In defence of Russia

From various sources I would not agree that Russian forces have taken more losses. At some early points in the war I think Russia did suffer more losses in personnel and materiel. But then the war settled into more of a stagnant front line situation. For some time I think losses on both sides were fairly equal. But then Ukraine forces tried more attacks than defence. Increasing their losses. Then over time Russia honed their tactics to minimize their own losses while maximizing Ukraine losses. With long range attack ability and retreat into fire pockets. It is not a fault of Ukraine forces. They are attacking to regain their territory. That usually incurs higher losses. And they have succeeded in several cases.

I think some of Russia’s supply is dwindling. But not enough to decisively give Ukraine an advantage. Foreign supply to Ukraine is strained and will take too long to increase in production. Russia seems to have an edge in being able to sustain a higher level of conflict. But tactics have been evolving. Ukraine was early to use drones effectively. Both sides are adapting this form of war. The west seems to have an edge in raw ability to supply the smaller drones.

Willingness to target civilians? I think that is the usual war propaganda. Both sides will cause civilian casualties. There is no point to purposely do it. It is a negative. But both sides will accuse. In every war.

Considering the long range attacks both sides do. It is actually good to see fewer civilian casualties due to better intel and accuracy. But civilians do die.

GASP!

I see your replies on other subjects and find them thoughtful, informed.
GASP!
What is the point? Of course you folks know my general opinions on this issue. I know you disagree almost 100% But often you do have good information in your replies and some good thoughtful opinions. I actually find this thread has some better back and forth than the official thread. The other one is pretty good lately for allowing dissenting opinions. But way too much quips and jokey shit.

I do not agree that Russia has lost more personnel and materiel since this started. It is a fairly valid opinion considering the situation. The actions both sides have taken during the war are historically prone to one side taking more losses. Attacker versus defender.

Even though Russia is the attacker. Their forces basically walked across mostly friendly territory to take up defensive positions. It was in the North that they got their ass kicked. Because it was not friendly territory. And they were stupid. Serves them right. Don’t base military tactics on politics and suppositions. But that was a tiny portion of the time frame and military mass of this war. Then they left things very thin on the ground in the North East. Again they got their ass kicked. Ukraine intel revealed it and they stormed right through. But as I said. Russia was very light on the ground. They retreated fast and losses were not so bad. Lost a shit ton of territory though! A great Ukraine victory. Made Russia look stupid again. The South East retreat was the least embarrassing and likely least losses. It was planned. Ukraine had made the situation too weak. So Russia bugged out. Ukraine gets back territory again. Neither side had to fight much about it. Actually a damn good retreat.

But the stagnant lines are the losses. The attacker loses more personnel and materiel. And it has been going on for over a year. Russia has for most of it had an advantage in long range strike capability. Artillery and missiles. Ukraine had great fortifications. They had already been warring with East Ukraine for years before Russia showed up. This kept defensive losses fairly equal. But every time you attack, you lose more than the defenders.

Lately Russia has gone more offensive in some spots. They are taking more losses now. But it is a late portion of the war. Over the full time of the war. Ukraine has suffered more losses. They are about to do a full scale, every male conscription now. Last ditch attempt to keep the personnel up to force. But they are already under force. Lots of units are not at full force already.

What are these “various sources”? You need to provide cites, otherwise you are just presenting your personal opinions, which have generally been proved to be wrong.

How would you explain the discrepancies in equipment losses found on the open-source intelligence (OSINT) defence analysis website Oryx?

For example, just looking at fighting vehicles (Ukrainian losses vs Russian losses),

Tanks: 602 v 2203
Armoured Fighting Vehicles: 305 v 939
Infantry Fighting Vehicles: 682 v 2622
Armoured Personnel Carriers: 316 v 341
Mine-Resistant Ambush Protected (MRAP) Vehicles: 134 v 46
Infantry Mobility Vehicles: 348 v 198

Here are the Oryx stats for all losses of equipment:

Ukraine - 4100, of which: destroyed: 2723, damaged: 301, abandoned: 145, captured: 931

Russia - 11562, of which: destroyed: 7831, damaged: 449, abandoned: 425, captured: 2857

There is an information war going on and the Russians appear to be just as keen on disseminating photos and videos of destroyed enemy equipment as the Ukrainians are.

I do not believe the Oryx team harbor any bias in their counting of equipment losses and there are many Russians on social media that supply them with photos and videos, in addition to what they gather from their own assessment work. There are also people on social media that go through their work to weed out duplicates.

https://twitter.com/oryxspioenkop/status/1687853404918272001

In fact, the widely-publicized incident at the start of the counteroffensive when some Leopards and other western vehicles were destroyed has become a bit of a social media joke with the number of photos and videos the Russians have released of it from a dozen or more different angles over a period of weeks.

This is just bullshit.

How many Russian civilians do you think have been killed by Ukraine in this war? Over 9,369 (UN estimate of Ukrainian civilian casualties, confirmed minimum, thought higher)? 42,000 (US estimate of Ukrainian civilian casualties?)

Horse. Shit.

This is a war of invasion of a sovereign country. Russia is sending missiles into Ukraine in an indescriminate fashion. They are hitting apartment buildings aplenty. They are firing at civilians in Ukrainian cites. They are trying to invade a country by first shelling it to bits.

Ukraine are the defenders. They are defending their own territory. They are NOT trying to take over parts of Russia. They are NOT shelling Russian cities.
Do you even understand the basic story of what is actually going on here?

Note that Russian propaganda sites and right wing conspiracy sites have been used to back up claims in the past. Though Kedikat does claim to also visit legitimate news sources as well for balance.

It’s sort of like talking to your primary care physician about a serious medical issue, and then deciding you need another opinion so you’ll ask the guy behind the 7-11 who insists that the CIA is trying to kill him using microwave technology inside robot birds that look like real birds, because he knows too much about the lizard people from Jupiter.

I mean, you gotta be open-minded, right?

So why does Zelensky wander the world begging for more? Should be a done deal. Russia riding into battle on Ladas. Zelensky and his military have been saying they do not have enough. Well then Russia must have none?
Not all sources are reliable.
Consider that Ukraine had mostly Soviet tanks and other military materiel. It is often very hard to tell what side a destroyed Soviet tank was fighting for.

Define Russian civilian. A lot of very recently Ukraine civilians are killed by Ukraine attacks. Particularly in the center of Donetsk city. Recently hit by cluster munitions.

Signs point to no.

Indiscriminate missile attacks…with those precious missiles they are always running out of? Get the propaganda straight. One way or the other.

Oh, they still have plenty of dumb bombs to hurl at cities. Just not any to go after legitimate military targets.

Fuck you and your Putin talking points.

Russia is firing missiles at civilians. Period. Live with that you piece of shit.

Actually, most of the sources I use also site western mainstream media and political sources. I avoid ones that are only one sided. I see the good and bad for both sides. Lately the western mainstream media seems to be talking more about how poor the situation is for Ukraine.

We’ve talked in the past about the sources you use. This argument is like saying that you are preparing dinner and most of the ingredients you use are neither rotten nor filled with feces.

It doesn’t really improve anything.

Dumb bombs are short range. Seldom used due to need of aircraft to release. Guided glide bombs are being used more now. But relatively close to the front. Missiles are still used for precision attack at long range.

I can understand why media that is not full of propaganda and bullshit confuses you.

You guys are such fun!

God, you’re a complete idiot.

Here’s military ranking of countries from 2020:

2nd: Russia
27th: Ukraine

Note that “Trollstoy88” is a pro-Russian social media troll:

https://twitter.com/russophileLs/status/1668233591908712450
https://twitter.com/wartranslated/status/1685578624303235072

How precious.

I like seeing what folks think. Believe. Most are much stupider and uninformed than you guys. But depressingly. Not by as much as I would hope for the Straight Dope.

You really need to ask? These ‘various sources’ are from ‘various countries,’ you know, the ‘various countries’ with the funny laws letting murders off with no time while sentencing people giving the ‘wrong’ answer to a street interview 10 years in a penal colony. The same ‘various countries’ where people in opposition or out of favor with Putin ‘various leaders’ fall out the window all the time, or where Alexei Navalny ‘various opposition leaders’ are first poisoned abroad and then sentenced to 19 years for opposing Putin ‘various leaders.’