Infinite universe why are things still happening

Great Debates
1

When i say universe i am mean in the sense that it can go back before big bang and it is still our universe

If universe has no beginning wont all events of happened
or can i say we are in the middle of it.Not really because there has been a infinite amount of time allready .hasnt there so everything has happened

if there are a infinite amount of events possible i seem to be able to say “we are in the middle” but then my thought say no because there was no beginning so theres been enough time for all events

so how does this work can you make sense of this?
i cant seem to beable to say there is a infinite amount of time and events and be somewhere in the middle. we must beable to be in the middle because it has happened i know theres no middle as such because theres no beginning or end.but there just doesnt seem to be anywhere.to pop in at.

if i am in the universe now and it didnt begin and its not going to end why is it possible to say that all things would of happened because there has been a non beginning universe ,if i reply that there is a non ending amount of events then maybe this is the answer.it feels right “ish” this answer do you think this is correct?

2

Reality can always just repeat itself. Once a Roulette Wheel has shown all of the numbers one through thirty-six (and zero and double-zero) does it stop functioning?

3

As I pointed out in the parallel thread, contrary to popular belief, even with infinite time it is not guaranteed that every possible event will happen.

4

Our universe has a definite beginning, the Big Bang. So we aren’t in the middle of infinite time. Nor does the universe stay the same over that infinite time anyway; much that is possible now won’t be in the distant future.

5

This will be repeating things, and will only be the current agreed theory.

It wouldn’t be. Our universe came from the big bang. Time came from it, too. There is no universe and no time before it. We don’t get to go there or talk about that.

Per wiki it was 13.798 ± 0.037 billion years ago.

Nope. See above.

We don’t know if we’ll get an infinite amount of time at the other end, either.

Because they are? What would stop them? Is there some kind of check list and when the Holy Scavenger Hunt is over the universe is packed away?

Things have been happening for less than 14 billion years. I imagine a lot of it is repetative. [4 hydrogen atoms merge into 1 helium atom, 4 hydrogen atoms merge into 1 helium atom, 4 hydrogen atoms merge into 1 helium atom, 4 hydrogen atoms merge into 1 helium atom, 4 hydrogen atome mergs into 1 helium atom, 4 hydrogen atome merge into 1 helium atom, 4 hydrogen atoms merge into 1 helium atom, 4 hydrogen atome merge into 1 helium atom, . . . ]

Did something stop the sun saying, ‘sorry, Jack, you’re repeating yourself’?

6

heres some more

say we have infinite time ,we also need infinite events,and now i will add infinite area.
when i say events, i mean,as simple as 1 photon flying across a empty area(in a straight

line),each moment of time the photon is in a different place.and that = a event.

now say. i ask has the photon got to coordianates 23,45(along its line) .and some one says no

,“there hasnt been enough time yet” .So why hasnt it got there yet.?
you can see it hasnt got to some points along its line but any explanation for a reason why

fails.there has always been enough time.so how come its got to some places and not others.

Quote: Originally Posted by congoo
When i say universe i am mean in the sense that it can go back before big bang and it is still

our universe . . .

It wouldn’t be. Our universe came from the big bang. Time came from it, too. There is no universe

and no time before it. We don’t get to go there or talk about that.

i would never confine myself to that thought.i didnt know it was offical that time and space

started there rarther a very strong notion that it does.
i mean what is so obvouius that you would never doubt it(fire hurts if i put my hand in it).then

compare the notion that time/space defantly started at big bang.and see if you feel so

confidant(i suppose you can feel it is true but i dont).confidant enough to never question it,

how do you think enstien questioned newton ideas .he had to break the notion that they where

correct.
.

Things have been happening for less than 14 billion years. I imagine a lot of it is repetative.

[4 hydrogen atoms merge into 1 helium atom, 4 hydrogen atoms merge into 1 helium atom, 4 hydrogen

atoms merge into 1 helium atom, 4 hydrogen atoms merge into 1 helium atom, 4 hydrogen atome mergs

into 1 helium atom, 4 hydrogen atome merge into 1 helium atom, 4 hydrogen atoms merge into 1

helium atom, 4 hydrogen atome merge into 1 helium atom

if you can imagine this has truely been repeating and a non beginning and i say has it got to (4

hydrogen atoms merge into 1 helium atom)and you say no .what is your explantion for why not?

writting congoo
why are things still happening

the logical thought tends to think there has always been enough time to get to each

repeat(otherwise explain how it hasnt.)
this leads to the question “why are things still happening”
o i just read this
This will be repeating things, and will only be the current agreed theory.
i think my rebutal was still worth my time.
Reality can always just repeat itself. Once a Roulette Wheel has shown all of the numbers one

through thirty-six (and zero and double-zero) does it stop functioning

again i ask why hasnt it got to one of those numbers (its still funtioning)?

As I pointed out in the parallel thread, contrary to popular belief, even with infinite time it

is not guaranteed that every possible event will happen.

yes i started this thread because this is a different angle i think.and i think ever possible

event will happen you have added a new idea of random if each event has more than 1 possible

out come and 1 cancels the others is all you are saying.
if each event only had 1 outcome then every possible event will happen given enough time.
it is only because you introduced more than 1 outcome to a event and said that, then that

canceled out the other possiblity that you can say "even with infinite time it is not

guaranteed that every possible event will happen"
it simple comes down to how you define possible event .if you do not use it as either heads or

tails for each possible event and have only heads (theres is no tails possible) then all possible

events happen.
if a atom is fly threw the sky and if it goes right then a hole section of realtiy that would of

happened if it went left doesnt happen.you are defineing THAT event that didnt happen as a

possible event.(if you look at it before it happens i agree it a posible event but i ask the

question after after it happens i can not use it was a possible event .because it wasnt because

it didnt happen)
But if that atom has a moment where we think it could of gone in either direction that is a way

of looking at realtiy .that is your beleif that ,that is possible.
i belief the atom goes right because it “had to” there was never a option for it to go left .and

there is never a option for anything to do anthing that cancels out something else.i mean i am

waving my hand at the computer that has canceled out that same moments possibltiy that i could

of got up and shouted.this has changed the course of realtiy.no it is my belief i waved my hand

because there was no other option at that moment there are not 2 or more options in each moment

or event.

please forgods sake forgive the spelling mistakes i will edit as i can.i have to write as i think

and ca not stop to correct. in the second

7

I think I speak for most of us when I say, “huh?”

8

Thank you. Sometimes I think I’m the only person saying this.

Someday, somewhere, there may be a tree whose fruit looks precisely like tiny replicas of Sanjay Gupta. It’s possible, but may never happen, even with infinite time.

9

that other thread is not the same and you will see as i am just about to disprove that as well.
this is different you just havent,have but arent bothered cant be bothered,not intrested really ,

10

If you can’t be bothered to take the time to make your posts readable to human beings, why should they be bothered to take the time to read them?

You seem like you have some kind of argument to promulgate. Unfortunately, it is indecipherable and incoherent.

Also, TL;DR.

Disprove what?

It’s clear you have some kind of thesis. Unfortunately, it is indecipherable and incoherent.

Again, if you can’t be bothered to take the time to make posts that can be deciphered by human beings, why should they be bothered to take the time to decode them?

Please, please, please, summarize your thesis and communicate it as if you were explaining to somebody who is not psychic. This isn’t a real time board. You can spend as long as you want writing and editing your posts. It’s almost always a good idea to do so, especially if you have a detailed or subtle point to make.

11

disprove the coin flip

its here as it was above “clear”

heres some more

say we have infinite time ,we also need infinite events,and now i will add infinite area.
when i say events, i mean,as simple as 1 photon flying across a empty area(in a straight

line),each moment of time the photon is in a different place.and that = a event.

now say. i ask has the photon got to coordianates 23,45(along its line) .and some one says no

,“there hasnt been enough time yet” .So why hasnt it got there yet.?
you can see it hasnt got to some points along its line but any explanation for a reason why

fails.there has always been enough time.so how come its got to some places and not others.

12

Just picking out one piece of this that I can even understand, you’re making false assumptions. As we understand things today, there has not been infinite time since the start of this universe, so we don’t need an infinite number of events or area. It’s not even clear that those two would follow from infinite time. Repeating events makes perfect sense, and the area isn’t really tied to time or events.

So I agree with others who’ve said you need to slow down and write much more clearly. Take some time to collect your thoughts and put them down in a fashion where others can understand your points.

13

there is only 2 possibilities
of this universe it either started from nothing or it never started(it has no beginning).you,ve choosen its started ive choosen it hasn,t.whats the big deal.
theres a photon going across a infinite area ask your self has it got to any point along that line.if you say no it hasnt got to such and such point, then ask why,remmeber you can not answer with it hasnt had enough time.

14

Photons don’t “go” anywhere. They are instantaneous events with their emission and absorption happening simultaneously. Their apparent motion is merely a function of our particular reference frame.

15

The big deal is that the evidence supports my case, and it doesn’t support yours.

16

well i have just looked at photons on google and they seem to move to me.
also i have never come across your point before.
thirdly just replace the photon with anything that moves electron marlbe what ever.
TELEMARK wrote
The big deal is that the evidence supports my case, and it doesn’t support yours.
sure so what it supports you it doesnt confirm it.the evidence for my case maybe just around the corner. it doesnt mean i cant ask my question.your becoming fanatical.

17

Well, that’s not exactly proof. Actually, it’s not really objective evidence, either. It’s subjective evidence not backed by anything more.

  1. Learn to use the ‘quote’ tags, please.

  2. It’s not really fanatical to ask for evidence. At the moment, you have absolutely zero objective evidence, only some subjective evidence.

It’s well and good to say “my idea might be right” but it’s entirely another to say that somebody is being ‘fanatical’ because their position is based on all the evidence gathered to date.

To the contrary, it’s rather egotistical to presume that other people should accept as “proof” something that has no objective evidence behind it, that cannot be explained simply and effectively (honestly, I’m still not entirely sure what your thesis is - only that you appear to believe it and can only explain it incoherently), and one you presume we should accept for no better reason than it makes sense only to you.

18

Photons move within your reference frame. However, within the reference frame of the photon it doesn’t move at all.

It’s an unavoidable side effect of relativity, albeit not a commonly discussed one.

That makes a HUGE difference. Electrons and marbles certainly move. However, you still have a problem with simultaneity. It’s impossible to ask “has the electron reached this point on its path yet” without specifying your reference frame. Some observers will say that it has, while others will say that it hasn’t. It all depends on how they define “now”.

(BTW, it would help a great deal if you would take the time to capitalize, punctuate, and use the quote function. Expecting other people to do the work of wading through your unformatted prose is kind of rude.)

19

o yea i know that thats different to what he said.they dont experence movement like if i,m running and everything else is running at the same speed next to me. Nothings moving because theres nothing that isnt moving kinda thing.

Well use a marble, i will ask myself has the marble reached the point yet .and i see it hasnt. How do i answer this. there is infinite time backwards remmeber.
IT IS was all about this line above.

whether the universe started from nothing or has always been to me is 50/50 theres no proof either way.you have more evidence supporting you yes.
the fact remains i am not talking about this, it is not my point, only a side issue so why is he pushing this particular point when it is not important to my point.if you look at the first thing i said in my openning post let me remind you

that was the very first thing i wrote.you think i dont know.that somebody wasnt going start this line.i was trying to block it of before.but here we are with .who,s right, well its 50/50 whether it started from nothing or not .is that correct you dont have proof it started from nothing .evidence that point to it looking that way yes but thats not proof is it?

20

No, you’re not getting it. Photons arrive at their destination instantaneously. They travel zero distance. From the point of view of the photon, it’s not a trip, it’s an event.

And here are two simple rules that will make your posts far more readable:

  1. The first word in a sentence is always capitalized.
  2. When you end a sentence, type a period followed by a space.

The farther back we look in time, the hotter and denser the universe gets. Extrapolating, we can see a point where the universe is infinitely hot and infinitely dense and the laws of space and time completely break down. That seems like a reasonable place to say “the universe starts here”. You certainly can’t have any photons, electrons, or marbles traveling along an uninterrupted infinite trajectory through the Big Bang.