My harum-scarum 18-year-old high-school-senior niece, my kid brother’s daughter, has now announced that instead of going to a Real College–and certainly not to the Very Large And Well-Respected State University where as the offspring of a faculty member she’s entitled to free tuition–she is going to get a college degree, of some sort, online.
Excerpt from his e-mail:
Now, granted, on the face of it, and breaking-away-from-Dad issues aside, I wholeheartedly believe that this is a Bad Idea, and a waste of time and money. But just on the off-chance that it’s possible to come away from one’s online college experience with something sort of worthwhile, I’m running this past the smartest minds on the planet. Is this really such a hideous idea? Are there reputable, accredited schools out there? Has anybody here ever gotten a decent job armed with an online diploma?
There are reputable online degrees that you can get from accredited schools, including some state colleges and well known private schools. It’s not limited to associate’s degrees either. It is possible to get an accredited bachelor’s or master’s degree without ever setting foot on a college campus.
Be very careful about accrediting. Not all unaccredited schools are diploma mills, but most are and they are best avoided. There are fake accrediting agencies that “accredit” diploma mills. Avoid these schools like the plague. Be careful of any school that claims to be registered with a state agency. In some states that’s merely a formality that does not imply any kind of state approval of their curriculum. Then there are the two national accrediting boards. If you get a degree from one of these schools, you are entitled to say you got a degree from an accredited degree. These are certainly not diploma mills, but they have very different standards from traditional schools. In most cases, traditional schools are reluctant to accept transfer credits or graduate-school applicants from nationally accredited schools.
Then there is the gold standard of accrediting agencies: the 7 or so regional accrediting bodies. Any degree (including online) offered by an any school accredited by a regional accrediting board is perfectly respectable, and credits generally transfer to other regionally accredited institutions, even across different regions. I think the regional accrediting boards are as follows, but this list may be out of date:
Middle States Association of Colleges and Schools (MSA)
Middle States Commission on Higher Education www.msche.org
New England Association of Schools and Colleges (NEASC)
Commission on Institutions of Higher Education
North Central Association of Colleges and Schools (NCA)
Northwest Commission on Colleges and Universities (NWCCU) www.nwccu.org
Southern Association of Colleges and Schools (SACS)
Western Association of Schools and Colleges (WASC-ACCJC)
Accrediting Commission for Community and Junior Colleges
Western Association of Schools and Colleges (WASC-ACSCU)
Accrediting Commission for Senior Colleges and Universities www.wascweb.org
Some of the best schools that are primarily online are accredited by the regional institutions, but many are accredited by the less prestigious national accrediting boards. The University of Phoenix, for example, is regionally accredited by the North Central Association. Many traditional regionally accredited colleges offer online degrees, including, for example, the University of Maine System.
The best book on the subject is the College Blue Book : Distance Learning Programs which is the sixth volume of the famous College Blue Book series. There’s a new edition every year, and you should really try to find an up-to-date edition because this field is changing so fast. You should be able to find the book at any decent college library or at a really good public library (often in the reference section). If you can’t find that, look for any of John Bear’s guides, of which there are many different titles and editions. Be careful, though, because many of the colleges Bear describes are not accredited. He’s pretty good about making clear which is which. His books are available at many public libraries.
I work for a state university that has online programs - very good ones. I work with several of those programs, as a matter of fact, and one of them is considered one of the top programs in the country.
It is NOT easy. The distance students have to do the same amount of work as the residential students. Acceptance is selective and not everyone graduates.
It sounds like this kid is looking for easy, and no, online is not the place to find it unless you want to get a degree that isn’t worth the paper it is printed on. Waste of time and money, in that case. Maybe this kid needs to take a year off and get a job, that should give her time to think about reality and what she really wants out of the rest of her life.
I just signed up with University of Phoenix online. They’re regionally accredited and for someone in my position (been working for years, single parent) it’s great. It’s tough to do it all by yourself though. It’s harder to keep on task with the assignment schedule. It’s vastly more difficult to participate in the class discussions (especially if you get in them late and all the points you wanted to make where made but you still have to make substantive comments in order to get the participation points). Plus you don’t get the networking opportunities that are so important once you get out in the working world.
Sounds like Dad needs to read up on distance learning more. As bibliophage said, there are quite a few respected colleges/universities that offer a few degree programs completely online. The diploma you get isn’t any different from the traditional student and there is no way for an employer to tell whether you went into a classroom or not unless they look at your transcripts.
Does she know that most colleges/universities offer distance learning options? She could probably still attend the free school and not have to be on campus very much. She could probably still test out of a few classes, take classes during summer and winter breaks and graduate early if she wants.
The fact that an 18 year old is shying away from the committment of a traditional 4 year institution is basically proof that she won’t be able to complete an online degree. It is an avoidance tactic and nothing new. Students have wanted to “live at home to save money” and enroll in the local community college instead of breaking away forever. It rarely works. In this case, it will be even harder because it will be up to her to have self-disipline to complete the degree, and, like I said, that decision shows that she doesn’t.
She has a 100% chance of failure and should be warned of that so that she doesn’t waste her money. Online degrees are for older professionals or for people that have unusual circumstances but know what they want and know how to achieve it. They aren’t for 18 year olds that are wishy-washy and don’t want to commit to something real.
I also teach at a private university that offers both on-campus and online degrees. I even teach some of the online courses. While some of the students do very well, those tend to be the students who are focused, and know exactly what they want to get out of their degree. They also realize that online courses are harder because they don’t have a teacher hovering over their shoulder making sure they’re doing it right, and because the student has to be able manage his/her time, rather than relying on a pre-determined schedule.
The students who fail my classes fall into three categories:
They are taking the class because they think it will be easier than having to sit in a classroom for four hours a week. What they don’t realize is that instead of having a teacher “teach” the material to them for four hours a week, they will have to learn the same material completely on their own, and it usually takes more than four hours a week to do so.
They are not computer literate. Online courses normally require more computer skills than just surfing the web or reading e-mail, since most courses have specific ways to complete and submit assignments. (My courses are also Computer Science courses, and it amazes me how many people sign up for the online version of my courses without even knowing how to save files to a computer.)
They “forget” that they are taking the class. Sometimes, they will start the class and keep up with it for a couple of weeks, then I just don’t hear from them again. Most of the time, though, it’s more likely that they forgot that there was an assignment due until an hour or so before it is due. Then what they submit (if they submit anything at all) is only partially done, and/or poorly done.
Personally, I like taking online courses. I like the time flexibility it allows, and I hate having to sit through lectures. I would rather read and explore the material on my own, and I am very good at keeping myself on task and on schedule (or I wouldn’t be teaching online, either ).
In January I’ll be graduating with a master’s degree from an independent study program, with much of the work and interaction done online. There were a lot of reasons why I chose to do this instead of going to traditional grad school. For one, I don’t like the school atmosphere. I don’t like going to class, I don’t like sitting in class; I’m a very independent person with a low tolerance for structure. Independent study allows me to work at my own pace, and since my pace tends to be of the “don’t write anything for weeks then have five fifteen-hour days” variety (I’m studying creative writing, btw), I need a more flexible schedule. Secondly, it was much cheaper than traditional grad school. Third, I wanted to start working, and I knew I couldn’t handle going to classes and working at the same time, at least not at the point in my life where I decided to go to grad school. My program is run by an actual, physical university, and is accredited and all of that. It isn’t solely an online program; twice a year I go to the school for a week to take classes.
So no, I don’t necessarily think online or mostly-online college is a waste, however, it doesn’t seem like a good fit for the person in the OP, someone who is not working and just starting out in college. She doesn’t sound as if she has the self-motivation required to do independent study; it sounds like she wants all the trappings of living at home without even having to go to class. IMO, if you are of student age you should either be working or going to classes (both if you can handle it), anything less is slacking off. Also if I were her parent there is no way I would pay for a degree when she could get one for free. Ask her if she’d be willing to work, even part time, and save up the money for the degree herself. Then you’ll see how serious she is.
I agree with **Shagnasty ** and davenportavenger. Well said.
On the general topic of online degrees, I usually point out that you will face an uphill battle with some hiring managers/HR folks to get the credit you deserve for a legitimate degree.
But in the case of the OP, this just isn’t a fit. Someone who would turn down a free college degree probably needs a massive dose of Life 101 before proceeding. The idea that she would expect her parents to just up and pay for this with a free alternative is kinda boggling my mind. It would be different if she were a music prodigy dreaming of Juilliard…
An approach that might make sense is for her to work a year in a field as close as possible to what she thinks she wants to get the associates degree in, ostensibly to earn the money to get the online degree. If she thinks she wants to be a film producer and the closest she can get is a movie theater, I think that would still give her an idea of how far she really would need to go, if you see what I mean.
This may result in her realizing that a “real” degree will do her a lot more good, or that she really had no idea what that field was like. What is to be avoided is having her live at home and work at a traditional teen fun job, like a restaurant or at the mall. That’s just prolonging childhood.
There’s no sense throwing away a perfectly good college education on someone who’s not ready to learn that type of material, either.
Speaking of U. of Phoenix, I’d like to get people’s inputs on how they compares to a “real” bricks-n-morter kind of place. Specifically on the difficulty of the material. I take classes there myself and am about 1/3 of the way through a degree in IT.
So far, the material seems much easier than I had expected. Is this normal? I’m not sure whether to give myself points for being clever and kick myself for not having done this sooner or lose all respect for those that already have degrees. My very last preference would be to think that UoP is inferior in their curriculum.
FWIW I’m 50 and have done IT and computer hardware since it used discrete components.
You’re probably in the same boat I am. Although much further down the river. I’ve only just started taking my classes, and haven’t yet finished all the wonderful COM classes yet. However looking at the curriculum for the core classes in the IT degree program, I have no doubt that I can easily complete them. In fact, the main reason I decided to go with an IT degree, rather than a business degree is that I feel I’ll have to put less effort into the IT classes, as I am already very familiar with the material and concepts they’ll be teaching. That way I can double up on some classes in order to finish my degree faster.
That doesn’t mean that the online degree is any easier, just that after 15 years in the IT industry, I’m more than passingly familiar with many facets of the job. I suspect that you’d have just as easy a time if you were going to a brick and mortar school. If you were getting a degree in Computer Science, it would be more challenging, but an IT degree is more like a basic introduction to all things computer.
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