For those that think it’s bad manners to expect a guest to feel awkward by joining a prayer, would it work the other way?
I think we can mostly agree that Aunt Rita is a bit unhinged with the whole shotgun thing, but would you give time for a religious guest to pray or say grace before your meal if it would make the guest feel awkward by NOT praying or saying grace?
LOL! I would be the Christian looking around, though. I hate closing my eyes. Like holding hands, I never really understood the point of eyes closed.
Praying to Mother Earth/alternate deity/mankind who managed to bring forth food on the table without help from imaginary gods. Could you deny your deity just to respect your host?
Cuz you’re a sinner and a’goin’ to hell forever’n’ever! She was crying because she loves you.
Ok, I got nothin.
I’m going to overgeneralize and say that worshippers tend not to be critical thinkers capable of seeing and accepting their own hipocrysy. They’re right, they know they’re right, and they’re not used to their ideas being challenged. Wiccans, in contrast, have the benefit of knowing they’re in the minority and that their being accepted depends on their fostering an atmosphere of tolerance and acceptance.
If I can’t be respectful of the home rules of my host, I don’t go. And if I know they can’t be respectful of mine, they don’t get invited. An invitation to my table is no less an honor than an invite to someone else’s. If someone disagrees with that then it’s best we come to that understanding sooner than later.
I would have no problem holding hands and keeping silent during such a prayer/activity (have yet to get invited to a good Druidic type event, and I would come in a flash!).
I wouldn’t have a problem at all with giving someone a moment to say a prayer if they felt they needed to. However, my mom prays before she eats when she visits my home–not a problem–but she expects me to sit quietly and not start eating while she does so (out loud)–that’s rude IMO. It’s my home, I cooked the meal, I’m going to start eating when I’m ready, not when you’re done praying.
But you can recognize that a lot of people WOULD have a problem with that. Especially people like, for example, devout Southern Baptists (thinking of some people in particular that I know here, not making a comment on that religion.)
Inigo isn’t quite far off the mark. It’s not that she doesn’t respect your beliefs, she’s just upset about them, most likely because she cares about you and loves you and all that.
As far as Opal’s question goes - yes, it’s rude but I think it’s possible it hasn’t even occurred to them that it is. (I’m assuming they know you don’t share their religious convictions.) I’d tell any of my “heathern” friends that they’re welcome to join in but they shouldn’t feel obligated to in any way.
I dunno. In your example, is the host actually saying that “without help from imaginary gods” bit out loud? I can’t imagine anyone doing that in the privacy of their own home without a deist at the table to hear it.
That would strike me as trollish.
I think any deist or atheist is obliged to respectfully sit through the prayers/rituals of any other deist (or pantheist) who is their host. And I can’t really imagine an atheist legitimately having a ritual.
Sometimes, when I go to a restaurant with a group, anyone who feels a need to give thanks to his deity will bow his head and do it silently. Pretty sure I’ve witnessed it at a gathering in someone’s home as well. It would be churlish of a host to interfere with that.
Well, I guess, thats my point. With religious hosts, it’s rude to make a guest uncomfortable. With religious guests, it’s my house, my food, my rules.
What with the nekkid ladies and all?
Um, I do. A moment’s conscious reflection of the life that was taken is how I get past knowing what Mr. Chicken/Pig/Cow/Fishy went through in order to get to my plate. Just cuz I eat 'em doesn’t mean I have to take the critters for granted. The day I can’t eat after the reflection is the day I stop eating meat. I don’t need a god to direct my moral compass and remind me to be grateful for my grub.
Did I say anything about making a big production? “Leave the room” isn’t that.
Maybe “big production” means the same thing as “doing anything that breaks the illusion that you share the same beliefs as the host”?
Fair enough. Am I to understand that you and your family actually do this every evening at your dinner table? Out loud?
If so, I think you’re totally within the bounds of etiquette to expect that your deist guests not interfere with it.
Is it rude to expect your guests to pray with you?
I don’t know if it’s rude, but it’s kind of presumptuous. If someone asks you to pray with them (in any setting) they should not be offended if you decline. As to the OP’s situation, as a guest I would just follow along but would probably just say a silent prayer for my football team.
Nah, this is just my thing and is so inward as to not attract attention. Seems like Jesus once told people not to pray in public, he probably thought it was annoying as hell too.
Leaving the room during a quick blessing is a “big production” to me. It’s just not something to get all worked up over.
Being asked to participate in a Christian grace is annoys the crap out of me, but I go with the flow without bowing my head, closing my eyes, or uttering any words. If I am hosting and someone wants to say grace first, then go right ahead if that’s what you like, but I will still quietly be annoyed.
On the other hand, I had a Jewish friend once who invited a bunch of people over to participate in a traditional Passover. Eager to learn and have fun, I went, I engaged in all the rituals, I read some scriptures aloud as the book was being passed around the room, and I had a good time. I even ate gifelte fish… blech! I thought it was nice to be invited to share in someone’s rituals and to learn a bit about a religious event I had not experienced before. I didn’t believe any of it, and our host knew that. Everyone had a good time.
So, why do I enjoy being invited as a non-believing participant in someone else’s Passover ritual, but being invited as a non-believing participant in someone else’s Christian grace pisses me off?
Apparently it is, otherwise people wouldn’t get upset if you do it.
I was about to comment on the “pray to your Father in secret” instruction, but **Inigo ** beat me to it.
We had a neighbor who was very, very religious, and said she couldn’t possibly sent her daughter to public school because she would allegedly be forbidden to pray. Not so, I advised. She can bow her head and pray silently any time she wants to. What she can’t do is require that anyone else must pray with her, or do so in a way that interferes with the express purpose of school.