I'm watching Buffy for the first time ever!

Cafe Society
1

I know there are several Buffy fans around here (Cliffy, etc), so I thought I’d make a public announcement that I am only now getting into the show. A friend of mine worships all things Whedon, and she pushed the season 1 DVD set on me. Somehow I never watched this once when it was on TV. For the most part, I found the episodes formulaic: some kid or teacher in the high school is killed by some other kid or teacher who is secretly a vampire/demon/monster, Willow does computer research, Xander makes wisecracks, Cordelia acts like a bitch, Buffy kills whatever the monster of the week is, and parents never seem to pull their children out of this school, even though it has a higher bodycount than the war in Iraq. It felt like I was watching Scooby Doo, only with more deaths and hotter chicks.

But the last episode of season 1, with the death of the Master, was very good, and I’m enjoying the first few episodes of season 2 a lot more so far. (I just watched the first appearance of Spike, who gave off a real John Constantine sort of vibe.) I like how the characters are actually changing a bit, and even though I know some things that are coming up, I have a feeling I’m witnessing a cult classic start to earn its cult reputation.

Of course there are plenty of hotties, so I must cast my votes for Robia La Morte (sexiest name ever), followed closely by Alyson Hannigan (my newest geek-girl crush; and no, I have zero interest in ever seeing the American Pie movies), and Charisma Carpenter (who is gorgeous despite playing a thoroughly off-putting character I would despise in real life… although I have a feeling her character’s growth arc will make her a lot more tolerable). Sarah Michelle Gellar is cute, but she doesn’t do a thing for me the way the other three ladies do.

As for the dudes, I have the uncontrollable urge to reach into the TV and throttle Xander until he realises that Willow really digs him, and how he’s an asshole idiot for not noticing what an amazing girl she is, even compared to Buffy. I guess their scenes are pretty well-written to invoke such empathetic hostility in me.

So I’m finally starting to dig it, only a few years too late. The same friend also showed me the pilot episode of Firefly, which I also liked. I guess this Joss Whedon guy is pretty cool!

2

My wife and I watched the last couple of seasons in prime time, and we really enjoyed it. It had what I consider to be essential for an ensemble show to work, which is either that the characters are likeable on at least some level, or that you at least care about what’s going to happen to them next.

Sure there were some plot lines that were weak, or tiresome, IMO. But by and large it was a great show. We miss it.

3

I, too, am a recent Buffy convert. I used to razz my best friend about watching it, mainly because every single other show she watched was horrible (Smallville, for one). One of our cable stations started playing it in order every week, late on Saturday nights. My husband convinced me to watch the first episode, and I’ve been hooked ever since.

Thanks to the Glories of Tivo, we watch every week! We’re into season 2 or 3 now (I don’t really know, since it’s not like they say what season they’re on), but I will say that recently (contains information about future episodes - read at your own risk!)

Buffy had to face a test when she turned 18, and she passed but Giles failed as her Watcher, so he’s been fired. The last episode we watched, Xander got de-virginized by Faith.

So wherever that puts us in the timeline is where we are.

4

You’re in season 3 - - the episode in question is “Helpless”…

I kind of envy you guys… getting to experience everything you have coming for the first time - I hope you haven’t heard too much about whats coming to spoil any of the great twists and suprises…

also, make sure you follow on with Angel too… that show actually surpassed Buffy for quality towards the last two seasons…
the only thing I will warn you is… you will never feel the urge to watch TV again once you’ve finished - nothing fills the void!!!

5

Well my friend says that Buffy seasons 2 and 3 are among the best of any show ever aired, but it dips in quality after that, and with the exception of the musical episode, seasons 6 and 7 are totally skippable.

Here’s what I know so far:

Willow becomes a witch and a lesbian with a girlfriend named Tara, Spike becomes a major character and possibly even an anti-hero, Seth Green plays a werewolf named Oz, Buffy finds out she has a little sister, and she possibly dies again. Then Angel moves to L.A. to start the spinoff show, and Cordelia (who becomes a generally nicer person and part of the group) goes with him.

That doesn’t ruin anything major, does it?

6

Welcome. :slight_smile:

7

I love me some Buffy. It has some incredibly strong ep.'s. Hush was brilliant and The Body was one of the most powerful and well made hours of TV I’ve ever seen in any genre. Enjoy.

As an aside I’ve just finished watching all of Firefly on DVD and I have to say there is a special place in hell for the wankers that cancelled that show. You should try and sort out getting the rest.

8

Weeelllll… To a degree, yes, but I was still glad when she left after the third season to go to “Angel.” She became less self-centered and less of a bitch, but didn’t change enough for me to really like her. Though as I understand it, her character continued to change on “Angel,” which I haven’t seen yet.

9

Well, your friend’s wrong. (And could a mod please fix that open spoiler?)

Of course, it’s a subjective judgement. I never saw either Buffy or Angel until last year; I’m over 40, and I thought the shows were aimed at palpitating teenage girls. But I watched the Firefly box set, liked the way Joss Whedon wrote, and decided to check out his other work. The first season of Buffy (only 12 episodes, since it was a mid-season replacement) was a little rocky, and looked like it was becoming purely formulaic, but the show really pulled out after that, and always had snappy dialogue. To my suprise, the characters got to really grow and change with time, and the show developed real dramatic themes that were worth examining. (It also almost makes vampires seem interesting, which I thought was impossible.)

I ended up watching the whole series, and then Angel. In fact, a couple of hours ago I watched the final episode of Angel, and thought it had a great finish. I’m actually going to miss the vivid characters on the show – both shows developed excellent ensembles, and even though there was a definite star, all the characters got to have good scenes. One of the good things about both shows (as well as Firefly) was that there are a lot of strong female roles, with very distinct personalities. Also, for a show about supernatural horrors, both series had some of the funniest moments I’ve ever seen on tv.

10

Actually, the last episode they saw was “The Zeppo”, which has one of the funniest moments, imo, ever on Buffy, when Xander comes looking for Buffy and arrives in the middle of a Buffy/Angel angst-fest. It’s so over-the-top melodramatic, with the music (which dies as soon as Xander interrupts them and comes back as soon as he leaves so they can continue the angst) and the candles and the declarations of love and the glaven, I practically fell off the couch laughing.

I love me some Buffy. How many shows would be willing to mock their great romance like that?

Buffy Season 4 has a few crossovers with Angel Season 1, so if you’re watching on DVD, I would recommend watching them together. It’s not impossible to figure out what’s happening, but it makes things easier. Plus, “I Will Remember You.” Ouch.

11

Also, if you don’t watch Angel Season 1, you miss Spike’s hilarious narration of an encounter Angel has with a chick he saved. “Not the hair, never the hair! Quick! To the Angelmobile!” It will never stop being funny.

12

I’m jealous - really.

I didn’t start watching Buffy until around Christmas 2003, and then had to buy the seasons as I could afford them (this got much easier once I started working full time again last September). When season 7 came out on DVD last October or November, I got it the day it was released.
I’m still trying to convince myself that I want to go past season 1 of Angel - it just didn’t catch my attention and suck me in, so I haven’t bothered. I am working my way through Firefly, though, borrowed from a friend.

If I went with Netflix and could rent them, I’d at least try to rent the first couple of discs for Season 2 and see if I liked it any better. But I’m not going to sign up for Netflix just for that. And I don’t know anyone nearby who has it that I can borrow.
To go back, though, I like season 6, and I don’t hate season 7 - to me, if you can slog through season 4, then 6 will be a delight in comparison, and even season 7 has overall stronger episodes than season 4. 5 is definitely good too.

13

**Once More With Feeling ** (the musical episode) is one of the greatest hours of television I have ever watched (and I am 46 years old).

14

Wesley enjoys some truly amazing character development over the course of the series. He winds up a million miles away from where he started. It’s mighty good.

15

You HAVE to finish angel, IMHO the first season is the rockiest. I found that while the best Buffy episodes were (again IMHO) far better than any Angel episode, towards the last few seasons, Angel’s episodes were much more consistant in quality.

The second episode of the season (“Are You Now or Have You Ever Been”) is one of the most captivating episodes for me. The end of season arc in an alternate universe introduces us to the nummy Fred. Please go, watch.

-DF

16

Brilliant bit. Probably the best of Spike’s lines–and he had so many good ones.

17

What a coincidence. I’m doing the same thing–I’ve been getting the box sets used from Amazon on the cheap. I just finished season 3 and am waiting for season 4 and Angel season 1 to come in the mail.

For some reason I seem to be enjoying the “filler” episodes more than the story arc episodes. Weird. It’s pretty damn entertaining stuff, though.

It never would have occurred to me to watch the show if one of the cable stations hadn’t started running them early in the morning when I woke up. After a few weeks of catching random funny snippets while channel surfing past, my curiosity got the best of me and I picked up season 1.

18

Woo-hoo! Namechecked in the OP!

I have a higher opinion than most of the first season, actually. It certainly follows a formula, but c’mon, what other show would have actually done what they did to Principal Flutie?

I too came to the show late. The little demon in my TiVo picked up a couple episodes of the FX reruns of the third season which I liked so much I went out and bought S1 and then S2 on DVD – and watched them both within a three-day period. As I got more into the show I realized how atypical it was. They didn’t pull any punches – both literally and in terms of story. Actions had consequences. People may forget, but that was a big deal when the show came on – most TV 10 years ago was completely episodic. Buffy (along with ER, NYPD Blue and a handful of others) were in some ways the vanguard of today’s much more serialized TV dramas. And beyond that, Buffy managed to be both the most exciting and most humorous show on the air.

The sixth season is one of my favorites. Many people despise it because it’s almost unrelenting. But, y’know, that’s life. S2 is the other season that vies for first, with S3 and S5 contributing the most great episodes, but throughout its whole run the show had fantastic highs – S7’s “Him” is easily in my Top 10, and Spike’s efforts in S4’s “The Yoko Factor” are a joy to watch.

Angel (the show) was never as good as Buffy, IMO, but it was consistently enjoyable after a particularly up and down first season. I agree with the statement upthread that the character arcs on that show, for Wes especially, but not just him, were very well thought out and portrayed. Lsura, S2 of Angel is head and shoulders better than S1 – the introduction of additional characters is part of it, but the emotional arc that Angel goes through is surprising and powerful. Plus, you get to see Cordy in a bikini. S3 and S4 are not as strong, but they’re still full of a lot of good episodes, and again, Wesley’s character arc continues to impress, while David Boreanaz does great work with his own character’s changes. Then, S5 was fantastic. I can’t think of a poor episode, there were several great ones, the dynamics with new characters were a source of great scenes, and the show had the greatest series finale I’ve ever seen. So, yeah, I’d suggest continuing with Angel as well.

I don’t think it’s a big deal to worry about synching both shows up for the crossovers. They all work on their own and the shows do a good job of giving you what you need in each crossover episode to understand what’s going on.

Ultimately, I’ve never been disappointed in a season of either show. Hmm, now that LOST, Alias, and Deadwood have hung up their seasons, maybe it’s time to rewatch my DVD’s.

–Cliffy

19

To each their own, of course, but I couldn’t disagree more. I’d suggest at least watching the first couple episodes of each before making a decision about whether you want to watch the whole thing.

I like every season of Buffy, but season 3 to me is a pretty average season within the context of the show, whereas season 6 I really love a lot of. I like season 7 as well, though it’s kind of a deal where the season as a whole is less then the sum of its parts. The story arc for the season has some (semi-nitpicking) issues, but there’s a lot of episodes in it that I really like as standalones (e.g. Conversations with Dead People, Selfless, Him, Storyteller, The Killer in Me, and Lies My Parents Told Me). For what it’s worth, I like both better than their corresponding seasons of Angel (3 and 4).

Some of that is more major than others, but I don’t think there’s anything there that will prevent you from enjoying the later seasons.

As others have said, Angel S1 is a lot different than the rest of the series. For season 1 they, for whatever reason, abandoned Buffy’s season arc/big bad structure and did pretty much all detective show, monster-of-the-week episodes, sort of like Magnum P.I. with monsters (only I liked Magnum P.I. more). It has a little bit of character arc (for instance, Angel’s relationship to Kate), but no real story arc. And while I think it has some good parts, it’s also, in my opinion, easily the weakest season of the show and weaker than any season of Buffy. Season 2 starts off differently, building off the events of the season 1 finale (To Shanshu in L.A.), and is more serialized. If early to mid season 2 doesn’t draw you in, then there’s probably not much point in continuing to watch (though I agree with Cliffy that season 5 is the series’s best season).

I love that teaser. To me that is one of the funniest moments of both series, up with Angel’s dancing in She, Faith vs Mr. Spock, and a couple others.

20

To defend my friend, she personally doesn’t like the last two seasons as much (except for the musical, which she loves), but she did say they’re worth watching to see how everyone changes and how the saga plays out. She didn’t actually recommend I skip them, and if I’m still interested by then, I’m sure I’ll see it all eventually.

Mmm, Ms Calendar…