Indian English and "kindly"

[Anaamika]

@Malacandra

As there’s roughly twenty Indians for every Brit, I find this unsurprising.

Ok, per capita then.

[Acsenray]

@cantara

Never heard ‘kindly to the needful’.

It’s “kindly do the needful.” As has been stated before, it means, “Please do what needs to be done (as described or referred to previously).” And it might suggest that the requester is not sure exactly what steps or tasks are needed in order to complete the request. (As in “I’m not sure what all you’ve got to do to get this done, but please do it.”)

I found this example on the Web site of the Indian Income Tax Department:

Issued as per the orders of Chief Commissioner of Income Tax, Kochi.

OFFICE OF THE CHIEF COMMISSIONER OF INCOME TAX, KOCHI
Central Revenue Building, I.S.Press Road, Kochi-682 018
No.CC/CHN/PR 35/2005-06 Dated : 08-11-2005

To,

The Advertisement Manager,
The Hindu,
Kochi.

Sir,
Sub : Release of advertisement for Income Tax Dept- reg.
******************
I am enclosing herewith a material for advertisement to be published in the National Edition of your esteemed daily. The advertisement is to be released on 10th November,2005. The size of the advertisement should be 2col x 15cms and may be given on an inner page/business page with prominence. Your are requested to prepare the bill at DAVP rates and forward the same to the Asst. Commissioner of Income Tax(H),O/o The Chief Commissioner of Income Tax, Kochi for payment. Kindly do the needful.

  Yours faithfully, 

  (N.T.KARTHIKEYAN)
  Addl. Commissioner of Income Tax(T), Kochi

Encl:As above. For Chief Commissioner of Income Tax, Kochi.
Copy to : The Asst Commissioner of Income tax(H)
O/o the CCIT , Kochi.

[Excalibre]

@cantara

My 70 year old father uses the word kindly on a regular basis, typically when saying thank you. He’s got it on his answering machine message, “Thank you kindly.” I always knew that most people didn’t use it but was always exposed to it from him. His parents spoke english as a second language after they emmigrated to Ontario (north of Minnesota) from the Ukraine just before WW1. I assume he picked up the usage from a school teacher. I’ll ask if he had any British teachers when he was growing up in the 1940s.

Never heard ‘kindly to the needful’.

“Thank you kindly” sounds a touch old-fashioned to my ears, but I actually say it not terribly infrequently. Is “kindly” really so unfamiliar to most people?

[spingears]

@elmwood

I;ve even seen “Please kindly”, as if “kindly” alone wwasn’t polite enough.What are the origins of Indian English speakers’ infatuation with “kindly”?

Wasn’t it the British who taught them English?

[Excalibre]

@spingears

Wasn’t it the British who taught them English?

:rolleyes: No, it was the Lebanese.

[Marathon]

<The Exorcist>

“And I’m the Devil. Now KINDLY UNDO THESE STRAPS!”

</The Exorcist>

Sorry. It was the first thing I thought of.

[Walloon]

I’ve always found Indians to be some of the most polite people on earth, so the frequent use of “kindly” doesn’t surprise me.

[JillGat]

@OttoDaFe

One that I get a lot at work (we “co-source” with an Indian company) is “kindly do the needful” to accomplish whatever it is that the writer wants done. Sort of jarring the first time or three, but you do indeed get used to it.

“Kindly” is used instead of “Please” in most Caribbean countries, too, as well as “Kindly do the needful.” I didn’t even know “needful” was a word.

[Sutremaine]

@Martha

Then again, some US English terms (gotten) are no longer used in UK English. It underwent an equivalent process to Indian English.

I use ‘gotten’ all the time, and so do people around me (I checked, just in case it was one of my quirks). Are we talking about one particular usage, or the whole word? Which bits of Britain does this apply to?

[chaoticbear]

@Sutremaine

I use ‘gotten’ all the time, and so do people around me (I checked, just in case it was one of my quirks). Are we talking about one particular usage, or the whole word? Which bits of Britain does this apply to?

Have, got, have gotten, right?

[Celyn]

@Sutremaine

I use ‘gotten’ all the time, and so do people around me (I checked, just in case it was one of my quirks). Are we talking about one particular usage, or the whole word? Which bits of Britain does this apply to?

That does surprise me, actually. While I do know that “gotten” used to exist in British English, I have always regarded it as an Americanism. This means that I accept it from, say, my American sis-in-law, but when I hear it from British people, I tend to think, rather sniffily, “o god, some stupid useless teenage dimwit who thinks it’s clever to use American-speak that they have picked up from television.”

So, Sutremaine, now I have learned that I should not be quite so nasty, lest I ever meet you unknowingly.

As for “which bits of Britain”, well, I have lived in a few places in Scotland, in Surrey, then in London, and in west Wales, and heard nothing to change my mind. This is interesting, though, so there are places where it is a normal usage? (Note, if that sounds snarky, it’s not meant to be: I am genuinely interested to learn of this.)

(Tangent - I’m not going to look for a cite, 'cos I don’t know where in my big big mess the book is, but Dorothy Parker, (in one of her review pieces, I think), reacts to the use of “gotten” as though it were as very strange and not very good word. Of course, it will now happen that as soon as I hit “submit”, the Collected Whatsits of D. Parker will suddenly appear from nowhere.)

It would be interesting to know which areas do use it in Britain, Sutremaine, but if you don’t feel like mentioning a vague location, that’s fine. Possibly an age-related prejudice of mine? I’m 44, for what that’s worth.

[Bytegeist]

@chaoticbear

Have, got, have gotten, right?

It’s get, got, have gotten. The same pattern as forget, forgot, have forgotten, as the words are used in the U.S. anyway. (Canada as well?) The point the Brits here are making, I believe, is that they always use “got” for both past tense forms.

You’ll also hear “have got” over here in North America – as in, “I have got to be more careful” – but that’s not really using the past tense of “get”. (It’s not the past tense form of “I get to be more careful.”, but instead means “I must be more careful.”) Perhaps a real grammarian can speak to what’s going on there.

[chaoticbear]

Ssh, you! It was early.