I am a veteran who served from 1980 to 2000. From about 1994 to a few years after I retired from the USAF I would go to the local gun shop and hang out in the back. There were about five or six of us. We’d swap lies (tell war stories), drink beer, eat food, discuss politics, etc. There was one guy who had been a tunnel-rat in Vietnam who would tell stories about his experiences. A few years ago I found out that he’s been caught lying about the whole thing. He’d never been, never served. I suspect it wasn’t the unearned “honor” he was trying to get so much as a sense of camaraderie. I suspect we would’ve accepted him as part of the group if he’d been honest up front but “I’ve been lying to you every waking moment for the last 10 years” is a really compelling reason to tell someone to go find other friends.
Rather than edit the above, I’d like to add that the real Vietnam vets almost always told about stuff that happened when they were away from the fighting. I also suspect that even if they could have identified every case of Post-Traumatic Stress Disorder, they would have had no idea how to treat it except to ignore it and hope it went away (which is essentially what happened.
I really hope the PTSD identification and treatment today is more effective, for the sake of our current crop of combat vets.
If the OP’s cousin didn’t want to talk about it,why did he bring it up to begin with?
"(puffing out chest)“I WAS IN VIET NAM” (droll question) “idontwannatalkaboutit”
Sometimes people just want to appear tragic. It adds drama to their boring lives.
I don’t see how those differ much from the current war, which, while it isn’t as unpopular now as the Vietnam War was, there are still plenty more who are against this war than there were against, say, WWII. The Bush presidency was at least as unpopular as the Nixon one, if not more so (partly due to Bush’s handling of the war). We don’t have the draft now (I don’t think), so that’s a big difference, and the warfare is quite different as well (again, from an outsider’s perspective). But veterans of this war are pretty well-respected (even by those who oppose the war itself). I’ve always wondered why …
I would think, however, that no matter what war you’re in, it would be very difficult to talk about due to the gruesome realities of your job (I’ll leave it at that)
Afghanistan is closely tied to the WTC destruction, so the military that were sent there were on a hero’s mission. There was relentless promoting of our folks in uniform which carried over to the Iraq War. One could condemn that war for any number of reasons, but the military by that point were above reproach. Vietnam was the first conflict that was extensively covered by embedded journalists, so the horror was on your TV set every night and in photos taken of people who were napalmed and maimed/killed. We’ve become inured to much of that over the years through repeated exposure, and probably even think that the means justifies the end.
The military man in Vietnam may have been seen as the culprit by many, but I think the main reason Viet vets feel out in the cold is because the war was so hugely unpopular that nobody wanted to acknowledge the men when they came home. In WWI and WWII, the returning soldiers were met with brass bands and parades. With Vietnam, you got off the plane and went home and nobody really cared except your family. It was an embarrassment to Americans to admit that we got our asses handed to us, and the military men and women symbolized the failure. It’s tough to swallow when all you’ve done is what your country asked you to do.
I asked my brother. His answer is that he was a volunteer doing multiple combat tours in a very unpopular war by personal choice. Giving his time in country makes it clear he wasn’t someone drafted against their will who did “365 and a wake-up” and got the Hell out.
My dad served in Vietnam and he is proud of his service (he was about to be drafted so he signed up) and will tell you he served and for how long, but like other folks mentioned here, he won’t get in to the nitty-gritty. He has pictures that he shows off but they are of “back of the line” times and not like, heads on pikes or dead bodies.
I rarely ask him questions about his time but I always listen intently when he mentions anything. If he wants to talk I will listen all day. But I never ask.
Recently he met a guy at a party who served in the same time frame he did. The other guy was a psychologist (really! like Sidney Freedman from MASH!) and my dad seemed happy as a lark to talk to this guy. Dad was glued to him for about an hour. He mentioned something afterward about “secret handshakes.”
Anyway, he’ll talk to other guys who were in the same area and facing combat about combat, but anyone else…it’s mostly logistics.
And that makes him. . .what? Better? Dumber?
I think he’s just pointing out that being there because you volunteered would give you a different perspective than being there because you couldn’t find a way to avoid it.
Can you imagine being drafted and put in harm’s way like that? War is indescribably horrible and for some, any reminder that they were there is painful. Others talk freely about things like downtime behind the lines, but what happens in the “front lines” is either excruciatingly boring or terrifylingly life-threatening. I can’t see any veteran wanting to talk about the boring stuff, and the other stuff is horrifying beyond most people’s experience, except another veteran.
I think it’s pretty much universal; I suspect you might have had trouble getting retired Roman veterans to talk about it.
At any rate, in college I knew a Desert Storm vet who was all of 4 years older than me (and he was 24 at the time!) who wouldn’t talk about the fighting. Everything else about the army, Saudi Arabia and Kuwait, but very little about the fighting itself.
You know I wasn’t seeing the objection at first but now I do. How long you stayed tells whether you reupped. If you reupped, to some you were “obviously” in support of the war, in both its goals and its methods. That made you “obviously” some kind of monster that torches babies with napalm for kicks.
My first thought was not answering any questions avoids the inevitable “How many people did you kill?” Just a gut reaction, tho.
While I was on active duty during the last couple of years of the Vietnam war, I don’t know that I ever encountered any war vets - certainly no one who talked about it. I recognized ribbons on uniforms, but I was never privy to war stories. Of course, at the time being a woman in uniform didn’t allow me into the guys’ club anyway.
Yes, I can. I joined the Navy to avoid being drafted, but ended up over there anyway, so in essence I “volunteered”. My perspective was still the same as if I had been drafted, and that was: a) holy fuck I hope I get out of this alive, and b) they will never get me to come back here without searching the entire country of Canada first. As I mentioned, I wasn’t in the shit since I was a Seabee and stationed on a Marine supply base doing maintenance. While we took incoming on many occasions, I didn’t have to kill anybody and managed to return unscathed.
Really? I’m in that age group, along with friends, co-workers, etc. and I don’t know of anyone who claims anything of the sort. If anyone asks, I may explain the intricacies of I-Y vs 4-F and how asthma saved my life. That’s it.
Anyway, I don’t understand why anyone would claim untruthfully to be a VietNam vet, unless they were using it as an excuse for bad behavior. I can’t imagine there are that many of those. Maybe I’m just sheltered and naive.
Or what **Chefguy **and **SSgtBaloo **said.
Roddy
I was there for two years as an Army medic. I don’t think “how long were you there?” would be offensive to anyone. I generally don’t talk about combat or tell war stories (except some funny ones) unless I am with someone who was there. I agree with some of the above posters that it is possible that your relative might be a fake vet.
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The guys who falsely claim to be vets usually want bragging rights.
My little brother was born in the 60s, and when he was about 10, he had to get a lot of surgery done on one kidney. While they were able to save the kidney, he was supposed to avoid any chance of getting hit in that area, because it might cause the kidney to rupture or something. My mother confided in me that she was sort of glad that he had a physical exemption from the draft, although of course she hated that he’d had this problem.
He brought it up so I don’t think it’s rude to ask. When people at work mention to me that they’re a veteran I almost always ask where they served and what they did. I have yet to receive a negative comment about the question.
My Father and Grandfather and Great were all Marines. I served in the USAF, thankfully didn’t do combat. I ride with Marines. They all know to to day how long they served in war zones and will tell that if asked. They won’t talk about the fighting, but will share stores about other things they did. Why would they want to dwell on the bad stuff when they have funny stories about using the fruit in their c-rats to make a still and then having it blow up?
I do know that when some of the same war guys meet up, they talk more openly to each other.
To the OP, if I ws told it was offensive to ask “how long”, I’d start doubting his stories. For some twisted reason, people lie about being in combat.
There are currently some excellent, highly effective treatments for PTSD - most notably, prolonged exposure therapy. It is being used extensively to help treat veterans with great results. The problem is, it’s a very difficult and time-consuming process to commit to, and many therapists dismiss it because it causes so much short-term distress that they fail to understand the real improvement that happens over the long term. I had severe PTSD for nearly a decade, 8 years of talk therapy, and three short months of prolonged exposure worked miracles for me (I am not a combat veteran, just a person with formerly severe PTSD.)