Seriously? Dude, you need to pull your head out of your own ass, you’re in DESPERATE need of some fresh air.
If you seriously can’t imagine that I actually hold the position I hold, the same position that most members of the Democratic Party hold, and the same position that the vast majority of Americans hold - if you can’t imagine someone holding THAT position in good faith - then you are not just high on your own supply, you’re overdosing.
What does that even MEAN? You posted cites that show that I don’t actually think trans athletes participating in women’s sports without restriction is unfair? What kind of cite shows what my internal mental state is?
Still the guy claiming there’s a genocide going on, I’d say.
I watched John’s piece - it was fine, I guess, for a progressive piece on the subject - and he did a good job dismantling the right’s false and exaggerated examples, which is great. He didn’t really address my particular objection to trans women in sports, though; in fact, there were a number of times when he said things like, “there definitely ARE differences at the top level of sports and that’s a conversation to have about professional sports and the like” which I am very glad he was willing to admit, and he’s absolutely right.
This specifically is EXACTLY what John Oliver was very careful NOT to say.
First of all, when you say “school sports”, what are you talking about? If we’re talking about PE, then I agree. If we’re talking about, like, Elementary school (1st through 5th grade) or even middle school (6th through 7th or 8th), I agree. If we are talking about recreational sports, I agree.
But if we are talking about a high school’s official “BLANK Team”, that IS the highest level of competition available to children of that age; it feeds directly into university sports and professional sports; and we are into unfair territory.
And citing studies that show that the advantage is mild, like John Oliver did, or saying “but not all winners will be trans women” DOES NOT ADDRESS THE POINT. It’s actually a VERY simple argument:
- We split sports by sex. We do this for a reason - the differences between (cis)men and (cis)women are so big that in most sports fair competition between men and women is impossible.
- The split by sex is based entirely on physical characteristics that each sex has, rather than on social differences.
- After the age of puberty, and unless they transitioned before puberty, trans women have some level of advantage over women in sports.
- While this advantage might be small, and might be outweighed by other non-sex-based differences between individual women, (and this is the key part of the argument), the SOURCE of that difference IS the physical difference between the sexes; therefore any advantage that stems FROM THAT SOURCE is unfair in the context of a sport that is split by sex.
- Likewise, trans men have an advantage over cis women, because of medical treatment that, again, targets these specific differences between sexes. But trans men don’t generally have a problem with competing with men, so here everyone’s desires align (except the transphobes, but fuck em).
To be clear, this is what I support; but here in California, for example, it is NOT currently the law of the land. Based on California’s official interpretation of Title IX, there is no physical transitioning requirement at all to participate in sports at colleges.
This is not to say that people are going to pretend to be trans in order to win trophies. That’s, of course, a right wing boogeyman. The point is that a trans woman has an advantage over cis women. That remains true (according to the study cited by John Oliver on his show last night) even when the trans woman is genuinely trans (which I assume is the only sort of person who goes through with transitioning; I’d be very surprised to find out about even one case to the contrary).
That’s because public restrooms are divided for entirely social reasons, not physical reasons. There is no reason except transphobia to demand that restrooms exclude trans people.
I mean, you can declare so, but that’s not what John Oliver said on his show last night. The stats he talked about back up the concern I have, which you haven’t addressed at all.
I agree with you that they address the concerns Tucker Carlson or that Payton Mcnabb liar have; you’ve done a great job dismantling those claims, while ignoring mine. That’s what’s called a ‘strawman’.
You should respond to what I actually write, not what you fever dream about. I haven’t repeated any right-wing propaganda whatsoever.
Being strawmanned and lied about feels pretty shitty 
thanks for asking!
That hasn’t been my argument, you dumb motherfucker. Maybe try reading for a change?
If your point is that she originally was talking about the term ‘transgenderism’, and the fact that I got into a discussion with Kimstu that spun off of that original discussion, and you’ve been imagining that I sign on to the idea that ‘transgenderism’ is some kind of nefarious ideology being pushed on our youth, then I guess you might be pleased to know that I wasn’t really engaging with that part of the discussion at all, because I have no idea what ‘transgenderism’ is supposed to be. I know it’s used as a sneer word, but as far as I can tell, it’s not really a coherent idea.
I was more interested in the specific part of Kimstu’s claim that I quoted:
I think Kimstu’s claim, that only a tiny minority of transgender-rights supporters believe this, is true if we include sexual partners and doctors. But if we exclude those two things, but include sports, then it’s still a minority position among ‘trans rights supporters’ in the sense of people who generally support trans rights, but it’s very much NOT a minority position among ‘trans rights supporters’ in the sense of trans rights activists or communicators, or people whose views are in line with theirs.
That’s why I asked Kimstu:
God, if this really HAS been about the fact that this conversation spun off a different conversation Kimstu had with someone else about the term ‘transgenderism’, that’s BEYOND stupid. I even tried to head off this idiocy by specifying “THIS PART of [Demontree’s] argument”.