Just for grins, after the next dinner pass the check and your contribution to her. Let her figure out her portion, the tip, et. al; and ultimately she’ll be obliged to pay the difference. When she likely shorts the server on the tip, you can kick her when she’s down by tossing out an extra 20; a not so subtle indication that she is a cheapskate while still forcing her to pay more than she intended. If you are really sadistic, you can even short her with your contribution, or trump her by sending it over before she reaches for her own wallet, but you’d be stooping to her level at that point.
Re: economically rational consumers: I’d rather be a tad irrational than unspeakably rude.
$70 is a bit much. I’d tip $50, and I think that’s pretty good. Anyhow, 20% is standard at nice places, but I fail to realize why, since the prices of the meals are marketable higher to begin with, so a 15% tip on a meal for two at Denny’s will equal $4 or $5 bucks, while a meal for two at 15% at the Pump Room will equal about $30 at least. Seems to be fair to me, and I’ve worked in the service industry.
Anyhow, umm…why don’t you just bring it up with her?
I don’t mean to get all Dr. Laura on you, or anything, but there’s more constructive ways of dealing with this than ranting on a message board. A little communication with the offending party perhaps?
I’ll admit I tend to bit a bit ‘generous’ with the tip. But hey, I can afford it and I truly appreciate good service. She can afford it even more easily than I. My point about the tip was that she’s got this little math trick stuck in her head and just won’t listen to anyone who explains that she’s under-tipping. “No, No, No. You just double the tax. That’s how you figure the tip.”
Thank you Dr. but it would appear to me that you could apply that intelligent statement to just about every pit rant. I mean what the fuck?!?! What was it about my rant, above all the others just like it on this board, that made you assume that I’m the dumb shit who can’t handle confrontation? It’s just a fucking rant.
I think the level of service you get is much higher though. Plus, I think there are often more people involved in serving you. At Denny’s, one person may take your order, serve you, come back once to check and then all the clearing will be done at the end. At nice restaurants, you might have someone take your order, several people will be involved in bringing the food,constantly refilling your water, possibly opening your bottle of Pellegrino, pouring your wine if you’ve ordered a bottle and clearing things frequently(I ate at one of Emeril Lagasse’s places in Las Vegas and I was drinking iced tea with artificial sweetener. The empty packet never hit the table.)
My family took me out for dinner on my birthday. They paid for my meal, tip and all. We had a fairly demanding party of 8 as well, and the waiter was excellent. He brought us drink after drink, was always available when we needed something, was not overly obsequious, and even ran around the bar waving a Canadian flag when we suggested it (my birthday was on the Grey Cup this year - Canadian equivalent of the SuperBowl). In short, he provided over-and-above service.
My family left him about a 12% tip, which I felt terrible about. I didn’t know how to increase the tip without causing a family row, however. I was grateful to them for taking me out to dinner, and I didn’t want to seem ungrateful by questioning their tipping (it was their money, not mine, after all). I did call the restaurant/bar the next day, and told the manager what great service we’d had the day before from this waiter. I wanted to go back to the bar after everyone left and increase the tip, but that seemed kinda weird to me. What could I have done differently here?
featherlou, you certainly could have gone back to the bar and tipped more. I had a few people do that when I was a server, and it earned them my undying gratitude. It never seemed weird-- it always seemed that a person with more social awareness was making amends to the server withouth embarrassing the group. Worked for me.
Not tipping is “rational”? Only if being a selfish asshole is “rational”. Waiters and waitresses often get less than minimum wage because gratuities are expected. Others (like pizza delivery drivers) take jobs that offer minimum wage on paper, but actually offer more, and expect that money to pay their bills.
Sorry, but abiding by social customs (that expect a tip, rather than simply requiring more money to cover labor) doesn’t make you irrational. It makes you not another jackass who uses “logic” to cover up being cheap.
Its also a good way to piss off the person buying for you. Tossing a waiter an extra tip could be construed as insulting to the person who felt their tip was appropriate. I always tip based on what I feel is appropriate to the level of service I recieve. A % is an ok guideline but if I get shitty service in an expensive restaraunt I wont be tipping at all. I have on one occasion spoken to a manager and asked to tip the cook for the excellent food but that my waiter sucked (rude, snippy, rarely present, etc.)
Hmmm could it be that she could afford it more easily than you is because she doesn’t tip extravagantly.
I too am fighting the urge to turn this into a tip thread, when the OP wasn’t necessarily about a tip. The fact of a matter is that the OP is completely justified in calling her a cheap bitch because she only gave you $50 for covering her part when it was three times as much. In fact I wonder if the $50 would even put a dent in what she ate.
Whatever you do Photog don’t let her get away with stiffing you with the entire bill when she agreed to pay half. Obviously the rest of your family is wise to her miserly ways and was smart not to team up with her on paying for a family meal jointly. If you don’t have the nerve to stand up with her, do what the rest of the family probably does: don’t ever depend on her to do her part.
I’d say, give her a receipt for the $50 she’s pre-paid; when the bill comes, figure out the tip, write that down on the bill, pay half, plus her $50, and slide the bill and your contribution down the table to her.
Absolutely. She’s cheap. That’s why she’s got more money in the bank than I do. But hey, I guess I’m one of those ‘can’t take it with you’ folks.
Extravagantly? Really? Are my tipping habits extravagant? (note: asking an honest question here - not trying to be sarcastic) I know I’m generous, but extravagant? I honestly think 25% is fair for a relatively large party (plus an infant), which received excellent (not just good) service from a person who was obviously working very hard.
Am I the only one here with a hankering to watch Reservoir Dogs now? What’s that line from Harvey Keital’s character (Mr. White?)? [PARAPHRASE]Any asshole who starts thinking he’s Charles Bronson/[gonna get away with being a cheap bitch], you just smash him across the face with your gun[/PARAPHRASE]
And wouldn’t that shock your parents. :eek:
In the scale of all things relative, asking her to cough up the actual splitzies amount owed would be a piece of cake, with only a few moments of everyone else staring awkwardly at the ceiling, drapery, spot on tablecloth, etc. That, or you could write to Dear Abby/Ann/Miss Manners and “show her this letter.”
I personally hate going out in a group, because even with friends, I always end up spending at least twice what everyone else does; to make up for the sneaky stiffers [“why should I have to pay for my four dollar beer, it was worth maybe two, I’ll put in two”–I imagine they rationalise like that to themselves] the chintzy tippers [“when I was born $2 could get you to the state line and back, that’s plenty.”] and the disingenuosly (sp?) bad at math. Yeah, right. As long as I’m there and have the funds, nobody stiffs our waiter, but I feel like SUCH a sucker. Like I have to pay to play with them.
Hopefully I don’t sound like a complete cheapskate when I say this, but I dislike going out in groups for the same reason. I love the company, but I know at the end of the meal, there will always be some people who don’t pay their part of the bill. They pay for their meal, but not their drink or entree, or they don’t chip in for the garlic bread that everybody shared. WTF? I can take it once or twice, but it gets incredibly tedious (and expensive) paying for part of their meal every time we go out. It’s always the same people who don’t pay enough and the same people who have to pick up the slack. If you can’t afford to pay your freaking bill, then you shouldn’t be going out to dinner.
I know this is the pit and we should really be slinging colorful epithets at each other but, since you asked,
Tipping is a social convention and is indeed, “irrational” from the perspective of economic theory. The study shows that tipping practices vary widely from country to country. In some countries much poorer than the U.S. tipping is considered an insult.
Even the suggestion that you should leave a higher percentage tip in an expensive restaurant is a social convention in search of a rationalization. Expensive restaurants may have more staff per person. They also, by definition, charge more for their food. In addition, I’d bet that the people working at expensive restaurants also have a higher base pay than people working at “Denny’s” This suggests that you ought to leave a higher percentage tip at a cheap restaurant.
The reason people leave bigger tips in expensive restaurants is because they feel compelled to do so. You said it yourself, Photog in your OP with respect to tipping in general, “However, I would now be embarassed to tip less than 20% for good service . . .” (emphasis mine) Why?
I leave tips because it is a social convention in this country to do so. I nonetheless reserve the right to question the social pressure that causes otherwise reasonable and likeable people to engage in indignant posturing about refusing to leave less than a 25% tip.
I see why tip inflation is in the interest of the food service industry. I don’t see why anyone who questions the rationale for leaving ever larger portions of the bill as a tip should be labelled as “cheap.” “Thoughtful” is more like it.
I think tipping with money is crass and vulgar. I always give my waitperson a Chick tract with the reminder that “Jesus is your friend.” In this way I have helped save their immortal soul, which is a gift far above any mere financial compensation. If the staff had to work extra hard then I give them several different tracts. I am positive that the waiters remember me and many of them have given me the Hawaiian peace sign as I was walking out.
Actually, that’s my bad. For some reason I thought you were asking what to do in the OP. Upon further review, I realize it’s simply a rant. So nevermind that little bit.
I honestly do find 25% on a relatively pricey meal to be extravagant myself, and I don’t consider myself cheap by any stretch of the imagination. I tip up to 50% on meals less than $10 if the service is great. My point is this:
The service at Chez Paul is certainly going to be much better than the service at Denny’s for the same party. Given the prices of these restaurant, why should we tip UP on the more expensive one? I just don’t get it. Let’s say dinner for two at Chez Paul comes to $300 with wine. Custom tells me $45 tip. If I’m operating at 20% that’s $60. For a $300 dinner, I’m probably at the restaurant for 2 hours. Is that waiter’s service really worth $30/hour for me? (And I am assuming he has no other tables.) Maybe so, maybe not, but to me it seems a bit much, especially when you compare it with the service a waitress at a truck stop diner’ll get for ten times the work.
:eek: