I'd like to shoot an educated man

I guess this question should go in GQ, but it really seems too trivial to put along side important things like, noodle sucking, butt wiping and serious snot questions…so I’ll just ask it here.

Tonight I was watching the movie (mini-series?) Lonesome Dove. (my fav.)
When they leave Texas, Gus takes their “ranch sign” along.
(the one that says “we don’t rent pigs”)
At the bottom of the sign, there are four words, in Latin.
They don’t have a clue what it means, because (Tommy Lee Jones) says,“for all you know, that’s inviting people to rob us”.
Gus replies, “That’s okay, I’d like to have the chance to shoot an educated man, just once”

Does anyone know what those words are … or what they mean?

Now ya just had ta go an’ piss me off by makin’ me go and search for the feckin’ thing, didn’t ya?

Just for that I’m gonna make ya go do yer own bloody homework. A bit of unsolicited advice though – educated men shoot back.

(Just a bit of fin de siecle noblesse oblige, pay no attention to the poodle behind the curtain.)

Dr. Watson
“Grammatici certant et adhuc sub iudice lis est.” – Horace

“Just a bit of fin de siecle noblesse oblige”

Heyyyy, you can’t talk to me like that.
My pigs wouldn’t stand for it.

Just because I can’t read Latin doesn’t mean that I’m igernent ya know.

The weird things one finds on the net:

http://www.jps.net/callaghan/jean/uva.html


Tom~

boyoboy, ah’m really missing somethin’ here. however do any of the suggested translations relate to the statement about robbing us & shooting an educated man? never watched the series (don’t watch much tv); was this one of those things you had to be there to ‘get’?

The line about shooting an educated man comes thusly:

To be able to read Latin, a man would be educated.

To know that the sign was actually an invitation to steal the pigs, one would need to read Latin.

If a man was stealing the pigs, and was caught, and his defense was “The sign said I could,” he would thus be an educated man.

Gus wouldn’t bother catching them, he’d just shoot them. A pig thief’s a pig thief.

Thus, he’d shoot an educated man.

Make sense now?

tomndebb:
Thanks so much for taking the time to find that.
It’s been bugging me for ten years.
I’m really glad that it was left open to interpretation, because I would have felt like a prize sucker if had just said “we don’t rent pigs”.
(I see now, why he didn’t explain it in the book)
…anywayz…thanks again … I just love a cowboy mystery

I guess I’ll spend the next ten years trying to figure out what Gus was trying to say … if anything.

ummm, well, no; because the site tom~ put up said the sign was about grapes looking at each other not about stealing pigs.

is there a full moon tonight?

“is there a full moon tonight?”

No special, I think that I misled you with those quotes.
The part about shooting an educated man only establishes that they didn’t have a clue what the sign meant, but that Gus still treasured it, simply because it was written in Latin.

It does however, tie in with what I think the whole “grape influence” thing is about.
I think the “grapes” are Gus and Call, and that it’s talking about their influence on each other’s perspective on life and death.
They’re complete opposites. Call is a total pessimist “for all you know It’s inviting people to rob us”. Gus, the eternal optimist, “that’s okay, I’d like to have the chance to shoot an educated man”.

The same thing is seen in their conversation in Clara’s orchard. (refering to one of the interpretations on the web site, “It’s not dying I’m talking about – It’s living!” )
Call was in love with a whore named Maggie, but he would never admit it, because she was a whore. Gus saw that as a reason to love her even more, and to dwell on her life, enstead of her death (like Call did).

Anyway, the whole thing seems to be about an incredible bond that develops between two totally opposite people, during their travels through life and death.
(the gesture made by one for the other, at the end, shows something stronger than “ordinary” love… I think)

I never liked cowboy stuF very much, but this one RocKs.

N oR jVIaL wrote:

“fin de siecle noblesse oblige” is French, not Latin. “Fin de siecle” literally means “end of age”, but figuratively means “decadent.” “Noblesse oblige” is listed in my French dictionary as meaning the English phrase “Noblesse oblige” (D’OH!), which apparently means “rights imply duties”.

So either Crick&Watson is performing the duties implied by his decadent rights, or his duties are decadent ones. Or I just got "WHOOOOOOOOSH"ed.


The truth, as always, is more complicated than that.

thank you, n or j. that does seem to make more sense that the last explanation. i never saw the series & it looks like i probably missed something good. love the deep stuff, ya know. maybe i can pick up the book(s).

“So either Crick&Watson is performing the duties implied by his decadent rights, or his duties are decadent ones”

Well I don’t know if he’s all that decadent (although that poodle thing sounds a little weird) but he’s pretty funny… for an educated fella.

… be a pity to have to shoot him.