Once again, I will repeat the post of the thread, the only one that really means anything or that matters, distilling this entire exchange right down to its core.
Fuck it. The Dems should do it anyway. I’ve seen the counter arguments in this thread, but regardless of whether they actually impeach him, they still should try and, basically, if the Pubs block it then at least all this stuff will be out in the open and out with the public. I think if half the stuff is true it will eventually percolate up to the top. It might be that right now, today, that won’t mean anything…but I think it’s one of those death by a thousand cuts thing, and it will chip away at the Republicans when/if they support this idiot. This might set up Democratic victories for the next decade if they actually have the balls to go through with it and push the button.
Fuck it Dems…push the damned button. That’s my opinion, FWIW. Take this bastard down.
A plurality of Americans are independent; neither Republicans nor Democrats are particularly popular. I wish I could share your sense of optimism, but what the electorate is telling me is that we don’t know who we are. When most Americans vote (or consciously avoid voting), they don’t really identify with a party, they just don’t want to fuck things up. We’re a democracy, but we have no idea what we’re doing, which is how we ended up picking a foul mouthed, bigoted, sexist reality TV star over someone who had obvious faults but by comparison was far more qualified. What we said in 2016 was that qualifications don’t mean shit. I don’t expect us to have evolved that much in a few years. IN fact we haven’t evolved; we’re continuing a process of political devolution. That is a fact.
The reason I am the most unpopular poster on these boards is because I speak truth, and I hold up the mirror and show everyone here who we really are, not who we pretend to be. And it makes people bitter and angry I guess. One day, when we are truly desperate, when we truly understand the magnitude of the crisis before us, we will change. But not until those circumstances are felt by the average person.
See, I agree with you that there are a ton of independents out there. I also think there are plenty of D or R voters that aren’t all that wedded to the party…they vote for them, but they aren’t in lockstep, and can and do move back and forth depending on the candidate. So, where I disagree is that, if they are presented with real, solid evidence, I don’t think they will react by dismissing it because they are partisan. I think what will happen is, if there is evidence it will eventually bite the Republicans on the ass. Oh, it won’t matter to the faithful on either side what the facts are…they will go along with the party. But to the center? I think it will make a difference, if the Dems have the balls to do it.
You aren’t the most unpopular poster…I think I’m way more unpopular, and I’m not the most unpopular either.
Impeaching under the current circumstances would be entirely non-partisan. Choosing not to impeach because it will hurt the dems chances in 2020 **is **a partisan decision. You can’t hide from that.
Because it will be so hard to find “High Crimes and Misdemeanors” relating to Donald Trump. So, so, difficult.
Which… to your point… by October 30th 2020 the American public might be screaming for mercy seeing Trump pummeled over and over by his own misdeeds. I mean, the Khashoggi (sp?) hearings alone could take months, Ditka.
The goal is going to be to deny him his moment of victory, and keep him tweeting “The [del]13[/del] [del]18[/del] [del]59[/del] 235 Angry Democarts are being very Unfair to me!” up until November 4, 2020.
Sure, he’s gonna bring it up at his rallies, but he was going to anyway.
Glad you get that. But American voters (particularly the ones who get their news from a television set) tend to be pretty stupid. And they will all too often buy a narrative which says that acquittal is the exact same thing as proof that bringing him to trial was an injustice that he should not have had to contend with.
…can you be a wee bit more specific? You quoted my entire post. Which bit are you “glad I get?”
I don’t think “American voters” tend to be “stupider” than anyone other voter in the world. The narrative is set not only by the media, but also by the people that set and propagate that narrative. Like what you’ve just done here for instance.
Some people will view " acquittal is the exact same thing as proof that bringing him to trial was an injustice." But you can’t quantify that. You can’t accurately predict what “some people believing something” will do to other voters. So why are did you bring it up? What are we supposed to do with this information?
Not really. I just started reading the threads yesterday, and was making my responses to posts as I came upon them. I’ve only just now reached page 7 and effectively caught up. It’s becoming apparent that this is not an ideal approach to participating in an established thread. I probably won’t use it when I take on the Stupid Republican Idea of the Day thread in the Pit.
Tru dat, but the times during the past 40 years when the Democratic Party has demonstrated the presence of a backbone have been disappointingly infrequent. In this characteristic, I’d submit that they’re not that great a proxy for America as a whole.
None, during the daytime: nobody was home to turn the dial. And until the last several days of the hearings, when the actual articles of impeachment were being debated and voted on, that’s when the hearings were.
It’s true that a lot of housewives were at home during the day in 1974, but the same cultural prejudices that trapped them in the role of housewives also resulted in their not being taken seriously as people. It only mattered when men took time away from their work to tune in the proceedings.
