I know you think you’re joking. But Princhester quite obviously is a pointy-headed little bigot.
But, then, so are you.
fwiw, I think pulling out would be as or more stupid than Bush’s handeling of this whole affair. There needs to be a change in the approach, yes, but pulling out completely and letting them swing in the wind would be just plain stupid.
fwiw take 2, I find the folks in Afghanistan fighting the coalition to be complete and utter fucknuggets. There is a legitimacy and diplomatic understanding of the necessity of our actions there, even by the populace, that is lacking in Iraq.
So enlighten me. Why am I a bigot? Please show me posts on this site that show me to be a bigot? I may be a left wing muppet but then a lot of us are.
I’d rather he show that your point-headed.
Not my day . . .
I’d rather he show that you’re pointy-headed.
A point-headed muppet. Yahoo, I’m Beaker.
Scratch that request LonesomePolecat
Let’s not totally derail this thread.
Here’s a nice new one to show me for the bigot I am.
I’m not sure what you mean by this. Americans have not, historically been imperialists. Correct me if I’m wrong (and I may be) but with the exception of freed slaves, we’ve never occupied land in Africa. We’ve never occupied Australia, South America, or Asia. Barring some islands in the Gulf of Mexico, and the Pacific, we’ve historically not been territory expanders.
I think there’s something you must understand: Americans, by and large, are terribly naive. We honestly, truly, and fully believe that we are forces of good. I know this is hard to understand when you are not here, but the vast majority of people in this country, think we’re helping. I know it’s stupid, I know it’s silly, and I know it’s not very self-aware, but the vast majority of Americans, can honesty not understand why people don’t like us.
That said I still can’t believe you still say “rooting” with the insurgency is fucked up. You can’t say: “I support some of what they do but not the bulk of what they do”. According to this site roughly 25,000 civilians have been killed. How many of these are due to American forces, and how many due to the insurgency? Remember, 1800 American soldiers have died. So let’s even say less than half the civilian deaths are due to your guys. If the insurgents have killed only 10,000 of those civilians, your guys have killed 80 civilians for every soldier. Your guys are not good guys.
That’s the point I’m trying to make. The insurgents don’t want America out. Despite what Mr. Dribble believes. They do not have the same goals as he does. That is what I’m trying to tell him. He is backing people whose goal is completely different than his. Al Qaeda, today again said that American should leave Iraq. Saying “Our message is clear: You will not be safe until you withdraw from our land, stop stealing our oil and wealth and stop supporting the corrupt rulers,”. What the fuck? Since when was Iraq part of Al Qaeda?
Ever hear of Manifest Destiny? Up until very recently, we have most assuredly been territory expanders.
Oh and one more thing… What do you believe the goal of the occupier is? Honestly. I’ll be damed if I can figure it out. I think that Bush and his advisers were pretty altruistic on this account. I think they completely, and totally believed that the entire Middle East would fall into democracy like dominoes if they just got rid of Saddam Hussein.
But if you have a better idea let me know. However, don’t give me: “take over the oil”, because I’m not buying it. This just doesn’t make sense. We have spent far more to attack, take over, and secure the country than we could ever make in oil. I think have a democratic country with huge oil reserves was a bonus, but I don’t believe it was the goal.
Oh and I am terribly sorry, about fucking up your name, I just realized it’s Dibble.
I certainly have. This is one of the reasons I don’t care for wikipedia. Manifest destiny was not expanded intercontinentally and was not widely supported. Here’s a better site.
The wiki site was merely one of a plethora of available sites. Even your site does not say it was not widely supported, it says there was opposition and fragmentation. Do you truly believe that expansionism was not a part of the national culture just as much as evangelical Christianity and do-goodism? It may help you to answer this question to look at a map of the U.S. as it appears to me to not stop at the Appalachian Mountains.
from the site I cited
I absolutely do not believe that Americans are by-nature Imperialists. But we’ll just have to agree to disagree on that count.
Imperialism isn’t just having colonies - it’s also extending your military might where the locals may not necessarily want it. Tell the Philipines you’ve never been imperialists - or the Hawaiians, or your own First Peoples, for that matter. America is founded on territorial expansion, you’ve just been going through a slow century or so.
I’ve admitted “rooting” is a bad choice of words. Let’s move on, shall we.
Yes, I can. You may not be in agreement, or you may think that’s hypocritical. If so, say so, but don’t tell me I can’t have my own thoughts on the matter.
Try less than 25%:
[
](http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/middle_east/4694123.stm)
ummm, there’s two contradictory statements up there, which is it? Americans out or not? Al Qaeda’s been in Iraq since your little war let them in.
I’d say the goal was multifaceted, and included elements of establishing a secure military base outside Saudi, having a show of force against eg Iran and Syria, and a little bit about oil. Also a little bit of petty revenge. I believe installing democracy was the furthest thing from Bush and Rumsfeld’s mind. In fact, I believe there first plan was to install a puppet stooge figurehead, but people saw through their first choice pretty easily.
I was sure you didn’t mess up my name deliberately, unlike some people…
OK. 
Change “if” to when, and remove “suddenly”.
Then this will happen…
All in all, I’d say a pretty good description of what will happen. Whether we pull out today, or 10 years from now, THIS IS INEVITABLE!
I say pull out, ring the fight bell and let’s get this shit over with.
Here’s my question:
Say there is some way to ask all Iraqis if they want US troops out immediately. For those who argue that we have the responsibility to fix what we’ve broken, what percentage of Iraqis saying, “No, go home” would it take for you to support leaving now?
Personally, I advocate leaving now no matter what. Just get the hell out. Now. Period.
Dear Og. Ya go to work for eight hours and the thread shuffles on without you.
I know we weren’t invited, but for about eight seconds there we were welcomed as liberators. 
There are good parts though. The infrastructure would be in better shape if the insurgents would quit blowing them up. Saddam is gone. Elections have been held. That’s a good thing as long as Florida isn’t involved. I’m sure there are more good things, but three hours of poor sleep has combined with eight hours work to make me one small step above drooling imbecile. The point is that good things have taken place and they should be taken into account before we go handing out the jumpboots.
Underdog status can’t be the only positive thing that you can say about the insurgents, cause I can think of a whole lot of negatives that beat it.
And Princhester, kindly bite me. I asked an honest question because I wanted to know where he was coming from so maybe we could discuss this without the insults and hyperbole. I’m not trying to be thick. If you don’t like people trying to discuss things like adults, kindly leave the talking to me and Dibble.
You are either a liar or someone who has the same grasp of the English language as rwjefferson (or possibly both).
You clearly said “mercenary bodyguards.” It would behoove you, if you truly want people to understand you, to inform your audience what your personal definitions of words are if you’re going to be using those definitions instead of the usually accepted meanings of the words.