Well, thank God for that, I had no idea, since I haven’t seen it in about 20 years. Listen, next time you see it, would you tell it to come home? I kinda miss it.
If it makes you feel any better, Weirddave, I find you utterly repulsive. 
And gobear, IMHO you need to chill out. Even though you feel people are misreading you, the fact is what you wrote could be (and obviously has been) construed as both a generalization and a backhanded jab at JustPlainBrian. I mean, you even did it in this very thread:
Just like you could have clarified that you weren’t referring to JustPlainBrian specifically, even though you were quoting him directly, right?
Bottom line (IMHO) is, you’re entitled to your opinion (as everyone here has said, even if they think your opinion is full of shit), but you have to be careful how you state it on a public message board, or you will, indeed, be taken to task if someone interprets your statement as sounding like you’re making A Sweeping Generalization[sup]TM[/sup] (because we all know that all generalizations are bad), as you’ve now discovered first hand (and I discovered around here a long, long time ago). And I daresay your tone in this thread hasn’t made things easier… but that’s just IMHO.
On a completely unrelated note, my Q tears up the dance floor like a god. 
Esprix
Women always overgeneralize, get used to it.
I thought it might be! But seeing the tone of so many folks in this thread ready to take offense, I thought I’d “warn” you (hehe).
Hey, I’ll tradeja!! (actually, I am moving to TX at the end of this year in 3 and a half months) Alaska is beautiful, no doubt about that, but I’m a lousy candidate to be an Alaskan. Just nothing to do up here, unless you’re one of the fishing/hunting/snowmachining sorts.
I thought it might be! But seeing the tone of so many folks in this thread ready to take offense, I thought I’d “warn” you (hehe).
Hey, I’ll tradeja!! (actually, I am moving to TX at the end of this year in 3 and a half months) Alaska is beautiful, no doubt about that, but I’m a lousy candidate to be an Alaskan. Just nothing to do up here, unless you’re one of the fishing/hunting/snowmachining sorts.
gobear your subject title is so wonderfully descriptive. May I add a related dating criteria rant to your thread? (rather than start a related thread?).
Oh, yea, a gay man who agressively enjoyes his sexuality isn’t the least bit interested in having sex with me under any circumstances, that cheers me right the fuck up, how could it not?
[quote]
Bottom line (IMHO) is, you’re entitled to your opinion (as everyone here has said, even if they think your opinion is full of shit),
[quote]
But that’s just not true. People have stated that my opiono is wrong, and I am not entitled to any opinion that differs from the norm. It’s not enough for people to disagree with an post, but they have to smear me in the process. [bI have never done one thing to Crazy Cat Lady, but she feels entitled to call me names for no reason.
But, and here’s the thing –I didn’t make a Sweeping Generalization.. I stated that it was something I had noticed through personal experience. I NEVER said it was true for all people or for everyone, only that it was a subjective impression I had, and that was enough to start the pile-on. I also wouldn’t date a cokehead or crystal queen because I’ve been through that already. Are people going to pillory me now for “generalizing” about coke-snorting boyfriends?
It’s good to know I can count on you for support.
And because I know that people will try to make the accusation–**there is no connection between not being able to dance and being a cokehead. Those are two completely unrelated issues. /b]
Who funded this study on the sex habits of dancing couples who were mutually visually challenged? 
Please, please learn it as quick, quick …sloooow, slooow.
Using 1, 2 tends to make people 2 step in a rather jerky manner. I find that when you teack QQSS makes people glide rather than stalk. ~grins~
CS, what part of TX are you moving to?
~J
Dallas! I’m really looking forward to it.
LOL to the QQSS, my partner and I always say “quack quack, slooow, slooow” because of this goofy shirt we saw once. You’re right though, the 1, 2 3& is kind of a weird count because you’re doing it to a 4 beat per measure song. So it’s 1, 2 3& 4, 5 6& what happens to the other 2 beats?
I’d rather an instructor do SOME sort of count. I feel so sorry for the poor beginners when they’ve got one of those dorks, like the something or 'nother project on MTV (or VH1?) who say “okay, go like this, then move forward, put your foot here, finish off with a quick step touch”.
Um, HELLO? It IS math. The counts DO mean something.
Oh, and I forgot to tell Brian hip hop and techno make good “beginner” training tunes. They tend to have more solid, obvious easily “picked out” beats. Country can tend to be too subtle for beginners regarding the beat.
Waterfalls by TLC is one of my favorite “training tunes”. It’s got a great beat, and it’s slow enough that beginners have got plenty of time to get the steps right.
[QUOTE]
Originally posted by gobear
Oh, bullshit. Get off the cross.
That may be true, and I won’t fault you for defending yourself. However, I hope you’re aware that the method by which you’re defending yourself isn’t actually making you look any better than what you’re being accused of.
And if you’ll notice I said, “… if someone interprets your statement as sounding like you’re making a sweeping generalization.” You say you didn’t. But it could be - and was - interpreted as one. Your best bet, IMHO, was to own up to that, apologize, and move on, even if people continued to detract you.
I’m not against you, dear, but I’ve made the same mistakes on this board and paid for them, too. I’m just trying to explain how you are being seen by some, as I’ve been there myself. I’m sorry if you see that as an attack on you.
Esprix
I’ve been on vacation so I am just now seeing this one so I apologize if I’m late to the party but the one thing that confuses the hell out of me around here is how someone’s OPINION can be wrong? I see this more and more and more lately…
It’s an opinion…not a fact…not a written in stone truth…it’s something someone thinks and are entitled to think. It doesn’t have to be right or wrong…it’s an OPINION. It can be the most obscure bizarre thing ever and 99.9% of the population can think it’s stupid, but it’s okay because it is an opinion.
You can be of the opinion I am an uneducated, homophobic, racist Southern bitch and although you might not have any facts whatsoever to back up that opinion you can still have it and for you, it wouldn’t be wrong if that was truly what you thought of me. (BTW I’m not any of those things and I hope no one actually thinks that!)
I think I will send a basket of cookies to the person who can explain to me how an opinion can be viewed as wrong. I just don’t get it.
And FTR Sauron couldn’t dance if his very life and the lives of our offspring depended on it and I LOVE to dance so I hate that he isn’t comfortable trying it but I have no complaints whasoever in the bedroom department.
But I take no offense at gobear having his own dating criteria. Why shouldn’t he?
ISTM that gobear and others are confusing opinions with preferences. An opinion is a belief about real facts. A preference is a personal feeling. Believing that gobear is an idiot is an opinion. Disliking gobear is a preference.
The notion that everyone gets a free pass to express any opinion they want is pretty dubious, as matt_mcl suggested. “My experience has been that most Jews are greedy crooks, so my opinion is that they should be avoided” is an opinion. And any number of other such examples.
Of course, it is possible that gobear’s opinion is correct in this case - as he notes he has a rationale and experience to back him up. Still, there is no reason that his opinion cannot be challenged, and himself held responsible for it, just like any other opinion.
Esprix
But I fail to see why I should apologize for something. I. didn’t. do. I did not make any Sweeping Generalizations, and a crowd of Dopers saying otherwise won’t change that fact. When I err, I apologize (see above), but there is no way I’m going to apologize for someone else’s mistake in misreading what I wrote. I have no bad feelings toward any posters, and I forgive their bad temper as I hope they forgive mine, but there is no way I’m going to change my opinion on dancing and the bedroom as it relates to my track record with guys who can’t dance. Your experience might be different and that’s fine for you, but my experience is mine, not yours.
Moreover, there are different kinds of opinions that require different levels of evidence to be supported. If one were to say, “All Southerners are homophobic racists,” that would be fairly called a Sweeping Generalization that could not stand up to scrutiny. On the other hand, if one had said, “I don’t date Southern men because the ones I’ve dated were too devoted to football,” would that be a generalization about all Southern men or just the ones she had dated? If one had a bad track record dating Southern guys, would it be fair to castigate one for saying so?
(Note: The previous paragraph was a hypothetical situation. The scenarios mentioned in the previous paragraph are purely fictional and are not to be construed as factual representations of the opinions of any real Southerners, living or dead.
I don’t see the reason for the namecalling and the hate, but I’m not going to return it. You’re getting nothing but good thoughts back.
[quote]
The notion that everyone gets a free pass to express any opinion they want is pretty dubious, as matt_mcl suggested. “My experience has been that most Jews are greedy crooks, so my opinion is that they should be avoided” is an opinion. And any number of other such examples.
[quote]
FTR, I never said “most” about any group, so that’s not really analogous, and anti-Semitism is many degrees of magnitude more serious than lack of dancing ability. I’m not sure why you need to smear me by association with bigotry.
But yes, the distinction between opinion and preference is important and one that I overlooked, thank you. I certainly don’t think everyone should get a free pass to express opinions unchallenged–if that were so, this forum would have no purpose.
Of course, it’s correct because it’s my preference that does not hold for anyonew but me. I loathe butterscotch and find the taste to be revolting, but that does not mean that another person’s love of it is not equally valid. Preferences are not the same as prejudice.
Agreed, but I see no need for the hostility here.
FTR, I never said “most” about any group, so that’s not really analogous, and anti-Semitism is many degrees of magnitude more serious than lack of dancing ability. I’m not sure why you need to smear me by association with bigotry.
But yes, the distinction between opinion and preference is important and one that I overlooked, thank you. I certainly don’t think everyone should get a free pass to express opinions unchallenged–if that were so, this forum would have no purpose.
Of course, it’s correct because it’s my preference that does not hold for anyone but me. I loathe butterscotch and find the taste to be revolting, but that does not mean that another person’s love of it is not equally valid. Preferences are not the same as prejudice.
Or let’s put this discussion in basic terms. I posted the equivalent of, “I’m not attracted to X.” Most of the posters in this pile-on, however, accused me of saying, “All X are unattractive.” And when I dispute this, I get personal insults and hate spewed at me. I know it’s the Pit, but still. . .
I really do not think my comments warranted the behavior I’ve seen here.
gobear,
Well I’m not specifically trying to mess with you - I gave it as an example - but of course I do not deny some snarkyness there - this was based on your past history with me, which does not consist of “nothing but good thoughts”. But if you want to turn over a new leaf, that’s more than fine with me.
Actually the anti-semitism would be analogous with the being bad in bed - it is the conclusion, not the experience.
I’m not trying to smear you with bigotry, and certainly do not think you are an anti-semite. My point is that a person’s experiences are not necessarily valid in drawing correct conclusions. Most people would readily recognize this if an anti-semite used personal experience to draw general conclusions, so I used this as an example to consider in the analogous dancing/bed situation.
Right. There are essentially things going on in your thought process, as it contains elements of both preference and opinion. Here’s how I see it:
- The group of People Who Don’t Dance Well will tend, on average, to differ from the group of People Who Do Dance Well in terms of their performance in bed.
This is opinion, and is based on your extrapolating from your experience, as well as your theory about people’s feelings about their bodies (or whatever - it’s on the previous page and the board is too slow to look it up).
- I, gobear, prefer the type of experience that one tends to have with People Who Do Dance Well as compared to the experience that one tends to have with People Who Don’t Dance Well.
This is preference.
So there are two things going on here, but the second is based on the first, because if in fact there is no difference, on average, between the two groups (and your experience is an anomaly), than the preference does not apply. So that when you say the second, the first is implied as well. To the extent that your opinion is valid, no one can question your preference, which is your business and no one else’s. But the opinion can be looked at on its own as well.
As it happens, I happen to be a guy who thinks a lot of stereotypes are based on some underlying truth (though they are frequently greatly exaggerated) and it is quite possible that your opinion here is valid as well, as I mentioned earlier. My point here is to say that that the opinion has to be defended on it’s own merits, and cannot be defended as being merely a preference, as you and others seemed to be doing.
There is something to be said about the input going into the ears, then transmitted to the brain to be interpretated and then the output is sent to the hands, arms, feet, legs, etc. BEING TOTALLY DIFFERENT from input coming in from the ears, nose, eyes, tongue and nerve endings throughout the skin and organ areas - all transmitted to the brain and intrepretated and the output sent to all areas of the body during the process of sex.
I, being a terrible dancer who only dances when alcohol is in my system (for my own benefit and no one elses so I don’t have to remember how crappy of a dancer I am), am also a very attentive lover to my wife because the other senses I employ totally compensate (and then some) for my shitty interpretation of music. I would prove it to you gobear, but only when you can pry my body from the cold clutches of my dead wife (whenever that’ll be)…
It also comes down to confidence (on the dance floor and/or in bed), not the generalization you believe in…