It makes sense for many young people to live with their parents. But except for a few places, it is not THAT tough for a person to live on their own or with a roommate. I mean, really, an investment banker? If that’s what you think you have to be to live on your own, you’ll never be free.
[quote=“Fuzzy_Dunlop, post:17, topic:701762”]
I’m 38, if you are only 30, I don’t think you would have experienced a really good job market; nothing like what I saw in the late 90’s. For example, the equivalent of eleven dollars an hour would have been a complete joke; $11 today would have been $7.70 in 1999 adjusting for inflation. You could make more than that working at McDonalds; heck, any completely unskilled no experience labor job would start at 10 an hour back then, in many cases with benefits. You have only experienced the new normal more or less, so the old normal is more of an unknown for you. And why on earth would it make more sense to spend more money to live with with 2 non family members than spend less money to live with your family? To me that only makes sense if you do not get along with your family.
We could go toe to toe with comparative stats on student loans etc. We could also talk about the rise in unpaid internships, the decrease in jobs stability, the increase in rent, the increase in difficulty in buying a home - very few if any macroeconomic indicators point to increasing financial stability for the middle class.
Really? It’s under $300 a month at a standard payment plan. If $300 is a staggeringly large payment for a college graduate then they should probably live at home.
Also, the average starting salary for a college graduate is currently $45,000 - not under $25. At $45,000, your take home pay on a daily basis is about $130. You’ll have made your student loan payment for the month after working 3 days. That’s the least staggering thing I’ve heard all day.
I need a cite for that part I bolded, if it’s true, I’ll need to rethink everything.
There’s more to moving into an apartment than being able to spring for the first month’s rent + security deposit. The “saving up” part is for things like- you know- furniture, appliances (which aren’t always present in an apartment,) utility bills, food, renter’s insurance, blah blah. “Moving out” is more than just “Hey, I found a place, bye folks!”
“18 and out” is pretty much a post-WWII United States mindset. It’s from a time when US industry was at its peak, and one had a far better chance finding a job right out of high school. If you lived in a manufacturing town, you could probably get a decent-paying job at a local plant, even unskilled labor. Or you’d start learning a trade in high school, then when you were done you could pursue a skilled trade.
Nowadays, skilled trades and manufacturing jobs are looked down on as being only suitable for uneducated shitkickers, and you pretty much have to have a four year degree for anyone to consider hiring you for anything more than minimum wage otherwise. “18 and out” pretty much died in the 1990s.
You realize that people who have a problem with 25 being the new 21, in general, aren’t 20 or younger, right? We’ve all moved out on our own. Get an apartment that does have necessary appliances. All but the cheapest dives will have a stove. Dishwashers and washing machines aren’t necessary. Use a sink and a laundromat.
Get shitty furniture at yard sales or when your uncle is replacing his couch. Don’t get renter’s insurance because you’re 22 and everything you own is practically worthless.
Just figure it out like everybody else does. It’s a useful life experience.
It’s staggeringly large for someone who finds themselves suddenly unemployed, or unemployed for any real length of time–hence the comment about “no job security”. And I find your $45,000 number hard to believe.
Yeah, life is risky. Most people in their 50s can’t easily afford extended unemployment either. How is that an argument for waiting until you’re 25 to start living as an independent adult?
Here’s a second cite on the average income: Fast Facts: Income of young adults (77), if you don’t like Ravenman’s.
I adjusted my first full-time job after college for inflation, and in today’s dollars it would be $27,280. And life was awesome.
Plus, back in those days, there was no craiglist where hipsters with iPhone 6s would complain that spending $40 for a perfectly fine in-the-window air conditioner was too much money, would you take $15 instead?
[/crotchety old man]
Me too. Less than 40% of recent grads make $45,000
And do those numbers only take in account the % earning more than $0?
It’s an average starting salary. Of course a lot of graduates are going to make less than that. That’s what makes it an average. I would be interested in knowing the median salary but it doesn’t mean $45,000 isn’t the average just because some people make less than that. Nobody said starting salary is uniform.
Ugh, I wasn’t expecting that. I don’t have time to rethink everything today, it’s Sunday goddammit. Maybe next week. But on Monday the first thing I’m doing is asking for a raise . . . .
How are they calculating benefits in those numbers btw?
And yes, elfkin makes good points, but even with all that, I specifically thought starting salary would be lower - up to three years ago Robert Reich was saying around 35k, but that may have been median.
I assume starting salary means starting salary.
You’re falling into the trap of assuming everyone has every possible option equally available at all times.
as well as the “the way things worked for me is the only possible correct way to do it” mindset.
Why would you assume that? I was not aware the term salary necessarily made that distnction, but I will look it up . … .
Uh, because the word “salary” is generally defined and understood to be a fixed annual monetary compensation that does not include the value of fringe benefits? Call me crazy…
Who knows, maybe the survey asked respondents to submit their “salaries” in terms of Canadian “dollars.”
Wikipedia is not the absolute best source fr solving any dispute, but just to give you an idea of what my thoughts on the meaning of the word salary here’s what it says:
So, if you want to continue to dispute what the word salary means, I can look for more evidence to solidify the point. If you want to concede the above definition of salary is accurate, just answer the original question. Pretty please, with sugar on top.
Please cite a source for this.
Taking a risk where the always-on-the-horizon potential consequence is “utter financial ruin” is a different animal entirely than living in a world where, every so often, unforeseen circumstances conspire to leave someone in utter financial ruin. In the one case, simply by exercising judicious caution one can reduce the chances of being left homeless with debt collectors nipping at one’s heels almost to zero, whereas in the other case one’s circumstances are beyond one’s control. Besides, the 50-year-old unemployed person has had 25+ years to build up savings, a retirement fund perhaps, job experience, connections, and the like. The 22-year-old has had no such time.