Is Islams global image beyond repair?

I know all religions have/are/can be barbaric, but something came to my attention, and it made me think about Islams image at large, I’ll explain.

I was watching about the Chinese crackdown on the Uighurs on YouTube, and the comments were of the usual diatribe against Islam and Islamism, but this make me think of a wider consequence, Uighur nationalism has now been framed as Islamic Jihadi terrorism which needs to be eliminated, and allowed the majority of the commentators an excuse to gave carte blanche to whatever means were necessary to oppress peoples of Muslim faith from attaining their rights, even if it wasn’t about religion at all. The same narrative applies with the Rohingyas or the Chechen’s or the Refugee crisis in Europe, pretty much anything to do with the Islamic world.
I’m old enough to remember how Islams image was different 20-25 years ago, when it was just for lack of better words, a ‘normal’ religion.

Because of this perception, has Islams image to outsiders been completely distorted beyond repair? How do you turn back the clock on this perception or, better yet, improve upon it?

Not so long ago, Germans and Nazis where synonymous in many European minds. Particularly in the minds of those who lived through the war and/or lost family members and loved ones.

In the minds of some, it’s still an ongoing parallel. Brits often joke about avoiding mentioning the war in the presence of sensitive Germans: “I mentioned it once but I think I got away with it.”

Likewise, Russians will joke about calling a personal enemy, “German!”

But on the whole, the Germans have been forgiven by Europe and the West.

And while Germany is a nation state and Islam a multi-national religion, I think with good behaviour and time, they too will be forgiven.

Religions aren’t barbaric; people are.

I think one thing that tends to hurt Islam’s perception is the fact that it’s a more or less decentralized religion, and there are a zillion splinter groups and non-mainstream groups who claim to speak for Islam, or who do things in Islam’s name, and there’s no competing large monolithic Islamic organization speaking out against them.

For example, there are splinter Christian groups who blow up abortion clinics, etc… but the big churches are quick to denounce that sort of behavior, and as a result, it isn’t associated with Christianity as a whole. But when Islamic terrorists blow stuff up, there’s no large Islamic organization denouncing it- just usually a handful of Western imams in the US and UK.

As long as this is the case, I think reforming Islam’s image will be difficult.

you mean you people only pay attention if it is in English, and readily packaged for your consumption, and it is the laziness of the familiarity, not the actual actions.

The denunciations of the terrorists by the ulemas is shown here again and again and yet the repetitions of the new blood libel continues.

This is incorrect.

Right. Few Americans speak Arabic, Farsi, Pashtun, Bengali, or any other language (*) common in Islamic-majority countries. Why would you expect most posters here to pay attention to pronouncements in languages they don’t speak or understand?

(*) Other than English, of course.

You should expect your own news agencies to report it.

so let us try to pay attention

I would not expect that, but of course I wrote

adding the emphasis.

Of course for a website with it memberships exagerated pretension to “fighting ignorance” I would expect that we can avoid seeing the repetition of ignorance promoting claims

adding the emphasis.

since of course this is the claim presuming that the monolingual Anglo who does not know any relevant language can make any effective statement like that…

so if you pay attention it is not the expectation the monolingual Anglos should know what is said in other languages, this would be asking far too much of them, but it is the expectation on a site where its membership has such great pretensions to fighting ignorance, that we can avoid promoting the badly ignorance based sweeping claims.

even more so that in just about every Islamic related thread in the past several years such claims are again and again refuted … but then the bubbling rise of the religious hatred drives its own ignorance.

It’s like you expect it to be translated into English and readily packaged for the consumption of American audiences. That’s crazy talk.

So why don’t you try fighting ignorance, instead of chiding people for it?

My join date is the january 2003. I have learned better than to believe the deluded pretensions.

It may not be beyond repair…but it certainly is beyond my giving a crap about it…

One might wonder why you bother participating at all, then. But for that, one would have to care.

It’s pretty bad when presumably people are supportive of the Chinese suppressing a major religion, especially if they actually bothered looking into the details of their ‘crackdown on the Uighurs’. Hard to believe that anyone who actually knows anything about it would support what the Chinese are doing (and not just to this group but to many other religious groups in China).

I think the image of Islam to outsiders is going to depend mainly on what is informing the opinion of said outsider. If one is going to paint with broad strokes a billion people based on the actions of a few 10’s of thousands or even a few million it’s going to be hard to make the ‘image’ look good. But I don’t think that Islam’s image to outsiders is beyond repair…as others mentioned, the Germans (and Japanese) images have been revised on the worlds stage of outsiders and been repaired.

I’m having a hard time establishing whether you are being sarcastic or not.
If you are, it doesn’t jibe with your previous comment.

I don’t believe so. As OP points out, just a few decades ago Islam was considered a pretty normal, even respected, religion. It wasn’t until the Palestinians started hijacking airlines and bombing things that the religion’s reputation began to decline. Now, of course, it is practically synonymous with terrorism.

A big part of the problem is that the rest of the world doesn’t see anything being done about it. We get politicians up there who claim that jihadist Islam isn’t “really” Islam. Bullshit. There are many millions of people in the world for whom jihadist Islam is the real/only Islam. Trying to segregate the jihadists and label them as “not Islamic” is ploy to (1) discredit the jihadist movement and (2) discourage people from blaming all Muslims for their crimes. But people who claim jihadists aren’t “real” Islam are also avoiding any responsibility for fixing their religion. When Muslims acknowledge that there are deep and fundamental problems within their religion, reject the use of violence, and make genuine attempts to reform it, we will see Islam’s reputation start to be restored.

yes because you can not tell the difference between the different “arabes” of region … we are all all sound and look alike… Of course the actions of the Christian led secular socialist PFLP are very logically connected with the Islamic religion. George Habash was an Imam even…

Now, of course, it is practically synonymous with terrorism.


“jihadist islam”?

What is “jihadist islam”?

There are not millions of backers of the takfiri Salafistes that are the Al Qaeda and the DAESH in any case.

It is the Salafistes that think they are Reform - this “reforming” meme is the lazy and ignorant (and even in the European history ahistorical) analogy to badly understood european history.

But since we are in a world where the actions of secular Christian socialist palestinians get the label of “muslims jihadists” what is expected?

You are building a strawman here, though. There certainly are people who are of the Muslim faith who are terrorists or use terror tactics who aren’t ‘secular Christian socialist palestinians get the label of “muslims jihadists”’, and those people are the ones who are getting all the negative press that is being used to paint all of Islam with a broad brush. It’s neither right nor fair, but you trying to deflect doesn’t really do anything either…nor does it answer the question the OP is actually asking, rather than the narrative you are trying to push. We are talking about the image of Islam to outsiders globally, which is all about perception not necessarily about reality.

The decline of Islam and the entire Arab World’s reputation is very closely linked with the rise of Palestinian terrorism. Whether this reputation is justified or not is a separate question.

Jihadist Islam is exactly what it sounds like. The fact that you refer to Salafists as takfir indicates you are part of the problem. Denying that these people are genuinely Muslim or that their convictions are genuinely held does nothing to help rehabilitate Islam. Until the Muslim world takes a hard look at itself and takes responsibility for stopping this, nothing will change.

And yes, there are millions of jihadists in the world. The Pew Research Center publishes reports on this topic every year. There are many millions of people who believe in Islamic supremacy and agree that jihadist terrorism is justified.

Regardless of whether you agree with their platform or not, it is undeniable that terrorists and extremists currently control the Islamic narrative and dominate our perceptions.

So it is again logical … the negres du sable are all alike anyway.

A term I have no meaning for.

It appears the part of the problem is I know what I am talking about . Takfiri, those who declare Takfir, that is those who are saying the others are in Kufr, unbelief.

No I am not part of the problem, I understand what I am talking about and am not writing nonsense on half knowledge.

?? That was not done so

Yes I am sure the deep knowledge of the Anglo monolingual of the internal discourses of the Muslims gives me great confidence in these easy assertions.

This is a complete fabrication. There are not “millions of jihadists” if there were … the violence would be indeed great.

But perhaps you are inventing your own meanings.