I unhappily report that I am right about obesity and diet (Very long)

[Stoid]

@CarnalK

It was a joke based on how you seem to really enjoy being right.

Only when it doesn’t hurt.

[Elysian]

You can weigh yourself however much you want, I don’t care 500 times a day! You can spend all day on the scale if you’d like. Have fun!

[Shot_From_Guns]

@Lightlystarched

I haven’t read every post, so please forgive me if I’m repating something, but I just have to respond to those people who are posting saying that weight loss (in theory) is easy. Consume fewer calories. Ha!!

Apparently you haven’t even read the posts you thought you did.

People, including me, have said that calories in/calories out is simple. We did not say it was easy. There is a huge difference between those two adjectives.

[Crafter_Man]

@Zyada

I’m the one who is referring to my bachelor’s in Psychology. Nor did I posit that I was more knowledgable than “everyone else” about human behavior.

When it comes to weight loss advice, I couldn’t care less what a person’s academic history is. The only people I listen to are the rare folks who have lost the weight and have permanently kept it off. In my book, their advice holds much more weight than advice from any PhD dietician. I only care about what works, and the mechanics for making it happen. After that, it is up to me to do it.

[Shot_From_Guns]

Of course, having an understanding of how people think and react can also be helpful in understanding why certain methods work for some people and not others.

[Zyada]

@Crafter_Man

When it comes to weight loss advice, I couldn’t care less what a person’s academic history is. The only people I listen to are the rare folks who have lost the weight and have permanently kept it off. In my book, their advice holds much more weight than advice from any PhD dietician. I only care about what works, and the mechanics for making it happen. After that, it is up to me to do it.

I have no problem with that, in fact, good for you. On these conditions:
a) you don’t insist that your way is the one and only way to lose weight
b) you don’t malign other people for not doing things your way
c) you don’t malign other people for being overweight
d) you don’t act like you know everything there is to know about the way the human mind works.

[Stoid]

@Crafter_Man

The only people I listen to are the rare folks who have lost the weight and have permanently kept it off.

Not to pick too many nits, but you do realize that this can only be determined after they have died, right?

[Stoid]

@Zyada

t
b) you don’t malign other people for not doing things your way

Oneof the many posts CM chose to ignore was the one where I asked him to explain why he thought my failure to admit that I was doomed warranted criticism. I’m still wondering…

[Stoid]

Minor Taubes Update:

I sent him pretty long email of questions a few days ago, he checked in this morning to tell me he’d answer in a few.

I wrote and thanked him and because I’d already gone into the calories issue in my big question email, I added the stuff I posted yesterday about ketosis possibly explaining the whole calories question:

And I ran into something yesterday that I found interesting and I didn’t recall reading in your book, something which might help explain the calories issue, at least partially: "Ketones are incompletely burned carbon fragments. The very fact that they are less efficient as fuel is what makes them give you that ‘metabolic advantage.’ Some of the calories burned are not used to their full capacity… hence the person can eat more calories when in ketosis than when not, and still lose the same amount of weight. "

I didn’t see any citations for this and I have no idea if it is an accurate statement, but at least it gave some idea of some scientific reasoning why low-carb will permit at least some higher calories.

He responded immediately, with a note that he’d go into it more when he addressed all my questions. I’m sharing it because of the many, many posts back and forth about Taubes’ point, and whether I understood him correctly regarding the issue of calories (my emphasis, of course):

Quickly on the ketones and metabolic advantage. My argument is that the whole metabolic advantage argument is misconceived. The idea behind it is that some you utilize more energy under some particular dietary scheme and so energy expended is higher for the same amount of calories consumed, and, voila, you have negative energy balance and lose weight. But the point I’m making is that obesity is not an “energy balance” disorder, so you don’t lose weight because you somehow expend more energy on one diet than the other -- the supposed metabolic advantage. Rather you lose weight when you carb restrict because you change the regulation of your fat tissue so that it releases fat and you change the regulation of your lean tissue so that the cells happily burn the fat now available. It’s an entirely different cause and effect.

So, once more, and this time conclusively to everyone who thought or thinks, even after reading his books, that Taubes is saying “eating carbs will cause you to eat fewer calories, and as a result of eating fewer calories you will lose weight” - no. Not.

Whether he is correct or not is a completely separate question, there was just quite a bit of disagreement as to what his point actually is. Now we know.

[Crafter_Man]

@Stoid

Not to pick too many nits, but you do realize that this can only be determined after they have died, right?

LOL. How about, “keeping it off for more than five years.”

[Stoid]

@Crafter_Man

LOL. How about, “keeping it off for more than five years.”

Done!

[twickster]

@Stoid

Minor Taubes Update:

I sent him pretty long email of questions a few days ago, he checked in this morning to tell me he’d answer in a few.

I wrote and thanked him and because I’d already gone into the calories issue in my big question email, I added the stuff I posted yesterday about ketosis possibly explaining the whole calories question:

He responded immediately, with a note that he’d go into it more when he addressed all my questions. I’m sharing it because of the many, many posts back and forth about Taubes’ point, and whether I understood him correctly regarding the issue of calories (my emphasis, of course):

So, once more, and this time conclusively to everyone who thought or thinks, even after reading his books, that Taubes is saying “eating carbs will cause you to eat fewer calories, and as a result of eating fewer calories you will lose weight” - no. Not.

Whether he is correct or not is a completely separate question, there was just quite a bit of disagreement as to what his point actually is. Now we know.

I told you that if Taubes wants to post here he may, but that you should not serve as his mouthpiece here for posting by proxy. Next time you try something like this you’ll get a warning for ignoring moderator instructions.

I’m going to lock this mess.

twickster, MPSIMS moderator