I mean, that’s what I was getting at here:
Most of those decisions were Netanyahu’s.
Then how can you not agree that, with Netanyahu and his allies in charge, any success is impossible? That the war will continue to fail and fail again for Israel until they step down?
These are two separate questions.
Can the IDF defeat Hamas in Gaza and clear the way for someone else - Israel, a coalition, the Palestinian Authority, Martians if they’re willing to do it - to take over? Yes, I am confident in that, regardless of who is in charge of the civilian government. (Well, if the civilian government started firing officers who disagreed with Netanyahu for petty political reasons, for example, they could mess up the IDF sufficiently to prevent this; but Netanyahu doesn’t have absolute control, not even close).
Can Netanyahu’s government take the political steps to secure friendly administration of Gaza and to put us back on the path to a two state solution? Well, it’s probably capable of this, but that’s not what Netanyahu or his zealot cronies are going to pursue. Which is why I fully agree, they need to be removed.
And what’s to happen when Israel starts to massacre someone else? It’s shameful that Israel has at all begun to resemble the oppressors they have feared.
I don’t think the IDF is nearly that capable. I guess we’ll see.
That’s certainly not something we want to see happen. One of the people I favor for the next election, Yair Golan (who is currently campaigning for the Labor party primary), made exactly that point when talking about cracking down on bad behavior within the IDF. He even compare the perpetrators of some incidents to Nazis, which he got some heat for from the Right. And he compared violent settlers to Hamas terrorists. Again, something that made him a target on the Right, but something he was right to do.
For all the reasons I’ve listed over and over, I don’t think the decision to go into Gaza or the fact that urban warfare against an entranched terrorist group leads to high civilian casualties is evidence of that kind of misdoing.
The court of public opinion doesn’t have high standards for evidence. What has happened already and no sign of reconsideration by Israel looks pretty bad. You don’t believe Israel can make this right yourself, why should anyone believe the future holds anything but continued strife and death in the future?
Especially when it comes to Jews.
Did I miss something? As far as I know Hamas has not released the hostages or agreed to sane terms. What exactly are we supposed to reconsider?
Say what? I don’t think I said that.
The future holds whatever we make of it. Revanchism is a good way to ensure that the future does hold nothing but continued strife and death. A two state solution is a different path.
I should have stated it better. I was referring to the following, I did not mean to imply any more than what you said there.
“JERUSALEM/DOHA, May 5 (Reuters) - Israeli authorities raided a Jerusalem hotel room used by Al Jazeera as its office after the government decided to shut down the Qatari-owned TV station’s local operations on Sunday, an Israeli official and an Al Jazeera source told Reuters.”
Sure. Why not?
I’m sure you are equally upset about the European countries that have banned Russia Today or SputnikTV.
Maybe if the Qataris stop hosting senior Hamas leadership we can let their propaganda rag back into the country.
I haven’t known Al Jazeera to be propaganda. Speaking of Hamas leadership, isn’t Netanyahu supposed to be taking them out?
Netanyahu is a old fuck who sits in his office or runs up north for a “vacation” when he doesn’t want to face the press.
The IDF has been taking out Hamas leaders left and right, though not the ones staying at fancy Qatari hotels paid for with “humanitarian aid” money.
You may not know this, but Al Jazeera is Qatari state media. Much like Russia Today or SputnikTV.
Well I hope you can see why it seems that people not from Israel are tired of it.
You know how the U.S went into Pakistan without invitation to take care of Bin Laden? That’s what Israel has to do.
For that- it is not as biased as one would think. Of course it is biased, but it is not- by any means- junk journalism. It’d say it is better than the NY Post.
So…Israel is now murdering tens of thousands of innocent people for no long-term benefit? And you support this?
The fact that Israel is Jewish state is not the most significant thing in this conflict compared to other examples of similar oppression, and when you say “the only reason people are mad at Israel for doing awful things is that they’re Jewish,” you admit that you know the things Israel is doing are awful. And you support it.
Two straw men knocked down with one post. Very efficient.
You left out the sentence immediately after that one which clearly shows Babale is saying the opposite of the words you’re putting in their mouth (emphasis mine);
Name a country that isn’t doing “awful things”, because I’d sure like to move to this Utopia.
Excellent. And sums up precisely why I think at this point the US should not be involved really at all. Offer to mediate if asked, refuse direct involvement. Too many in the conflict don’t really want it resolved in a way I want any part of.