From a BBQ pit thread:
Is this true anymore? I knew it was once, but I had heard and believed that the PC manufacturers now get the parts so much cheaper in volume and price their machines at such razor-thin margins that it more than makes up for the cost of manufacturing, and it was actually a little more expensive to make a PC yourself with the same quality components these days. Has anyone done a comparison lately to confirm or deny this?
Somewhat.
You can build an absolute top of the line system, not counting monitor, for about $1200. I’m talking about installing the fastest processor out there, most powerful video card, maybe a gig of ram.
The reason computers from companies like Dell are so cheap is not only their profit margin, but because the components are not top of the line.
The exact figure is going to depend on exactly what components you require
I built my own in July of this year for around $2000. However, this included a full tower dragon case, 550 Watt power supply, way too many hard drives, a mobo with onboard EIDE RAID, etc.
Given where PC prices are right now, I would say only build your own if you are looking at high end components, or if you have out of the main stream spec requirements. Also, IMHO, this is only worth doing if you are basing around and AMD. Intel is just not worth doing on your own right now. If you must have Intel, buy a basic machine and add your custom components.
The other consideration, of course, is support. You can get excellent support from most of the major PC manufacturors for 100-200 bucks, and their machines are frankly good enough for most uses.
Oh - and while the major manufacturors do not use top end stuff, for the most part, that doesn’t mean they use junk either. At least the known name brand ones…
Don’t forget the software you get included with the computer if you buy a Dell or what ever. Depending on what you want to do this can be anywhere from nothing to hundreds of dollars more.
???
Where are YOU buying your hardware?
I priced out a top of the line system very much like you describe not too long ago. Ti4600 video card, 2.53 Ghz processor, a Gig of memory, etc. etc. It came to around $3K. The difference between building it myself and buying it from Dell was minor enough for me to just buy the thing from Dell.
Ten years ago it used to be that you could build a computer much more inexpensively than you could buy one. Nowadays that doesn’t seem to be true. That is, unless you tell me where you’re getting all that stuff for $1200!
Software is something people tend to forget. In fact, that was what made me decide to go through Dell instead. Now, I could’ve installed the family’s copies of Win98 SE, Office 95, and so on, and many people would say I would be completely justified. I thought, however, that I’d be stretching fair use too far. No, I don’t mean to turn this into a Great Debate, so suffice it to say I decided that I would buy my own copies. Plus, since I’d be far, far away from home, anything that went wrong I couldn’t easily fix without the source discs. Now assuming home version, single-user licenses for Win XP and Office XP (which is what you’ll get from Gateway or Dell), you’re looking at $300 for the OS ($200 if you upgrade) and $479 for Office ($279 if you upgrade). You can probably find better deals (I got these numbers from MS), but 800 dollars is enough to buy all sorts of additional hardware through Dell or Gateway.
Building your own computer can be astonishingly cheap, but a lot of that comes from the fact that people that build their own computers tend to already be immersed in computer culture, and arn’t starting from scratch.
For example, chances are that most people who build their own computers already have things like CD-R drives around. They have hard drives from old computers and ram that they can just pop in and it ups the specs of their machine a bit. You can save a signifigant amount of money by using the bits and pieces laying around.
Same goes with software. The reality is that a lot of software is pirate, and after hanging out with computer people and working with computer people, one developes ready- if illegal- access to all the software they need. I have never met anyone who bought an operating system that wasn’t bundleds with a package- but I know a lot of people who have operating systems who certainly didn’t buy a dell. Even if they don’t pirate, chances are they have old software that they can put on this new machine. Not figureing in software lowers the price a lot.
Finally, they do some research and take some risks. Computer shows are excellent ways to find cheap hardware. But then again, the stuff you buy at computer stores can a little sketchy and it’s hard to return it if something goes wrong. When you buy from a show, you run the risk that your new componant might not work, and there might not be anything you can do about. Keeping a close eye on the Fry’s ads (or whatever electronic superstore they have where you live) can also pay off. There can be some amazeing sales. But then again, if you don’t know whats good and whats bad you could end up with a product that is cheap for a good reason. There are alson some things that are pretty safe to buy used in an online auction, and some things that arn’t really good ideas to get used.
If your software is getting a little old a new PC can update it for cheap compaired to you buying it on your own.
If you plan to reuse your software they you could shave something off the price by building it yourself but then again any new machine will have windows XP (with limited, mainly Linux, exceptions) and some modern version of office or works (again w/ limited excpetions).
On the lowest end ther are perfectly good machines that you can buy preassembled but that you would never build from scratch becasue the price increase per component is very small to get to the next level. When you run the small price increases you will see that the home build comes out about the same or more expensive but is more powerful. i.e. 300 mhz jump might be about $20 - $30 - you would be a fool not to if you are building it yourself while that same speedbump would cost you about $100 in the prebuilt due to other addons…
I bought an OS that wasn’t bundled - MS ran a promotion where “Certified Partners” could buy XP Pro for only $40. As others have said I also had some hardware etc. that I could reuse. I ended up with a really nice computer capable of playing all the latest games etc. for less than $500.
I had another PC I tricked out with lower-end stuff, most of which I already had laying around. I had a license for Win95 I could have used but I chose to put Redhat 7.3 on it instead. It makes a good second workstation for surfing the web or editing office documents (www.openoffice.org). All I bought was the 1.2 mhz Duran and MB, which was a total of about $105. You could buy it all new for about $225-$250 which is still quite a bit less than the lower-end equivalents from Dell or eMachines but if you add on the cost of Windows XP Home ($200) then its no longer cheaper.
I think the deals Dell etc. get have way more to do with the Software than with the hardware.
I still build my systems, and do so for economic reasons. But I am also a extremely happy with the low end stuff. I am not a gamer or a video editor so sub-gigahertz is plenty.
Take the system I am building now to replace my home network server:
Case: $3 bit old tower from a thrift store. AT style but I fixed that.
PS: $7 ATX.
Motherboard: $5. Nice brand name Super-7, never used.
CPU: AMD K6-II 533 $15.
Memory: 2 64Meg SDRAMs free after rebates.
Hard Drive: an old 2.5Gig drive I have but I buy similar ones for <$4.
CD-drive: $2 32x
Floppy, keyboard and mouse: each about $2. (I really splurged to get the mouse I want.)
NIC: $2 10BaseT.
Will use existing on board sound and video. Also use existing monitor but if I need to I get 15" monitors for $5.
So all less than $50. And it’ll be better in most ways than my #1 system that I am using now except for HD size, etc.
As for software, I taught Comp Sci until recently and got OSs and major apps legit for free. I also go to trade shows and get a lot of free software that way. But most stuff I use is freeware anyway. (Browser, mail, news, a lot of Unix-ish stuff via Cygwin, etc.)
I gave up & got a Dell, the software & hardware would cost me more. The Ultrasharp dvi LCD 15" monitor came with it for only $70 more. I just couldn’t do better than that. Plus, I didn’t have to spend hours putting software on, it came with that stuff. (XP, Word, MS Works, a year of free Internet, etc)
ftg,
On ebay.com here is a old computer unsold for $14.99:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2072680902
Add parts to it:
“(If you want a HardDrive 1.2 GIG add $14.00 Or add $23.00 for a 2 GIG …OR INQUIRE ON WHAT OTHER DRIVES I HAVE AVAILABLE UP TO 10 GIG … ADD $9.00 FOR A 32X CDROM …NEED MORE MEMORY ADD $8.00 PER EACH 32 MEGS OR $15.00 FOR 128 MB TOTAL…(ALSO 15” MONITORS $20.00 PLUS SHIPPING)
Building your own computer is ALWAYS cheaper than an OEM box, for what you get. The reason is that with an OEM box, the prices for assembly, stuff you don’t want, and software you’ll never use as well as a service contract dwarf the minor savings due to buying hardware 1000 pieces at a time. You also get to tailor a computer to your needs, without having to compromise on some components. If you see an OEM computer that seems to be a good deal, they’re cheating you somewhere, you just have to find it. Hint: A “Pentium 4 Celeron 1.8Ghz” is not a Pentium 4, nor is it anywhere near as fast. Another hint: There’s no reason for you to be paying more than $150 for Windows XP Professional. That’s almost as little as Dell pays for it.
As another plus, the computer you end up with will be significantly more upgradeable, expandable, and have significantly fewer problems than one you buy from a store. All components should have at least one year warranties, ranging up to lifetime for others.
I am the manager of a PC store.
It depends where you get the hardware. The net, ebay, etc is a good place. You should also try any computer shows in the area, these usually have the best prices.
About a year ago I bought a killer system: an IWILL motherboard w/onboard IDE RAID, a T-Bird 1.4 ghz processor, and close to 1 GB of RAM. All for $300. I got them to throw in a Radeon 2 for another $100. All the parts were brand new.
My computer was built for me by a friend for a VERY low price (less than six hundred dollars, all in all).
What makes it cheaper than most, I would say, is that the casing is all beat up and it doesn’t look like much. Could that be where I saved? (I don’t mean it’s bad casing, just not very new or good looking. It looks like a piece of crap casing)
Absolutely it’s cheaper to build your own - and you don’t get any of the proprietary crap that Dell and the Big Box guys use to cut corners. I always build my own, and I believe anyone with a little patience and a modicum of dexterity should try it.
I built a box just last week for backups at my office. Here are the specs:
Total cost: $1580 + 2 hours of my time to build. Dell couldn’t touch that (even if they could understand the configuration I was going for.)
What ftg said. If you’re buying top-of-the-line, you’re an idiot anyway. In six months, you can buy top-of-the-line at half-price, almost. So why bother, unless you’re bankrolled by Daddy or the boss?
If you buy something when it first comes out, it’s expensive as shit. You wait six months, it’s reasonable. You wait twelve months, it’s a bargain. This is not a new concept; technology has always been this way. So ask yourself: Do I want a new top-of-the-line PC that will make the neighbors jealous for four months? If so, dude, you’re getting a Dell. If not, save some money and build it yourself.
“and you don’t get any of the proprietary crap that Dell and the Big Box guys use to cut corners.”
I opened my Dell, but didn’t see any of that proprietary crap you are talking about. Let’s see what did I get:
2.4ghz Pentium
512Meg ram
40 gig HD
15" DVI LCD Monitor, Ultra Sharp 5104FP
64Mb graphics card (Forgot which one)
6 USB ports
40x CDROM, keyboard, mouse, etc.
Free Shipping.
MS HOME, Word, MS Works, Graphics programs, free year of Internet access. Two years of in home service.
Cost $690 (A little more for the memory) Brought to me fully assembled. I put in a Sony DRU500a dvd writer for $253.00 from Dell 
I couldn’t do it cheaper myself.
Absolutely. I have just read the case of somebody building his own computer on US$600. The article is a bit long and somewhat disorganised, but it contains good information.
If you don’t know, Civ 3 is a computer game.
Now, as it has been pointed out before, you don’t build state-of-the-art computer. Like the P4 3.06GHz - you have to be absolutely crazy to buy it at $900.
What mobo does it use? What about the BIOS? The LCD is probably OEM, so you have no idea who made it.