I was browsing some auto sites earlier tonight when I came across The Zhonghua. A Chinese sedan now available in Europe and in the U.S. sometime soon. It’s no Daewoo-like el-cheapo, either: The folks at Brilliance, makers of the car, expect it to compete with the likes of the Camry and Accord and are pricing it accordingly: $25,000 to $30,000! So what do you get for that kind of money? All kinds of fun things:
Why, that sounds beautiful! How does it drive?
I love it when unlimited driving pleasure incurs upon me. How luxurious is it?
I gotta admit, my Mazda 3 doesn’t spontaneously comfort me in a sublime fashion. And safety?
Well, they might not have been totally honest with that one. (I know, I’m shocked too. It turns out that during a European crash test, it performed only slightly better than a can of RC Cola at not crumpling up and dismembering everything inside. YouTube video.
Serious question: What were Japanese cars like 25-30 years ago or Korean cars like until fairly recently? I could see Chinese cars in the US some day, but I expect lots of lousy cars with hilariously bad manuals and the like for years first.
Datsun 280z. Legendary sports car. Light, agile. Bit of a tendency to rust, but what didn’t?
Honda Prelude / Civic. Small. Efficient. Better than the American cars even then. Sipped gas. More reliable than anything on the road.
Toyota Celica, and the first Camry. Looks a lot like an American pony car. Again, already more reliable than anything. Hatchbacks, too.
Ford? My god, was that a horrid Mustang.
Chevy? Citation, anyone?
Yeah, but did you watch the crash test video? In a frontal impact, the entire front end of the car, including the front half of the passenger box, collapses and crumples up like a pop can, no kidding, with the door springing open and disintegrating, and what looks like the entire chassis being deformed by the impact at 0:32.
Compare and contrast with this crash test video. At 4:14 watch a 2007 Dodge Caliber in a 40 mph frontal impact not collapse and crumple up like a pop can. The passenger box stays intact.
And at 4:45 watch the split screen test with a 2000 Dodge Neon (“Marginal”) with the 2007 Caliber (“Good”). The Neon crumples up just like the Brilliance, only not quite as catastrophically, as the back end doesn’t deform with impact.
American and Japanese cars that are “Made in China” are made to American and Japanese specs. The Brilliance is made to Chinese specs. World of difference.
That’s a little premature. The Nanjing Chang’an Ford Mazda factory is in test production now. Full production won’t start until January.
My job requires me to work with the majority of the foreign OEM’s and their JV’s in China. Without going into detail, everyone is leary of the Chinese. That said, the kwality issues are huge and the liability even bigger. Remember that recent tire issue?
Building a car to global safety specs, tracing the parts, and being able to handle a warranty and recall is currently far beyond the ability of Chinese OEM’s. chrysler may make the first foray into Chinese production by outsouring to Chery a mini-car destined for the US. We shall see.
Of course, I do remember when a Datsun was a tin can and a rubber band…look at Nissan these days.
Mazdas for the North American market are not made in China. I don’t think the Chinese government allows foreign automakers to make cars in China for export yet.
Brilliance is BMW’s joint venture partner in China, they assemble BMW 3 and 5 series cars for the Chinese market. SO most of the design cues and manufacturing tech would be from BMW.
Yeah, expecting it to be competitive with the Camry is a little optimistic - It’s not as if Toyota doesn’t make and sell Camrys in China, so one wonders if they seriously expect Chinese buyers, let alone western ones, to pay the same price for such rubbish.
China Guy, what about Haima, the FAW/Mazda JV in Hainan?
While I laugh now, I realize the Chinese are probably only 5-10 years away from debuting a competitive car in the U.S. market. I remember when my uncle got a Kia Sephia in 1993 and we all laughed at the little tin box. Now look at the Optima and Sedona… no one’s laughing now.
I guess what surprises me is that they’re trying to compete immediately on such a high level. How can they possibly expect to sell such a mediocre car for $20,000? If they were aiming for a price point below the Kias and Hyundais, that would make more sense.
Everyone starts somewhere , the Model A was probably overpriced and crudely assembled. And like the Lada and the Niva , its likely going to domestic consumption for their burgeoning middle class.
haima was never a JV. Haima produced kit cars (CDK) under license from Mazda.
China does export cars. mainly to iran & russia. IIRC shanghai VW exports a couple hundred Polo’s to Austra;ia.
China exports billions of dollars worth of spare parts to the west. could be $10+ billion
s.
Brilliance is the JV partner with BMW. it is Briallince-BMW that makes the BMW 3 (manual) & BMW 5 (almost fully robotic). the factory is spotless. both the 3 &5 are CKD.
Brilliance is an old state owned enterprise and night and day difference with brilliance-BMW
I thought it was the foreign JVs that are not allowed to export? Maybe this is the old Polo from the 1980s and VW has signed over the rights entirely to Shanghai VW?
Actually, while crudely assembled, the Model A was not overpriced. Nor was the Model T, which is probably what you’re thinking of. Wasn’t all that crudely assembled, either.
Yes, but when Japan first invaded our market, they set their prices at discount levels. China is trying the dubious tactic of marketing their piece of trash as a luxury vehicle. I wonder how much money they’ll lose before they realize that’s a poor strategy?
Fuck Chinese anything. My personal goal is to go the rest of my life without purchasing a single thing made in China. It will be hard, and require sacrifices, but I’m willing to make the effort. Fuck them and the Middle Kingdom they rode in on.
I’ll grant you the safety issue, but your average car of 1950 was a lot less shoddily built than your average car of 1980, if only because the 1950 car didn’t contain nearly as much plastic, or flimsy light-gauge sheet metal put in to save weight and drive up the mileage numbers.
This is probably the first time in recorded history that a 280Z has been described as “light”. Agile only in comparison to a UPS truck, or a Kenworth.
A 240Z was light. A 260 was heavier, a 280 was heavier yet. A 280Z was not a light sports car. It was best described as a heavy battle cruiser.
