[QUOTE=Joey P]
Besides, he’s a business owner as well, he knows how it goes. And you’d be wise to have his business.
[/QUOTE]
Unless his “number” would net a loss for the dealer. Lose a little on each sale, but make up for it in volume. :rolleyes:
Bottom line for me is, if you don’t have the balls to negotiate, pay the sticker price and suck it up. Otherwise, educate yourself on what the lowest price you can pay that the seller will take and stick to it. Knowledge is power.
[QUOTE=Gatopescado]
Unless his “number” would net a loss for the dealer. Lose a little on each sale, but make up for it in volume. :rolleyes:
[/QUOTE]
He’s good at getting a great deal, he’s not unreasonable. The dealer (or salesperson) should also have that magic number in their head, the lowest they’ll go. He’s just asking the salesperson to cut the three days of back and forth phone tag BS and give them the lowest price they’re willing to sell the car for, if it’s a good number he’ll buy, if it’s to high, he’ll walk. Nothing personal, it’s just the way he does business. Between 4 kids, himself, his wife and all of his work vehicles, he’s had a lot of expierence buying cars. I’ll say it again, as a dealer, he’s the guy you want to make happy, since 1996 (when I started driving, so that’s as far back as I’ve paid attention) he’s bought 10 cars/trucks, 8 of those vehicles (possible all, I’m not sure about 2 of them) were purchased (or leased) and financed from one dealership. He also does 99% of the warranty work through that same dealer.
And before this discussion turns into an argument, I should mention that his ‘number’ is just what he is willing to pay at that time. Obviously anyone should walk away from a deal if the salesperson can’t give them a price that is at or below what they are willing to pay. If no one can match it, no big deal, he’ll try again another time/another vehicle (or model year)/another number. We try to buy cars before we need them so were not desperate. On his second tahoe, no one hit his ‘number’ so he went back a few months later and someone did hit it and he bought it that day.
No matter what “expensive” item you are buying, it pays to do your research on pricing, demand and market conditions.
The other BIG thing is to have a price in mind , based upon that research when you first approach the business.
I bought a 2008 Honda Fit a few months ago (May). I went in armed with thr following:
Salesperson sat down and quoted me a price $500 below their srp (Suggested retail price)…
I responded with a price $500 above their wholesale price,and asked for a few options “thrown in” free. She told me that she couldn’t take that to her manager as he wouldn;t even look at it. I told her IO was the customer, and mentioned the other Honda dealerships in the area, and how I would regret having to shift my business and future recommendations to them. She went and (*as expected) came back saying- “he won’t consider it.”… I responded by raising my price $500 and knocking off one of the options I wanted for free.
Long story short, I got the car for about $2000 less than srp, witha few options thrown in for free (The ones I “gave up” I didn’t want/need - they were barganing chips that cost me nothing).
Upon signing, the sales manager said to me “We won’t be selling a Fit for less than this for the rest of the year…”
regards
FML
PS: A few weeks after the deal was made, I wrote to Honda Canada, and praised the Dealership, mentioning both salesperson and manager by name… feathering my nest for when I go back, (if they are still there). A few weeks ago I recieved a gift basket from the dealership that was worth easily $100.
I work as an Assistant Manager in a retail electronics store, and our prices are not generally open to negotiation.
See that price on the shelf there? That’s my best price on the item. Now, if you want to add a warranty, and some extras/accessories, then maybe I can take a few bucks off the overall price or throw in a free memory card/bag… but for single-item purchases, the price on the item is our best price, take it or leave it.
[QUOTE=Tastes of Chocolate]
you made them guess what the magic target cost you came up with is, and they guessed $500 high?
[/quote]
He didn’t make him guess anything, he asked what was his best price. That’s a straightforward question.
If he quoted a “best price” and then offered a lower best price, then he lied.
It depends precisely upon what is said, but generally I don’t think calling someone who offers you a price a robber or a scam artist or a thief is fair, just because they’d offer you a lower price if they thought they’d have to. Everyone tries to earn what they can for what they have. There’s no law that says that an offer must be the lowest, first and last.
If you offer to accept $55,000 per annum for a job, are you a thief or a robber if the employer agrees to let you have that when you would have taken $53,000 pa for the same job if that’s all they’d offered?
[QUOTE=clairobscur]
If he quoted a “best price” and then offered a lower best price, then he lied.
[/QUOTE]
The lower price isn’t their “Best” price, it’s the “If this guy walks, we lose the sale and get our asses kicked by Head Office, so screw the margin and just sell it to him at cost plus tax and a few bucks to keep us out of the red if he’s got money in his pocket” price.
Their “Best” price is the earlier quoted price- the one in which the customer is getting a discount on the item and the seller is still making enough money on the deal to make it worth their while.
I agree with Tastes of Chocolate; salespeople are under enough pressure as it is without being chastised by people like your Dad for failing to guess the magic number they were thinking of.
[QUOTE=Joey P]
My dad’s rule of thumb when buying a car…He’ll go in with a price in his mind, anything above it and he walks, anything below it and he’ll purchase. He’ll go up to a sales person and say “Give me your absolute best possible lowest price in this car right here” If it’s higher then his number he walks out, and god help the sales person if they say “Wait, sir, I can do better” Now, you’re a liar and you will be chastised for it.
[/QUOTE]
Fuck that. I have no problem with his system. Each customer has his or her own way of making decisions.
What is fuck up is to call salesmen liars.
Because how does the salesman know that this particular customer has this particular system and isn’t just one of the other 1,000 customers who ask for the best price and then try to bargain for additional money off? How well does he explain the system? How does the salesman know that he’s not a ringer for someone else who will come in, armed with this information, and will then attempt a better deal? How does he know that your father really will buy at that price?
If your father wants to play that game, and it’s a game, then that’s fine, just don’t be an ass because the salesman who doesn’t know him from Adam has to try to figure out what the game is, and how to tell the difference between his game and the other 1,000 customers’ games.
Ok, ok… In the light of the latest posts, I withdraw my statements…
Flip side… As a salesman who always gives the best price I really dislike people who try and haggle after I’ve given it.
That said, haggling has become a lot less common in the UK, IME.
[QUOTE=TokyoPlayer]
Because how does the salesman know that this particular customer has this particular system and isn’t just one of the other 1,000 customers who ask for the best price and then try to bargain for additional money off? How well does he explain the system? How does the salesman know that he’s not a ringer for someone else who will come in, armed with this information, and will then attempt a better deal? How does he know that your father really will buy at that price?
[/QUOTE]
He doesn’t care if the salesman knows his ‘game.’ Why would he care? Every person walks into a dealership with a different strategy, I hardly think any of them find it neccesary to explain it before they start talking to the salesperson, why should he?
ETA if your ‘best price’ is $3000 higher then your willing to actually sell the car for (you tell him $38000 and you’re willing to go as low as $35k) and the number in his head is $38500, you’ll still get the sale, and make more then you planned on making. So this can work for both sides.
Like I said before, every person (at least every person should) go into a dealership with a number in their head that represents the most they are willing to pay for a car. Every person should walk out if the dealership can’t meet that number. My father just likes to cut all the BS. There’s a lot of dealerships in our area, one of them usually manages to get the sale without all the bargining.
Oh, and this is really no different then one of the new ways to buy a car that’s becoming more popular. Email all the dealerships in your area with exactly what you’re looking for (White, Ford Escape, 2008, sunroof, Satellite radio, heated seats etc etc etc) and ask them for their best price. Then you purchase the car from the person that gives you the best price (provided, of course, that it’s within your budget). This method involves very little, if any, haggling at all. Each dealership get’s one chance to give you their best price, if it’s too high, they lose the sale. End of story. If I’m willing to pay $35,000 for that car, three dealerships say $36,500 and one says $34,900 why should I give the other dealerships another chance, I’ll just buy it from the one that gave me the best price (all thing being equal.)
I’m sure the anti-negotiators would love living in places like the Middle East, where haggling is a way of life.
Or buying higher-ticket items at garage sales. Who pays the asking price for used stuff?
Please tell me there are Canadian websites like Kelley Blue Book where you get true cost information on cars and what most people are paying, without having to fork over a fee to sign up. These sites have undoubtedly saved me dough in car negotiations - although my experience is that dealers will act reasonably on new car pricing, then turn into hyenas when it comes time to discuss trade-in value.
[QUOTE=Jackmannii]
I’m sure the anti-negotiators would love living in places like the Middle East, where haggling is a way of life.
[/QUOTE]
Don’t get me wrong, I love to haggle- but only when it’s appropriate. Mexican market? Yup. Arab bazaar? Yup. Woolworths? Er, no.
[QUOTE=Joey P]
Like I said before, every person (at least every person should) go into a dealership with a number in their head that represents the most they are willing to pay for a car. Every person should walk out if the dealership can’t meet that number. My father just likes to cut all the BS. There’s a lot of dealerships in our area, one of them usually manages to get the sale without all the bargining.
[/QUOTE]
I’ve got no problem with that, and everyone should decide how much money they want to spend. People shouldn’t let pressure salesmen talk them into it.
The problem I have with your father is that he’s playing his game of getting his best price possible. Otherwise, he would simply walk into a dealer with a check for the amount he’s willing to pay and turn it over.
No, he plays a game, which he is in rights to do, and then is being an ass when other people play the standard game.
He doesn’t have to be a dick about it. If the guy doesn’t guess his magic number the first time around, and has hedged his bets, just walk out. There’s no reason to start calling people liars.
[QUOTE=RickJay]
What I want is your best price, period. Tell me what you want to sell it for and I’ll decide if I want to buy it. If your price isn’t good enough, well, that’s okay, we won’t do business today. If it is, we will.
(skip)
So the salesperson offers me one for $179.99. I did not want to spend $179.99, I explain to him, and he says well, it’s not really $179.99. It’s actually $139.99.
But maybe he can sell it for $134.99 iif he “has one in a box out back.” (What else would it come in.)
And this $139 model is probably $129,
and the $209 one might be $169
but maybe if I wanted that I should instead buy the $189 model, which doesn’t bevel both ways but he can give it to me for $149 if he’s got one in a box out back,
but really I should buy this sliding saw for $229, although really it’s $179
and they’ll take Barbados currency for 30% of the cost as long as it was printed after 2004.
This is a RETAIL STORE. I’m not even buying a big ticket item; I want a little saw. I want to see items on the shelves with price stickers, compare their merits, pick one up, and have a cashier charge me the price. I do not want to engage in a complicated, spaghetti-like conversation where I’m whittling away $20 or maybe it’s $30 in a negotiation for every single fucking one of 15 options. If the price tags aren’t relevant, why did you bother printing them? Had I walked in while he was “Helping” someone else and just picked up a box and gone to the cahier does that mean I’d have been ripped off to the tune of $30?
Give me your best price.
Fuck, now I have to go to Home Depot.
[/QUOTE]
Sure, you don’t want to bargain. I get that. In this case however I don’t see an ounce of bargaining. You never countered once.
The salesman made 6 offers to you, (a couple of offers conditional on supply) and he gave you the list price and his best price.
Of course you might not appreciate the additional information on list prices since I gather you’d be quite happy to assume the list price is the best price.
When I buy in non discount shops I’ll make a reasonable counter offer below the sticker price. Works half the time. Your an idiot if you think the sticker price is their best price.
When I buy in discount shops, its because I’ve been alerted to a sale often half price. You’re an idiot if you think the sticker price is their best price .
So good luck shopping at Home Depot. I hope for your sake that your saw never goes on sale after you buy it. But that depends on the home office in Atlanta , not some local salesperson .
[QUOTE=Joey P]
Like I said before, every person (at least every person should) go into a dealership with a number in their head that represents the most they are willing to pay for a car. Every person should walk out if the dealership can’t meet that number. My father just likes to cut all the BS.
[/QUOTE]
No he doesn’t.
As TokyoPlayer suggested, if cutting the BS was really what your father wanted to do, he’d walk into a dealership and say, “I’m willing to pay $25,000 for that car. Will you sell it to me for that price?” Your father is playing the game, just the same as the salespeople are. There’s nothing wrong with playing, but don’t pretend that he’s not playing, because he is.