If education is so important, why have I used nothing I learned beyond 8th grade?

In My Humble Opinion
1

I work in a decent paying job as a computer programmer, skills I learned myself through books, online tutorials and trial and error.

It seems to me that I’ve used nothing that I “learned” in high school (or university, for that matter) in my professional life. I’m also pretty sure I’ve forgotten 99% of the learning material that I was exposed to in that time.

While I absolutely think it is critical that people learn “the basics” (reading, writing, arithmetic, etc), why is high school considered so important?

And for that matter, university/college courses. Seems as though most university graduates don’t end up working in the field they studied for.

The only discernible advantage I can see of high school and university is that employers seem to like them.

Any other benefits of note? Am I alone in my thoughts?

2

Arguably, being a computer programmer is a highly specialized skill where inherent intellectual ability in math and analysis are paramount, and other knowledge is on lower tiers. This is not to say that programmers are like idiot savants that only have to be good at one thing, but they are a lot different than jobs or professions that require more subtle and broad based knowledge to operate effectively.

Extrapolating from your somewhat unique job to others as evidence of no need for higher education is not a compelling example.

3

I write a lot in my current job. I learned how to write coherently and intelligently in high school, but I refined my technical writing skills in college and graduate school. I wouldn’t have the job I have now if I couldn’t write.

Sometimes taking a course is useful because it shows you just how much of a subject you really don’t know. If you’ve got nothing but unanswered questions at the end of a course, that sets you up for independent learning–where you actually pick up the information that sticks with you and makes you a more interesting, marketable person. Without taking a class, maybe you think you know more about a subject than you do, leaving you with only a superficial understanding of it. And what’s worse is that you won’t know it, but the more educated people around you will.

Education also teaches discipline and toughens the spirit. An individual learns how to handle failure, accept consequences, and how to tackle challenges in school. The “real world” teaches these things too, but school is a safer place to learn these things. If you don’t learn them by eighth grade, chances are you will by the 12th. Or by the end of college.

4

Why on earth are you limiting it to your professional life, as though that’s the only part of your life that matters?

And I could turn your question back at you: Why have you chosen not to use the things you learned in high school and university?

5

That’s because it’s not so much about learning the content of the curricula as it is about learning to jump through hoops and be a properly obedient worker bee. Employers like that because someone who has a college degree has at least to some basic extent been “vetted” by the system as capable of doing such, and there is less risk that they will turn out to be completely unsuitable and/or retarded. Obviously that’s not to say that there aren’t a lot of people who get a degree and still turn out to be terrible/incompetent workers, but just that the risk is lower.

6

There’s a common myth that the purpose of education is to teach you specific skills to use in your job. But that’s ridiculous, and for the most part, quite impossible. Even vocational programs can’t teach you how to do a job. Sure, they can teach you the skill of welding, but being a welder is something you can really only learn by being a welder.

The purpose of education, then, is not to teach you how to do your job. It’s to teach you how to learn. When I was in eighth grade, I had a smart and funny algebra teacher, Mr. R. During one lesson about some algebraic concept, one of the more obnoxious students in the class asked the same question that gets asked in every class: “why do we need to learn this? When are we ever going to use it in real life?”

Every teacher I’ve ever had always tried to come up with some contrived example to answer this question.

But Mr. R. just shrugged and said, “you probably won’t need to use it. But that’s not why we teach mathematics. We teach math because learning math teaches you how to think logically. Learning algebra in particular teaches you how to think about quantities and how they relate to one another, and by practicing it, you will automatically apply these skills to your every-day life, whether you’re aware that you’re doing algebra or not.”

That’s the idea that people seem to have forgotten about the liberal arts tradition in the past 50 years or so. Nobody expects deconstructing the the logic of ancient Roman rhetoric to be useful when you become a CPA. But learning to think about logical argument is useful in many endeavors, both personal and professional, and if you did a good job you’ll apply those skills without realizing it.

I’m also a self-taught programmer, having learned more in my first weeks on the job then I did in a year of CS classes (I dropped out.) But I don’t regret my “useless” education at all, and in fact I wish I had worked much harder at it when I was young. Certainly, I could never have taught myself as much as I did without the thinking skills I learned from my great high school and college teachers. Interestingly, a throwaway elective that I had no interest in (Psychology 101) probably taught me more about how to think about the scientific investigation and problem-solving than any hard science or math class did.

In conclusion, there are a metric shitload of people out there who assume that the purpose of a college education is to spend four years to buy a job. But they’re missing the point, and a lot of them probably don’t belong in college anyway. (I sure as shit didn’t back when I was there.) It took a long time for me to really get Mr. R.'s lesson.

7

^ +1

What he said. Smacked that nail solid on the head. I’m guessing he went to high school. :slight_smile:

8

Opposite for me. Lots of what I learned early on was not especially useful, but high school and college were, probably because I got to choose more of what I took. And yes, I work in the area I studied.

9

I sort of agree. I think we need to revamp certain aspects of our educational system. The whole home ec, shop, autoshop and health class needs to be revamped to something like ‘modern living’ where you learn to follow a real recipe, menu planning with aspects of nutrition, sex ed without the damned holy rollers whinging about the sexxor of our youth. Obviously their abstinence program isn’t working. Both sexes need to understand basic auto maintenance [changing tires, what to look for in adding oil and fluids, simple crap like that] basic home maintenance [what is involved in cleaning a house, plunging a toilet, fixing a drip, how to check the breaker box, you know, basic shit like that] and basic finance - understanding checking/debit accounts, how to budget, balancing a checking account with the statement and stuff like that. It can slot in that period for about 3 years to get it all in.

We need to bring back honest blue collar work ethic. We need to test at about 12, 2 groups - one college track for kids who should go to college, and the other for those who are best suited for vocational training. We need people willing to be plumbers and electricians and other types of manual labor. i worked as a machinist and thoroughly enjoyed working with my hands. I actually hate office work [as a cripple I am stuck with nonphysical jobs =(] even though my last job was as a forensic accountant. We also need to [I live in the US, YMMV for any other country] make a single curriculum nationwide that is not influenced by race creed or color. No agendas, no texas bullshit. no biblebelt bullshit. no sedona woo. Every class level in every school nationwide uses the same books and learns the same stuff. I went through hell when I moved from one school system in 3d grade to a new school system in 4th grade. The freaking asshole math teacher did not seem to realize that I did not learn the same level of math in my old school and rather than asking me if I understood what she was reviewing punished me for refusing to do the work.

10

Exactly. Education itself is an honourable and worthy objective. It broadens the mind, introduces new ideas, and expands our ability to think.

11

This. I would also add that it is to teach you how to think. It wasn’t until I attended university that I realised how much I needed to think about and question things that were presented to me as facts.

12

I may have made life hard for myself in high school (and before) by not paying attention in class or doing reading assignments (my contrary nature insisted I read other things) or really taking any of it at all seriously. So like the OP I do sometimes marvel at the fact that I really can’t remember having learned anything at all, and that includes how to think and learn (I really did just goof off and pay no attention). I guess I’m just completely self-taught. It’s really hard to know whether I can draw any conclusions from that, because I may not be a usual case. But I do think it’s interesting that I’ve done entirely fine without consciously being able to retrieve anything at all that I learned from school during maybe a 6-year period of my life. Interestingly, the things that stick out are some books I read outside of school. Maybe I was lucky to be born with the desire to read those books, and maybe the parenting environment to have those kinds of books around, etc. Anyways, it really does make one think “6 years? Learning nothing? That’s a long time!” But then I think “what should I rather have done with my time?” I’m not sure I have an answer. I guess it would have been really cool to be an apprentice to people. Maybe I could have learned a lot of neat skills.

13

For what it’s worth, this highly educated fellow is sympathetic to KellyCriterion’s criticism of high school and college. I think past the basic literacy and numeracy, people should generally feel free to study whatever interests them, whenever it interests them, and not be forced to cram on material that they have no interest in. There’s some value to exposing them to subjects they might not otherwise ever have been aware of, but if they decide they still have no interest in them, let them opt out (and come back to them later, if they like…).

You can “learn to learn” by practicing learning, but there’s more ways to practice learning than just the current curricular model. Being forced to study a whole bunch of random things helps people who already are interested in studying a whole bunch of random things, and just turns other people off.

[I liked studying a whole bunch of random things, but I fucking hated being forced to do it on somebody else’s schedule…]

14

Highschool is a good way to keep teenagers off of the streets unsupervised.

15

Is this not education?

16

This isn’t a radical idea. It’s called tracking and it’s wrought with controversies. The thing is, as long as you have a vocational track, someone will have to fill it. It will inevitably be people who do not have any one at home pushing them to go to college, kids who are late-bloomers and don’t know what they want to do in life, and poor kids whose parents aren’t going to fight for them because they either don’t know what’s happening or they think it’s fine, since that’s what happened to them. So these kids get shunted into a vocational track at twelve, and then when they’re 14 or 15 and realize they can never take college-prep classes, let alone AP classes, then they are screwed.

I think it should work more like this: All kids get a college prep education up to 10th grade (when most students will turn 16). After that, they can opt to continue or they can transition into a vocational program geared towards their particular interests. And only the student makes the decision–not the registrar, not a single test score. The “system” should not be determining a person’s future.

A kid who graduates with a college-prep diploma still has the option of going to vocational school after high school. A kid with a general education diploma is much more limited.

17

Sure, I suppose we might as well formalize the perpetual underclass thing. As it is, poor kids have too much hope. Makes 'em uppity.

As to the OP, lots of people think that they didn’t learn anything in high school or college. The vast majority of them are mistaken. A few are correct, and you can tell by the fact that they’re talking to themselves, as their company is generally unbearable.

18

Havng contemplated being a teacher and possibly a math teacher, I envisioned myself explaining this to each class as the very first matter of business on the very first day. I would not wait for someone to get frustrated or to work up the nerve to question it out loud. Each class would know this from Day 1 before cracking open the textbook. I imagine it would help students get into the material faster and with a better attitude toward math class.

19

I see someone who hasn’t been privy to high school curricula in decades…

Very few schools/states use abstinence programs and some states, such as New York, have been teaching kids with an towards education and birth control since the late 80s.

Why need? A cell phone and AAA is a better option for people of the world that have no interest in car maintenance beyond emergency situations (which, again, with cell phones aren’t exactly emergencies).

When was the last time you HAD TO balance a checkbook? That shit is automated today. Red = bad and black = good doesn’t require three years of classes.

20

I’ve never understood why people harp on balancing a checkbook as a vital life skill which really ought to be added to the modern high school curriculum; A) How often does your ATM screw up the balance it tells you?, B) How often do you write checks?, and, most of all, C) What is there to learn in balancing a checkbook, beyond “When you buy something, you lose that money. So subtract it away. When you get money, add it in.”. You need a class for that? That seems like a thirty-second speech. That seems like something everyone who knows what “money” is already knows…