something, screaming at her, I don’t even remember what it was, so I smacked him against the wall because I thought that’s what she expected of me. And she instantly went to pieces, shrieking at the top of my lungs for me to stop, for us both to stop fighting. And my brother of course also started in screaming at me, accusing me of trying to take Dad’s place. I am so very sorry for that moment. My brother hated me.

I don’t want to fail her like this. I love her, but I don’t know what I ought to be doing for her. I’ve managed to fuck up everything else in my life already, and have contributed amply to other lives being fucked up and derailed, jsut by existing. I can feel the new fuckup bearing down on me.

The last couple of days have been bad. The birthday thing isn’t helping. I had to leave work early today, because my mind just will not settle down and be quiet. It’s not even a consistently bad mood, there’s weirdly elated intervals too, like a pendulum. I’ve been laughing. I have this sensation that feels like electric waves washing through my brain, a slow fizzing pulse, that is familiar from other times when I’ve been really deeply upset. Even with that feeling, though, things are relatively stable, which I attribute to the medication evening things out somewhat. For the last year I’ve been getting stress migraines, but this isn’t like that, more like a smooth tension or pressure inside my head.

Wow, I’ve typed a lot tonight. Will it make a difference? Who knows. At least now some of this stuff is somewhere outside my head. That’s got to be worth something. Was it a good idea? Let’s find out.

I have absolutely no advice for you. That will be coming along shortly, I think.

But I read, and I listened.

I am as socially crippled as you are, so I have no useful advice. However, I’ve felt like the worst child ever before because of circumstances beyond my control too, so you have my deepest sympathies. I received a lot of excellent advice from these boards at the time, so hopefully those same people are right behind me.

hug

This stinks, you are in a bad situation. Keep this in mind; your mom is in a terrible situation. She appears to be confused and asking for help.

Do not get into a situation where you get physical with the idiot drunk. Do seek help. Try to talk your Mom into throwing him out. Get her to a victims help group for semi-expert advice. Help your Mom even if she does not admit to wanting help.

Does your Mom have siblings you can enlist for an intervention?

Is there anyone in the family that could convince your Mom to file a complaint?

Again: Do not go back and get physical with the drunken fool. Just work to convince your Mom to toss him out.

Jim

I hate to sound cold but your mom has to make her own decisions about this “relationship”. If she wants to stay with some douche that hits her that is her own problem. She needs to grown a spine and kick him to the curb.

Yeah, where’s MandaJo and DangerMom?

What you said about your mom being strong after your dad died – she did that for you and your brother. Maybe that’s the way to go – let her know that she’ll be helping you if she helps herself.

For starters, tell her you need to know she’s safe, and ask her how you can help. Maybe spend more time with her, so Jimmy knows she’s not alone.

That is pretty cold. It is his Mom, not a friend. Why shouldn’t he try to help her? Why would she say anything about it, if she was not confused and looking for some kind of help? It sounds like there is little chance of her growing a spine on her own.

Jim {Caveat: Of course I am just an opinionated internet stranger}

This is my second time here in your thread, because I just didn’t know what to say. However, I’ve thought about it a bit and I’m going to give it a try.

First you need to decide exactly what practical and emotional support you can be to your mother, (and I realize that may not be much due to your own issues). Then you should get her off alone somewhere, and and ask her to please listen to you just this one time. Tell her you know she doesn’t want to talk about it, but you’re asking her to listen just this once. Then, state your concerns, tell her what you are willing/able to do to help, and tell her that even though you are not going to bring it up again, you are willing to talk to her about it if/when she is ready to bring it up. I think you need to emphasize that respecting her wishes with regard to talking about it doesn’t mean that your offer of help isn’t long-standing. Then after having this talk I think you need to back off. You can’t make her accept your help. Hopefully, having support from you will be enough for her to decide to kick the bum out. I’m not suggesting you back off from your relationship with her, only that you do not discuss the marriage unless she asks for your help. I imagine that things will only get worse unless or until she makes a stand. However, she is an adult and responsible for her own decisions no matter how much you hate them.

Then, you need to let yourself off the hook. I think she is being somewhat manipulative with the whole, telling you, asking you to stay out of it, and then telling him that you know. Perhaps she thinks she’ll be safe if her husband knows that you know that he hit her. Personally, I wouldn’t count on that. But either way, after you offer her what you can the rest is up to her.

Also, I don’t know you, but I can pretty safely say that unless you have children you are in the end responsible only to and for yourself. I’m not saying people shouldn’t care about the effect they have on other people, and be assholes, but if you were being an asshole, and it affected other people, they should have taken steps to relieve themselves of your affect, just as your mother should relieve herself of her husband. I’m not trying to excuse bad behavior, but I do believe that people need to start taking responsibility for their own emotional well-being, and let others do the same.

Get help. Experienced abuse counselor, and a lawyer. You pay the bill, so your mom won’t try to use that as an excuse. If the jerk objects in even a whisper, tell him you will add a cop to the list without hesitation.

Tell your mom you suck at this, but you really love her, and you can’t let her become another dreary abuse statistic. So, everyone agrees up front to the presence of the counselor, or they deal with the lawyer. I not, the cop takes over.

What you have described is already criminal abuse. Get the lawyer to explain that to your mom. This is gonna cost you a thousand or more, but not all at once.

You are not unique in this problem. But you need to act, for your mom, and for yourself.

Tris

Good. You shouldn’t have. You can’t make a drunk listen to sense and he didn’t do worse to your mom. Had you gone to hit him or something, it could have escalated.

Right.

No, because you didn’t know what. Your doc gave you some information on Al-Anon; you’ll get excellent advice there.

Quit being so hard on yourself. He’s got issues and you are powerless to repair them. You made the right choice to turn around.

Please do.

My guess would be that she could hint to her husband that she has a younger and stronger son.

Terrifel, not even the best of shrinks can read minds. A relationship with an abusive person is complicated, and people get into them and stay in them for complicated reasons. I’m betting your mom wishes this wasn’t happening but doesn’t want her whole life to have to change and is hoping that it might just all change someday. That happens a lot.

If you force the issue, the drunk’ll be unhappy and then probably be mean to her so she’ll be unhappy. She’s unhappy when he’s bad to her. She’s between a rock and a hard place and either way, you just push her into one of them.

Not a good plan. Please, please, please read the DV information and call and speak to your local DV helpline and ask what they suggest and what facilities there are in your area.
Also, look up a Safety Plan and give one to your mom when you see her. Go over it with her and tell her she can go to your place anytime if she needs to. Here’s one good site ; there are many others.

You did what you thought she wanted. She’s conflicted and confused, and, as I said before, she just hopes it will go away.

Get as much information as you can about domestic violence and alcoholism and then pass on the information to her. Be sure she fills out that form and encourage her to talk to a DV centre. Others are right that she has to make the decision; all you can do is give her information, support her, and encourage her to make different choices. But she may not, and you need to be prepared for that.

I am sorry to hear you feel so bad about your life, and I know how black life can look when your chemistry is out of whack, but it’s not your fault she’s in this situation, nor will it be your fault if she stays there. She’s a grown woman and can make her own choices.

How do I know this? I was in a violent relationship. I could type a whole lot more to you about the inner dynamics of this sort of thing, but you’re not up for it, I’m sure.

I promise you the very best thing you can do is arm yourself with information and then give it to her.

Pool, you clearly know zilch about DV. Best you should reserve your remarks to subjects that you have some knowledge of.

I don’t know shit about domestic violence? My dad in a drunken rage put a shotgun in my mother’s hands and told her to kill herself. I just don’t have much sympathy for people who don’t get themselves out of those situations even if they’re scared.

I liked the way you wrote about your predicament, Terrifel.

Your mom sounds like she tends to be on the dependent side. People often confuse dependence with avoidance, because they look a lot the same – things don’t get done that need doing, like reconnecting with an out of control grieving teenager and leaving a dangerous relationship. The difference is that dependent types don’t just leave things lying there untended and undone – they try to get someone else to take care of them for them, often because they feel helpless. It would seem you are that person for your mother. It’s not particularly fair, but I think you are.

There are a few possible outcomes:

  • you can continue to try to do stuff for your mom, and she can continue to act out her ambivalence about it
  • you can continue to try to do stuff for your mom, and she can be ok with it though you don’t seem to be
  • you can stop doing stuff for your mom, hoping that she will end up doing it
  • you can stop doing stuff for your mom, and she can stop asking and reporting about it

Maybe you can think of others. It’s easy for me to say, of course, but you seem to be uncertain of which outcome you see as best. What you need to do will be a lot clearer once you decide.

I’m sorry your dad was that way and it was horrible for you, but I’m afraid that you’ve not been on the right side of this to truly understand. Answers to situations like this are never that simple. Not. At. All.

Really? What makes this situation so extremely difficult? I agree a divorce can be a long and messy process, but her getting out of the house or having the husband leave is not so difficult.

I know that there will be a lot of conflicting opinions about what to do, but can we keep the actual arguing to a minimum? I don’t think that’s going to help Terriel think clearly about this at all.

Someone who is a longtime victim of domestic violence develops a victim mentality - on some level they believe that they deserve no better, or that they are helpless. Breaking free of this mindset is not always easy, otherwise you would never hear of women going back to their abusive husbands.

Terrifel, you can’t force your mom to leave and never look back, and you shouldn’t go stalking her husband. That will only end badly for someone, and not necessarily for him. Tell your mom you love her, that she can leave him if she wants to, and that you can help her with that process once she makes up her mind. But if you go in and try to kick his ass and drag her away for her own good, things will get ugly fast.

Don’t do this to yourself. Please. My husband did this to himself for years, putting so much pressure on himself to make his father treat his mother right. Every time things escalated, his self-esteem would plummet. He was a fucking wreck: “Why didn’t I say anything? Why did I just stand there? Why can’t I fix this?” Then one night his father went off and started choking her–he wasn’t there, but I swear to god he was convinced it was his fault it happened. Don’t put this on you. This isn’t on you. This is on your mother and her husband, you are responsible for nobody else’s happiness but your own. The reason you feel like such a fuck-up is because you mistakenly believe that you have any control over this situation. You don’t. I’m sorry.

I’m not saying you can’t be supportive and encouraging and try to help your mother out–I’m not implying you should be enabling and pretend everything’s fine. But ultimately the decision to walk away lies in her hands. The fact that it sounds like he’s got a lot of control over her indicates to me that starting altercations and confrontations with her husband is just going to increase the risk of her establishing distance from you in the interest of pleasing him.

I might be biased based on my experience with in In-Laws, but this sounds incredibly manipulative on your mother’s part. I get the impression the reason you feel like this is your fault is because to a certain extent she acts like it IS on you. I can’t imagine why else she would tell him you know and are angry unless she wanted to start shit between you two, and wanted you to take care of her and stand up and be the hero. I’m sorry. I’m just really getting the “passive aggressive co-dependent mother” vibe here. I could be totally wrong, but you may want to consider how often guilt is a factor in your relationship with her, and where that’s coming from.

Please just… let yourself be at peace, let yourself let it go and know it’s not your responsibility. My heart really goes out to you… this one’s hitting me hard. huggles

For what it’s worth, I think you’ve handled the situation perfectly so far. Confronting him while you’re angry would be one of the worst things you could have done, and you’ve avoided that. And I think posting to the Dope was a good move. In a situation like this, hearing the opinions of people not involved in the mess can really help you get your thoughts in order. And you certainly could’ve picked a worse community than the Dope.

However you decide to handle the situation, by far the most important thing you can do is be there for your mother. That may sound like a given, but consider this: if you hadn’t turned your car around that day, you could have lost your head while confronting him, and you could have ended up in jail. If you’re in jail, you’re not exactly there for her.

And make sure she knows that you’ll always there for her. The fact that she has been opening up to you leads me to believe she already knows this. Don’t let her think otherwise.

And continue seeking help and advice. You’ve been given some good leads by your doctor and other dopers–follow up on them. I doubt that even the most level-headed person in the world could handle this situation without outside help.

Careful there. You don’t need to confront him unless you’re absolutely certain you won’t make things worse.

Terrifel,
I read your post and think you are a very awesome human being. You dont need to worry about being a good son.

I would offer advice, but honestly I’m a wee bit tipsy. Tomorrow, I promise I’ll re-read this and offer my best advice.

Take care,
Autolycus