Is electrocution by felling a tree onto a power line likely?

Last summer I started clearing land out for a driveway that will go to a future home. The driveway runs perpendicular to a private road that has a power line which services a few cottages further down the road. Never before operating a chainsaw, I started away from the lines while getting comfortable with felling trees.
A few days pass and I’m at the very last tree that needs to come down, rushing to get it over with. Looking back, I would guess that it had quite the lean that I missed and/or I cut through the hinge, but at the time it seemed small enough that I could push it over if I ran into trouble. Too small for wedges.
Anyway, I complete the cut and it starts going the wrong way towards the power lines. I fight it, trying to push it the other way but I just end up slowing it’s fall. In a mess of branches in comes to rest on both the lines. Nothing happens. I ended up cutting off the base enough times until was straight enough that I could then push it over the right way.

Now then, not only am I obviously not a very smart man, I also have very poor understanding of electricity. The lines were two uncoated aluminum or steel sheathed wires. I haven’t seen any transformers in the area and I would guess that they’re only a 240 volt for small distribution. The tree, a live red spruce, with a enough branches that it very easily should have been able to complete the circuity between the hot and the neutral wires. I’ve been told that trees do conduct electricity but they’re just not a good very good conductor.
What happened? By some small chance did the tree only hit the one wire? Did it complete the circuity but not flow through it? Did it flow through it but not spark and either not ground itself down the tree or head down the tree skipping a moisture ridden human.

What would have happened if it was a higher voltage distribution line?

If they were indeed from the secondary of a U.S. residential transformer (120 V/240 V split phase), then it’s unlikely a tree would have a low enough resistance to cause much current to flow through it.

If it had been a HV line, though, things could have (and should have) gotten interesting…

See this video for one example:

ORIGINAL! Bellingham Carolina & Grant St Tree Fire Explosion 10.03.09: - YouTube

I’d not have wanted to be at the base of that tree with or without a chainsaw.

The distribution lines in most areas of the US run at 7,000 volts.

I like how the guy says “this is probably like four hundred and forty thousand volts or something.” One of the comments says 34,500 volts.

Uh, no.

That’s a distribution line, not a transmission line. Older distribution lines in the U.S. tend to be anywhere from about 3,000 to 6,000 volts or so. Newer ones are in the 6,000 to 12,000 volt range. GaryM’s 7,000 volts is fairly close to typical. Actual voltages on systems that I have had experience with are 3600, 4160, 7200, and 13.8 kV.

ETA: Notice that the power came back on after the line tripped near the end of the video. That’s a recloser doing its job. Power line faults are fairly common as tree limbs often blow into power lines and you have all kinds of similar faults. Unlike in the video, most of the time these faults clear themselves. So, unlike the breakers in your home, the power line breakers will automatically switch themselves back on. Reclosers are programmable, but the way they are usually set, they try a couple of times fairly quickly (usually within a second or two), then try once after a short time (anywhere from 30 seconds to a couple of minutes) and then they give up, and at that point a power company lineman has to come out and figure out what the problem is.

It wouldn’t surprise me if the power had come back on and the tree sparked up again about 2 minutes after the video ended.

Thanks everyone for replying.

Either the transformer is upstream and supplies the power for less than a dozen cottages or it’s a higher voltage line that doesn’t appear to be broken down by your typical transformer. Still probably on the lower end for distribution.

I looked up the resistance of trees and found a study on the resistance of Canyon Live Oak trees. It looks like the median was around 13000 ohms or around the low end of what a human would be but I’m not sure how that relates to how electricity flows. I would guess that it would take the easiest path to the ground, meaning it would probably skip me and my plastic handled chainsaw, but how do I figure out at what voltage is something likely to flow through something and to where? I understand that the higher to voltage the more it can overcome resistance.

It seems the whole ‘felling a tree onto a power line’ thing isn’t all the common and most of your power line safety literature has more to do with arcing than completing a circuit. I don’t even know if it would want to head towards the ground or just back to the other wire.

I’ve thought about it a bit more and realize that the tree must act as a resistor against the most of the electric shock. If it’s true that current = voltage divided by resistance than at 240 volts with 13kohm, I would receive 18.4 mA, if I calculated correctly, but I believe I would then wouldn’t I have to take into account my own skin resistance?
So if I did only have 1kohm of resistance, it would be just enough energy that I couldn’t let go, but probably not nearly enough to kill me. With a 7000 volt distribution line we’re looking at 538 mA, way above where ventricular fibrillation starts but a fair amount under cardiac standstill, and where your tissue starts to burn…

I wager that one could easily survive a hit from a 7000 volt line if their skin is dry enough. With a million ohms of resistance we’re looking at just .41 mA, which apparently you couldn’t notice.

Would someone kindly check my math? Seems wrong to me.

If the wires were from the secondary of a residential transformer, and the top of the tree touched one of the bare wires, then the top of the tree would have a peak voltage of 170 V relative to earth ground. If the bottom of the tree was touching earth, then the peak current through the tree would be 170/R[sub]tree[/sub]. If you touched the side of this tree while this was happening, the model changes… the tree is a voltage divider, and the current through you would depend on a number of factors (e.g. your body resistance, the resistance between you and earth ground, etc.).

Dead wrong. Apart from anything else, your dead skin is only a very thin layer and 7kV will punch right through it.

Here in Blighty we distribute at 11 kV, and what with stupidity and intended theft of copper, its total lethality is demonstrated on a weekly basis.

Being a bit fanatical about back-ups, I rarely lose stuff. The worst loss was a page of text when the power went out. It went out because two young lads had broken into my local substation and fried themselves. Sorta put it in perspective.

Although I no doubt agree with you that electricity can be a horrible killer that deserves as much caution as you can spare when working with it, if the conditions are right, high voltage is completely survivable, if you’re the right person.
There has been a fair number of cases where someone has survived more than 12,000 volts. It’s unlikely, sure, but some people have natural high resistance in their skin probably do to a very low moisture content. I don’t think it’s unusual to find people with a resistance of a million ohms or more. At that level of resistance it would be a mere 12 milliamp painful shock.

That’s what so wild about it, you could put two different people in a room and shock them with 120 volts. One could die on the spot while the other wouldn’t even blink.

I feel that’s the problem with describing the safety issues with it, it’s too abstract for stupid people, like myself, to get their mind around. Everyone can understand why they shouldn’t put their hand in a moving saw, but tell someone not to work within a certain amount of feet near a power line without explaining it further is just asking for someone to disregard it, until it bites them…

Edit: I’ll back this up with a quote from OSHA on electrical incidents:

[QUOTE=]
Wet conditions are common during low-voltage electrocutions. Under dry conditions, human skin is very resistant. Wet skin dramatically drops the body’s resistance.
Dry Conditions: Current = Volts/Ohms = 120/100,000 = 1mA
a barely perceptible level of current

Wet conditions: Current = Volts/Ohms = 120/1,000 = 120mA
sufficient current to cause ventricular fibrillation
[/QUOTE]

Current is volts divided by ohms. 7000/1000000 = 7mA. You should be able to feel that but it shouldn’t be dangerous.

But this assumes that your body is purely resistive OR that the supply is DC. In reality the human body is also capacitively coupled to earth, which means the total impedance for AC is much smaller than a million ohms.

Edison was right after all. AC is more dangerous than DC.

See this video for a demonstration:

The human body isn’t a simple ohmic resistor. At low voltages, the human body has a fairly high resistance, several hundred thousand ohms or higher. At higher voltages, the effective resistance of the human body can easily drop to under 1,000 ohms. One of the more common electrical models of the human body is a resistor in series with a resistor and capacitor in parallel. However, the values of those components changes based on the voltages involved (it’s also an admittedly very much over-simplified model).

Electricity usually tends to kill you in one of two ways.

At lower current levels, the electricity interferes with your heart’s rhythm. It takes a surprisingly small amount of current to potentially screw up your heart. U.S. safety standards tend to be built around 5 mA (0.005 amps) being the “safe” level. Anything above that could kill you. The thing about this though is that it’s a bit hit and miss. Your heart is much more sensitive to disruption at certain times during its cycle than others, so a lot depends on exactly when the shock occurs and where the heart is in its cycle at the time. Hit it at just the right time, though, and the heart goes into fibrillation. Your heart has kind of a funny design in that the fibrillation state is stable. In other words, the heart will happily stay in fibrillation and won’t go back into a normal rhythm unless something else happens (like someone whacks it back into rhythm with a portable defibrillator). In fibrillation, your heart just sits there and shakes chaotically. Since it’s effectively not pumping blood, you pass out quickly and die shortly thereafter.

As the current increases, at first the risk of fibrillation increases along with it, but then a funny thing happens. Once you reach a certain current level, instead of going into fibrillation, the heart muscles all just kinda clamp. At that point the heart isn’t pumping blood, so you are still in a world of hurt unless someone removes the source of the electrical current, but once the current is removed, the heart usually goes back into a normal rhythm all by itself.

Above this current level, the second type of effect kicks in, and you are literally burned to death. The electricity heats up your body and burn damage kills you. This is how the electric chair kills. Electric chairs also tend to work at voltages around 2,000 to 4,000 volts, so they are on the low end of what your typical distribution line would have on it, if you want to put that in perspective. Burn damage is a lot less hit and miss than fibrillation, but some of the survivability does depend on exactly the path that the current takes through your body.

If you haven’t watched the video that GaryM linked to upthread, it’s a really good example of just what a few thousand volts can do to a tree. Similar things happen to a person.

Higher voltages will also punch through thicker levels of insulation (like human skin, tree bark, etc). Trees are also non-linear resistor loads. Once the voltage gets high enough that it can punch its way into the sap, the effective resistance drops dramatically. Lightning often follows the sap down as it flows through a tree, quite often flashing the sap into steam and blowing the tree apart as a result.

Also, current doesn’t take the path of least resistance. Current takes all paths that it can find. It’s just that more current flows through the paths of lesser resistance.

Typically a transformer will supply power to only three or four houses. If you’ve got close to a dozen homes I’d expect there to be at least a couple of transformers involved. Either way, the distribution voltage could be as low as 2400 volts for that area, which wouldn’t cause as much sparking and excitement. If it’s a three-phase feed, they could probably power all of the cottages from a single three-phase transformer at the distribution end of the line. There would be three wires instead of two running out to the cottages, and each cottage would get a connection to two of the three wires (which two wires would be evenly balanced between the cottages).

I think most people are aware that dropping a tree into power lines is bad. Less people are aware of how far electricity can arc, and might think that as long as they don’t touch the wires that they are safe. I think this is why the safety literature is skewed towards arcing.

If the electricity can reach the other wire (i.e. the tree mashed the two wires together) then it will certainly want to go back along the path of the other wire, as well as wanting to go into earth ground through the tree.

Do you have a cite for this?
I could be way off here but that seems like a really low resistance for wood, even a live tree with sap & water content. An wouldn’t it depend heavily of the actual contact surface? Bark would seem to me to be particularly dry and insulating.

When it comes to electrocution, the main thing we look at is the current through your body, and your heart in particular. Anything over 5 mA or so is dangerous territory. Furthermore, peak current is more important than RMS current.

In the vast majority of electrocution cases, the person is electrocuted because they made electrical contact with two things:

  1. A voltage above 40 V that is referenced to earth ground.
  2. Earth ground.

As an example, let’s say you are standing barefoot on your lawn and you’re holding the end of an extension cord that’s plugged into a 120 VAC receptacle at your house. Your feet are touching earth ground, so #2 (above) is satisfied. If you then touch the “hot” conductor in the extension cord with your finger, then you have made electrical contact with a voltage source that is 170 V (peak) relative to earth ground (#1 above). You have met both of the above criteria, you will get zapped, and it won’t feel good. (Let’s hope the extension cord is plugged into a GFCI receptacle in this example.)

But what’s the peak current through your body? In the above example, the current is a function of the following:

  1. Peak voltage (170 V).
  2. Your skin resistance (assume 10000 ohms).
  3. Internal resistance of your body (assume 500 ohms).
  4. Resistance between the dirt you’re standing on and the circuit breaker panel in your house (assume 5 ohms).

Then the peak current through your body would be

170 / ( (2)(10000) + 500 + 5 ) = 0.0083 A = 8.3 mA

You’ll definitely feel 8.3 mA, though I doubt it would be lethal. But let’s say your skin resistance was 2000 ohms for some reason. The peak current would then be 39 mA. And a break in the skin would mean the current would be even higher. Wearing rubber-soled shoes would drastically decrease the current through your body.

Finally, it should be emphasized that the above analysis is based on a simple, first-order model. In reality each resistance is not constant; it is a function of current and time. The risk of electrocution is also a function of frequency.

Yea, when trying to analyze what goes on during an electrocution, the biggest “unknown” is the electrical model of the human body. A single model of the human body (no matter how complex) will never be made due to wide variations between people and circumstances. We can only talk about generalities.

Trying to come up with an electrical model for a tree is a lot like trying to come up with an electrical model for a human. See my post above.

Yeah, you can see it arced about three times on the top wire and then tripped off. The middle part of the video is merely the tree remaining on fire from this and burning, but the power seems to remain off. Eventually it looks like the fire caused part of the tree to collapse onto the lower lines, which may not have even been power lines, but telephone and/or cable TV. Either way it looks like the top power lines eventually tripped back on and maybe the tree caused an even worse short between them and the lower lines before tripping off again.

In any case, the moral of the story is even though trees are a very bad conductor I wouldn’t mess with power lines in any situation. You won’t get too much warning, you’ll either get nothing (as the OP did) or they’ll just kill you! Call your utility company.