Loopus, the quote that you give above simply means that they would like more donations so that they can purchase more bibles for distribution.
They definitely intend for the bibles to be taken. Here is another quote from the same site: “Every dollar contributed by members of the churches is used to make it possible for others to have their very own copy of God’s Word.” I would think that “very own copy” can only be interpreted in one way here – that they mean for people to have them.
That being said, I don’t think that they would mind jjimm taking one, unless he was going to use it for tinder or toilet paper – that might be stretching the intended use a bit!
is it stealing to take towels, lamps, and TVs from the room? the book belongs to the room, not each individual guest. jeeze, they might have to replace the book everyday if everyone took one. if they wanted each person who stayed in the hotel/motel to have one, they would have a stack in the lobby for everyone.
I’m sorry for the hijack, but I feel I must address ianzin’s post. Take a pew.
As I said, I am not a Christian; and surely there are those who profess that they are Christians who try to cram their religion down people’s throats. I do not call myself a Wiccan, as there are aspects of that religion that I am uncomfortable with or have not figured out; but I do believe in their “Commandment”, if you will, “An it harm no one, do what ye will.” Or in other words, “Do what you like, as long as it doesn’t harm anyone.”
You may be offended by what you think is “toxic, harmful crap”, but I’m sure it is not the intention of the Gideons to insult you. I agree with Voltair who said, “I do not agree with what you have to say, but I’ll defend to the death your right to say it.” That is, I do not agree with many aspects of the Christian religion; but if that’s what people want to believe, then I don’t really have the right to shut them up. I can disagree, but if I try to force them to belive the way I believe, then I’m as bad as those who try to force people to believe what they believe.
Does a book lying quietly in a drawer harm you? I don’t think so. You can choose to believe what is written in it, or not. Does throwing the book in the trash harm anyone? If the book is taken to a dump, then you have effectively robbed the Gideons of a few dollars. Not a big tragedy, but still an offense.
I don’t know what you believe. You may be convinced that there is no Supreme Being or Beings. You may think that when we die, we just rot and that is that. You may very well be right. But displaying hatred of a religion takes energy. I believe that hatred is counterproductive. It is an expenditure of energy that could be put to more constructive uses. Why not live and let live? The Bible certainly gives comfort to some people. Would you rob them of that comfort simply because you don’t agree with it?
You will do what you will. But I hope you will consider that hatred and committing what are, really, malicious acts to be a waste of time. Leaving the book alone will not harm you, and neither will its simply existing.
I’m wondering if anyone in this thread ever read A Tree Grows in Brooklyn?
In the story, the protagonist, Francie’s Aunt Sissy steals a Bible from a hotel room where she was staying with a “gentlemen friend” to give to Baby Francie.
Yeah, fine, and it’s ‘Voltaire’. But I’m not talking about what anyone has the right to say or think. I’m talking about hiring a hotel room in which some people who are, in my opinion, religious zealots have left some of their propaganda lying around. That’s their choice. In my opinion, a gideon bible is garbage and I treat it as such. I get rid of it.
I don’t think ‘harm’ or ‘not harm’ is the point. In my opinion, it’s garbage that someone has left lying around my hotel rom. So I treat it accordingly. Once I’ve used toilet paper, I flush it away because I think that’s where it belongs, down the chute, and anyone with an interest in hygiene would agree with me. Well, I feel the same way about the religious propaganda left lying around by the gideons. I believe it belongs with the other garbage, and I throw it out of my room accordingly, because I have some respect for my mental health and hygiene. The only major difference between the two pieces of paper is that the toilet tissue has, at least, served a useful purpose.
I’m not displaying hatred of anything, any more than you would think you are displaying ‘hatred’ of waste paper and garbage each time you throw it out or flush it down the chute. I’m just throwing out waste paper, because in my opinion that’s precisely what the bible and any other religious propaganda is.
Well, in the first place, I dare say victims of christian persecution, such as Galileo, and those put to death by christians during the crusades and the spanish inquisition, would like the christian church to exercise a little ‘live and let live’ policy. And christian schools don’t follow a ‘live and let live’ policy either. Their policy is to abuse the minds of young chuildren by filling them full of what is, in my opinion, nonsensical crap. The pursuit of other equally valid beliefs, such as Islam or Swedenborg’s teaching or worship of Thor and Odin, is not tolerated at all.
Secondly, I do ‘live and let live’ in terms of respecting anyone’s right to believe whatever they want. But in my opinion their religious tracts and related propaganda are just garbage, so I treat it accordingly, the same as I do with any junk mail that falls out of a magazine or newspaper. It’s propaganda garbage, so I dispose of it, along with used soap wrappers or empty shampoo bottles.
So does heroin. If I hired a hotrel room and found some heroin needles and related paraphernalia lying around, I’d throw it all out. And heroin has done far less harm than the bible, in my opinion. Some people take comfort from White Supremacist Hate Literature. If I found that in my room, I’d throw that out too.
Two weeks ago, I was in a hotel in New York. Suppose someone left some literature lying around which promoted the religious views of those who perpetrated the attack on the WTC. Do you think that literature would last very long in a New York hotel room? I somehow doubt it. Would you argue that such literature should be left lying around? I doubt that too. Well, I feel the same way about the bible. In my opinion, it’s just trash that should be treated as such. If the gideons don’t like that, well, tough, see my previous post. If they don’t leave their garbage lying around, I won’t throw it out with the trash.
Confession… when I was about 10, we got Gideon’s Bibles given to us at school. My friend Joe and I used ours to make jumps for scalextric cars, and we used a couple of pages to roll cigarettes.
Ianzin, I find your behaviour to be fairly zealous, too, and rather uncalled-for. I am an atheist too, but have no objection to any literature lying around a hotel room. As implied in the OP, religious material can be perused with no danger of surreptitious conversion. If you don’t like it, either be constructive about it, or just don’t read the damn thing. Throwing it out is just mean to the people who might get some comfort from that particular work of fiction.
The Gideons came to my Catholic school usually about once a year to give Bibles to the fifth grade students. I guess they didn’t know, and the nuns didn’t remember, that the school required you to buy a Catholic New American Bible in third grade that you were supposed to use in class and at home.
To get back to the OP, if you want a Bible but worry about the stealing issue - then rip out the Ten Commandments page, leave it there and take the rest of the book. There’s always an angle.
It may be rubbish but its not YOUR rubbish which makes all the difference. The hotel WISHES to have the bible in their room because THEY regard it as not rubbish. You have no right to dictate which parts of other peoples properties are rubbish.
A lovely rant, but I have a request. Could you please not try to justify your actions by resorting to really bad legal arguments? Stick with the “I’m right and they’re wrong” message.
To address the OP: If the Gideons don’t want you to take it, you shouldn’t take it. It’s obviously not the worst offense they could imagine, but the fact that it’s a Bible doesn’t change the “don’t take things that aren’t yours” message.
I stayed in a Marriott this weekend and thought I’d flip through the Book of Mormon (obviously ianzin hadn’t stayed there before me). Interesting, but a fairly difficult book to read due to the writing style.
Tidbit everyone should know so they can feel superior: Mark Twain’s comment on ‘chloroform in print’ is a pun referring to the section of the Book of Mormon called the Book of Ether. I’m sure he also thought it was dull, but the point was the pun.
In college, I was given a tiny Gideon’s Bible with the Psalms and NT. I kept it in my backpack, and it was very handy for all those medieval lit classes. (Being the only one in said classes who had any kind of knowledge of religion, I often found myself explaining basic concepts like the stories of Adam & Eve, Moses, famous parables, etc. It was disgraceful, I tell you. You don’t have to believe it, but if you’re going to pretend comptetence in English literature classes, you should know the basics!)
My dad is an officer in the Oklahoma Gideon chapter so I’ve heard the spiels a lot. One of the stories that they love to tell is about a woman who got saved after she took a Gideon bible but then was afraid that she had committed a sin. The point of the story is that there is no way to steal a Gideon bible.
Although, it does seem that if I had one at home and you took it from me, that would be stealing.
As a couple people have posted already, the Gideon Bibles that I have seen in motels explicitly state that you may take it with you.
Also, the Gideons provide extras to the motel cleaning staff. I have seen them on cleaning carts stacked next to the little soaps. If they note the Bible missing, they will replace it. The Gideons regularly check back in to make sure the supply of extras is maintained. You are only depriving the next person of the Bible if the staff failed to notice it is missing when cleaning after you.
OTOH, if you are visiting a friend’s house, notice they have a motel Gideon Bible, and take it from them without permission, that is stealing from your friend. Something that has been given away is no longer free once in the hands of the new owner.
I don’t want to hijack the thread, but I will point out that many more people were killed in the last century by atheist systems than by any organized church.
Maybe I should steal any atheist books you have laying around the house. I’ll chuck them into the trash for the common good.
LOL, I’ll have to remember that. Maybe I’ll add my own biblical commentary next time I stay at a hotel. I’ll pay particular attention to the passages about Joshua massacering every man, woman and child in certain cities, except for the virgins which were kept as prizes.
There’s a line in the Sodom and Gomorrah part where whatsisname offers to give the townsfolk his virgin daughters if they’ll leave him and the angels alone.
“Gee, THANKS pop.”
You might want to take care in underlining completely meaningless passages, too (Stuff like, “Verily, Joseph stopped to scrape his sandal upon a rock, for yea, he had stepped in horse droppings.”). Just so people will try and figure out what hidden signifigance they have.
Or just hide the Bible in the LOWER drawer of the dresser, and leave a copy of the Little Red Book or the Satanic Bible or something in the top drawer. >:)
