I merely take offense to the idea that ALL believers are out to get ALL atheists. And that things we do that reference god or Jesus or the Flying Spaghetti Monster, we do solely to stick it to atheists.
It gets tiring having to explain that when atheists react with that kind of broad brush, they’re doing exactly the same thing they accuse believers of.
I find it especially annoying because I haven’t attended a religious service in over ten years. I am the classic lapsed Catholic. Yet, I still believe in god (it’s pretty much the only spiritual belief I have) and that’s enough to make me some kind of deranged psycho in the eyes of some atheists (especially around here). You’d think I personally go around kicking puppies that belong to atheists or something.
I find it interesting that the religious person who claimed to disagree with atheists being bad just had to turn around and claim that they didn’t really exists; “I don’t believe that anybody is really an atheist. I believe that deep down everyone knows there is a god.” It’s a theory I’ve heard before; the believers often can’t even make themselves admit that other people disagree with them.
Are ALL believers “out to get” atheists ? No. Are MOST ? Yes.
Someone upthread said “But the point is, she felt comfortable assuming I was a Christian, and I felt uncomfortable correcting her. That’s just the atmosphere here.”
I live in the buckle of the bible belt, and that is exactly my experience. When I was planning my husband’s memorial last week, the funeral director asked whether I wanted the 23rd Psalm or the Lord’s Prayer on the memorial pamphlets. I had already told him we weren’t religious, but that was so ingrained he couldn’t just ask what I wanted. I wanted Stop All the Clocks, though, and that’s what I got. There was only one prayer, no hymns, and a little religious bit in the ceremony. I am sure that some people were shocked, but it was right for us.
I actually had a “true believer” tell me a few days before my husband died that his soul would burn in hell. She wanted her preacher to come and save him.
God on the money is hard to explain as anything other than trying to stick it to atheists, since those in favor of it refuse to acknowledge any other meaning for it. “Ceremonial deism” is a slap in the face. It’s saying “This means nothing to us, but even though it makes you feel marginalized and lesser, we’re keeping it.”
“In God We Trust” was first used on US money in 1864. Saying it is an affront to atheists today, in 2009, is missing the point just a little.
Atheists have a right to ask it be removed from money. I’d be more surprised if the were cool with it. But “sticking it to them” is just not on the minds of most believers and it amazes me that the rational, logical mind that is supposedly required for atheism believes in this conspiracy theory nonsense.
You mean, if anything existed for a long time it can’t be discriminatory now?
Sure. And then people like you, in trying to convince us that atheism is perfectly accepted, sneer about it.
Really? So why do you say things like this:
Which is it? You “can’t believe” it matters or you expect it to matter?
There’s nothing rational or logical required for atheism. There’s a lack of belief. Lots of people try to dress up their own theism or atheism is rational clothes, but it’s much simpler than that. I just don’t believe. I didn’t arrive at this position through logical or rational means. I just didn’t believe.
“Sticking it to them” may not have originally been in the minds of the believers, but original intent doesn’t matter to me. Once someone points out that your actions are hurtful, nice people stop when they can. “Ceremonial deism” means “we do it because we can.”
You are tired of broad brushes, comments that you probably only hear here. I’m tired of things that I can’t avoid by just turning off my computer, like hiding my atheism so that I can be accepted at a grief support group, because you know what? I need the grief support group.
People on the inside can’t experience what it’s like on the outside. If you’re not an atheist here, you don’t know what it’s like to be an atheist here. I’ve been both an uneasy believer and an atheist and they are very, very different experiences.
You are taking offense to something that is in your own head, because nobody said that.
But YOU said, in your first post:
So you yourself acknowledge that atheism is a much bigger issue the theists than “non-religion” is. And then you end up attacking… well I don’t know who, but all of them are atheists… over a claim none of them (here) have made.
Do you feel attacked? Set upon?
Your arguments remind me of those who proclaim there is a war on Christmas.
Please, people, rest assured, that not ALL of us “vague theists” are like Justin. I don’t care enough about “IGWT” on money (probably because I see so little of it nowadays…:(). But I can see why it annoys people. I’m more annoyed about “God” in the Pledge. Because we only put it there to piss off the Commies-not because of any deep beliefs.
However, I DON’T appreciate being told that I’m a deluded and a lunatic and out to get anyone. So can’t we ALL just get along? C’mon, now.