I Gave Birth to my Kids, I Get to Raise Them, Bitch!

[wonky]

@Hostile_Dialect

Funny you should say that–that’s exactly my view. Except that I don’t pronounce “caution” so that it rhymes with “censorship”.

But if you DID it would be correct, wouldn’t it, Mr. Descriptivist?

(Not a linguistics hijack! Just a lame joke! Avoid the trainwreck! TURN AWAY!)

[Hostile_Dialect]

Hrmmm, you know better than to play with fire, don’t you?

[wonky]

@Hostile_Dialect

Hrmmm, you know better than to play with fire, don’t you?

I almost caught my brother on fire with a burning milk jug as a preteen.

I didn’t learn anything from that experience.

[Algher]

@Rubystreak

First of all, abbeytxs already explained that the 5th graders can’t use the middle school library. Middle schoolers are 11-14 IME. Second, this is a long book (234 pages). There’s no way the kids could read it in one sitting. They’d have to check it out, and bring it home. At that point, the parents would look at it.

No, the kids dog ear the pages with the good stuff and everyone finds out about it.

[Fish_Nya]

@Rubystreak

Second, this is a long book (234 pages). There’s no way the kids could read it in one sitting. They’d have to check it out, and bring it home. At that point, the parents would look at it.

Or they could check it out, only read it at school, and leave it in their lockers or desk or whatever.

Because if my parents had stopped me from reading a book, that is what I’d’ve done.

[wonky]

@Fish_Nya

Or they could check it out, only read it at school, and leave it in their lockers or desk or whatever.

Because if my parents had stopped me from reading a book, that is what I’d’ve done.

I shall not reveal my secret ways of reading Forbidden Books, lest parents in the thread use my powers for evil.

[shijinn]

what appears to be essentially some girls’ chat log masquerading as a book, which includes stuff where they “fantasize about (their classmate’s) summer sausage” and probably worse stuff, is considered proper reading material for 10-year-olds by the school librarian, two panels of parents and school officials, and half the dopers in this thread? what? it encourages them to read and they’re gonna get it anyway? why not stock porn in the school library then? that’ll get the kids coming!

…

it’s bad enough that a book written in IM speak actually exists. but to have even made it to a middle school library, ostensibly a safe haven for selective reading… ugh, i’m officially an old fart… Get off my lawn!

[joyfool]

@shijinn

…proper reading material for 10-year-olds…

This was addressed most recently in the post just 10 above yours.

@Rubystreak

First of all, abbeytxs already explained that the 5th graders can’t use the middle school library. Middle schoolers are 11-14 IME. Second, this is a long book (234 pages). There’s no way the kids could read it in one sitting. They’d have to check it out, and bring it home. At that point, the parents would look at it.

So at this particular school, there are no 10 year olds (read: 5th graders) who would’ve been able to check it out in the junior high library to begin with.

[Rubystreak]

@shijinn

what appears to be essentially some girls’ chat log masquerading as a book, which includes stuff where they “fantasize about (their classmate’s) summer sausage” and probably worse stuff,

You say “probably worse stuff” because you haven’t read the book but…

is considered proper reading material for 10-year-olds by the school librarian, two panels of parents and school officials, and half the dopers in this thread? what?

…you totally discount the opinions of a professional librarian and two panels of interested parents. They should have just asked you, since you know best, sight unseen!

it encourages them to read and they’re gonna get it anyway? why not stock porn in the school library then? that’ll get the kids coming!

Yes, I’m sure it’s just like porn. And yes, if you were trying to get middle school students to read on a daily basis, you would be excited about and desirous of anything that encourages them to read.

it’s bad enough that a book written in IM speak actually exists. but to have even made it to a middle school library, ostensibly a safe haven for selective reading… ugh, i’m officially an old fart… Get off my lawn!

Kids spend their damn lives using IM speak. Someone wrote a book in it, which was a genius idea frankly. Neither surprising nor odd, really. As for what the middle school library is, I’ll tell you what it is to me-- a way to get underprivileged kids to read books. These kids are usually reluctant readers, so we try to stock the library with books that appeal to them. If you know better, please, by all means, go into middle school education, and help us out.

[The_Flying_Dutchman]

@Rubystreak

These kids are usually reluctant readers, so we try to stock the library with books that appeal to them.

Us kids encouraged that approach in th 50s, trying to get the schools to stock the current comic books. They didn’t buy it.

A few titilating books in the library is not going to encourage a habit of reading. Television and computer control at home will.Yeah I know, it can be a real hassle, but that is what real parenting is all about.

[magellan01]

@abbeytxs

For the record - she.

What I object to is that another parent took it upon themselves to determine what is right or wrong for my child.
The book may not have been appropriate for her child and I totally support her right to not allow her child to read it. However, the book was deemed appropriate for 11-13 year olds by the middle school librarian, the middle school principal and not one, but two panels of parents. I trust the middle school librarians to be able to adequately assess what is and isn’t appropriate reading material for that age group. Additionally, if there were books on the shelves that I did not feel my child was ready to read, then I believe it is MY obligation to make sure that my kid doesn’t read it.

She. Thanks. I guess what I’m still not clear on is if your issue is with this one particular book, or the process, where a parent can, in essence, send the approving panel back to the table. Assuming it is the latter, wouldn’t you grant that a mistake can be made. In this instance, it seems there is some support for the parent’s concern. It seems like a good thing that a parent can question the approval process, no? She might not get her way regarding a particular book, and that would show the system working as well. No?

[Rubystreak]

@The_Flying_Dutchman

Us kids encouraged that approach in th 50s, trying to get the schools to stock the current comic books. They didn’t buy it.

Well, they do now.

A few titilating books in the library is not going to encourage a habit of reading. Television and computer control at home will.Yeah I know, it can be a real hassle, but that is what real parenting is all about.

Yes, it has to be more than a few titillating books. But having the greatest variety and the most current, popular books is a way to do it. We can’t control what goes on in the home. We can only control what goes on in our school… but not even that, apparently, if one parent’s wishes can override everyone else’s.

[Kalhoun]

@Justin_Bailey

Even though I’m a librarian, I think the school made the right call in this case.

First, the book wasn’t “banned”, it was moved to the high school library, a more age appropriate place for it. Why is the HS more age appropriate?

Well…

I just picked the book up off the shelf (we keep it in the teen area, which is aimed at kids 13-18, though 10-12 like to read these books as well) and read through the first few pages, which is mentioned as being particularly vulgar.

The book is about a trio of tenth graders (15-16) and in the first couple of pages they discuss wanting to touch the penis of a male classmate. One of the girls also asks another one, “Was he staring at your boobs in class?” Then I put the book and started writing this post, so who knows where it goes from there.

The point it, the book is more appropriate for the HS library and while I hate censorship, they did right.

If the child brought the book from home and read it in class, would there be a problem? I’m just curious regarding how “improper” a school feels about it being read and passed around if it’s not actually school property. Can a kid do a book report on it?

[Jayn_Newell]

@Rubystreak

Well, they do now.

[semi-hijack]And it probably works. We used to go to the library in French class. What did we read? Garfield.[/semi-hijack]

For those who say the book has no literary merit–so what? I’m an adult who loves reading, and I can’t haul myself through a lot of ‘literature’. Do you really think a 13-year-old will if they don’t have to? There may be other objections to a book, but if you want to get kids reading, you have to give them access to books that aren’t–how do I put this?–as boring as watching grass grow.

[DrDeth]

@Rubystreak

First of all, abbeytxs already explained that the 5th graders can’t use the middle school library. Middle schoolers are 11-14 IME. Second, this is a long book (234 pages). There’s no way the kids could read it in one sitting. They’d have to check it out, and bring it home. At that point, the parents would look at it.

Gee, so it’s 6th graders, and 11yo. Not a big difference.

You know, you can read a book bit by bit, every day a chapter during lunch.

Note the publishers themselves rates it ages 13-17 and grades 8-10. Thus, it appears it is not considered suitable for all the Middle-schoolers there. Placing it in the HS stacks was the proper decision.

[zoid]

@mswas

What does that school district think of Anais Nin?

School Board Official Stance: She’s a cunt
Personally: I’d fuck 'er

[shijinn]

@Rubystreak

… …you totally discount the opinions of a professional librarian and two panels of interested parents. They should have just asked you, since you know best, sight unseen!

my imagination failed at coming up with a context where graphically fantasizing about sex is a good idea for [del]10[/del] 11-year-olds. the aforementioned opinions by the way, were also hardly unanimous.

… Kids spend their damn lives using IM speak. Someone wrote a book in it, which was a genius idea frankly. Neither surprising nor odd, really. As for what the middle school library is, I’ll tell you what it is to me-- a way to get underprivileged kids to read books. These kids are usually reluctant readers, so we try to stock the library with books that appeal to them. If you know better, please, by all means, go into middle school education, and help us out.

where do we set the bar and how do we draw the line? a school library is not the place to champion junk food which has no respect for capital letters and uses ‘ur’ instead of ‘your’. that’s what public libraries are for. you can’t serve hamburgers everyday for dinner just because the kids wouldn’t eat otherwise. there are plenty of fluff books written in English. there’s no need to reach out for ones written entirely in IM speak or leet/L33t/whatever.

[DrDeth]

@zoid

Personally: I’d fuck 'er

She’s been dead for 30 years, I think that’s illegal in several states.

[Rubystreak]

@shijinn

my imagination failed at coming up with a context where graphically fantasizing about sex is a good idea for [del]10[/del] 11-year-olds.

You don’t know how graphic is was. Neither do I, as neither of us has read it. Maybe you should wait until you know what you’re talking about.

where do we set the bar and how do we draw the line?

I don’t know about you, but I tend to trust the opinion of a professional librarian on that.

a school library is not the place to champion junk food which has no respect for capital letters and uses ‘ur’ instead of ‘your’.

Oh, you mean like James Joyce and E.E. Cummings, right? I mean, really, books can be written in non-standard ways and still have value. I’m sure the book was only “championed” because some overprotective helicopter mom got her panties in a twist over it and decided to deprive a whole school of the book.

that’s what public libraries are for. you can’t serve hamburgers everyday for dinner just because the kids wouldn’t eat otherwise. there are plenty of fluff books written in English. there’s no need to reach out for ones written entirely in IM speak or leet/L33t/whatever.

Wow, you don’t bother to read the other posts in a thread, do you? Some people don’t have access to a public library. It’s charming that you think that public libraries are a given, but they’re not. As for serving hamburgers every day, well, this is one fucking book we’re talking about, not a library full of them. A kid who comes in for TTYL might come back for something better next time, having had a positive experience in the library. That’s how it works, and I haven’t seen you offering any constructive suggestions for better ways to encourage literacy. Got any?

[wonky]

@Rubystreak

That’s how it works, and I haven’t seen you offering any constructive suggestions for better ways to encourage literacy. Got any?

Beatings, that’s the ticket.