Is it too early to declare the PS3 a failure?

Cafe Society
41

The strengths of a console are portability, price, group play, and ease of use. The Wii is playing to all of those strengths, the PS3 is not. When you pass the $300 barrier you’re looking at a serious piece of hardware. If you’re going to spend ~$750 (including one game and HDMI cables) then why not get a PC? Computers have word processing, real internet capibilities, REAL FPS games, MMORPGs, and you can actually be productive on them. Computers also have a bigger game library than all of the old consoles combined.

For someone who loathes how the game industry has been co-opted by the jock culture, it’s great news to see consoles return to their roots - quick, simple, fun games. I’ll probably be strung up for saying this, but I think games like Halo and Resistance aren’t meant for consoles. I have my PC for my WW2 Shooter of the Month needs. Why play Oblivion on X-Box when you can have it on PC?

Also, the 80’s gamers are growing up now and spawning new gamers. Nintendo is wise to tap into the kid friendly market.

42

[QUOTE=malkavia]
I love to hear people talk about the “artificial shortage” of Wii’s, when it’s pretty clear that Wii’s have outsold the PS3 by almost 4 to 1 [cite].
[/quote]

The Wii’s shortages aren’t artificial but it should be noted that most new consoles can’t produce near enough systems at release to satisfy the market, every major console launch in recent memory has sold out the systems. That’s why it’s so telling that there are a lot of PS3s on the shelves.

The PS3 isn’t overpriced when you consider it’s a full fledged gaming system (a system which is definitely technically superior to its competitors) and also has a blu-ray player. It’s actually underpriced, Sony loses money on every unit sold (this tends to be standard in the video game industry at least since the last two generations the game companies have made most of their money off of software/licensing not hardware.)

The problem is, I just don’t think the video game market was ready for a $600 system. Like VCO3 said, the NeoGeo was the best, and it was definitely priced appropriately, the thing was, no one was willing to pay such a premium for that type of hardware.

43

[QUOTE=Carnick]
The strengths of a console are portability, price, group play, and ease of use. The Wii is playing to all of those strengths, the PS3 is not. When you pass the $300 barrier you’re looking at a serious piece of hardware. If you’re going to spend ~$750 (including one game and HDMI cables) then why not get a PC? Computers have word processing, real internet capibilities, REAL FPS games, MMORPGs, and you can actually be productive on them. Computers also have a bigger game library than all of the old consoles combined.

For someone who loathes how the game industry has been co-opted by the jock culture, it’s great news to see consoles return to their roots - quick, simple, fun games. I’ll probably be strung up for saying this, but I think games like Halo and Resistance aren’t meant for consoles. I have my PC for my WW2 Shooter of the Month needs. Why play Oblivion on X-Box when you can have it on PC?

Also, the 80’s gamers are growing up now and spawning new gamers. Nintendo is wise to tap into the kid friendly market.
[/QUOTE]

I do play most of my FPS games on a PC, but if you’ve bought any of the recent PC shooters you’ll find out you won’t be playing them on a $750 system. A true gaming rig is way out of the price range of your average console player (not meaning they necessarily can’t afford it, but it is outside the price range they consider acceptable fro a computer.) Most people aren’t willing to by a $2,000+ computer system.

I just recently built a new gaming rig and the video card alone cost more than the PS3 premium system (and yeah, games like BF2142 on my system blow any PS3 graphics I’ve seen out of the water, dispelling the myth that Sony spread pre-launch that their system would top any PC gaming system.)

44

[QUOTE=Hampshire]
The PS3 vs. Wii
[/QUOTE]
I adore that commercial. I also love the Mac-PC commercials. They’re silly. Perhaps a bit moronic even, and work on a purely emotional level, but they work.

I’m biased though; Apple & Nintendo already own my soul.

Don’t underestimate the value of “must have” games. That’s why Nintendo owns my soul. They’ve got my “must have” games.

I enjoy my PS2. I really do. But it doesn’t have anything “must have.” GTA? Played it. A lot. Bored now. Kingdom Hearts? Love it. Kingdom Hearts II? Played it. Don’t love it so much anymore.

Colossus? Ico? I appreciate them for what they are, but don’t love them. (to be honest, haven’t played Ico yet - I’m basing my opinion on Colossus, which was sorta pretty & different but left me a bit underwhelmed)

Nintendo means Mario, Zelda, Starfox, Metroid and probably a Resident Evil I simply must play. All of them.

There’s nothing on PS3 I must play. Someday I’ll get a PS3 because it broadens the number of games available to me. Well, I assume it will. But it’s not “must have” and I won’t ever pay $600 for one unless I come into some serious extra play money somehow.

I’ll spend my money on Nintendo games and wait for the PS4 which hopefully will be cheaper and be backwards compatible with all the PS3 games I missed and are then cheaper.

[QUOTE=control-z]
Trinitron TVs
PS1
PS2
[/QUOTE]
Pretty much. I bought my TV and stereo equipment from them back in the early '90’s and was happy. Haven’t bought anything since. The PS2 is actually my roommate’s. The Gamecube is mine. Come divorce time, I know how the custody battle is going to go.

45

[QUOTE=Martin Hyde]
The PS3 isn’t overpriced when you consider it’s a full fledged gaming system (a system which is definitely technically superior to its competitors) and also has a blu-ray player. It’s actually underpriced, Sony loses money on every unit sold (this tends to be standard in the video game industry at least since the last two generations the game companies have made most of their money off of software/licensing not hardware.)
[/QUOTE]

It is overpriced. Mass consumers (the ones that really drive the market) are not willing to spend $600 on a game console. They don’t care what hardware is in it or if it plays movies; they’re buying a game machine and are going to compare the prices based solely on that. It may be underpriced to Sony but who cares about their perspective? They’re not the ones being asked to buy it.

46

The PS3 is overpriced as a console, but vastly underpriced as a computer: a really great deal for the amount of power you’re getting. Sony should have tried to market it as a dual home-computer/console system.

That said, searched long and hard for a Wii, and failed. It was like tracking the spoor of a recently departed animal. I literally once came within minutes of one, but it was bought just before I walked into the Toys R Us.

47

I dunno, what is it about the Wii that’s so hot? I don’t think I would ever get used to its style of controls. Plus, that style really doesn’t lend itself well to some genres, especially the one I really like (RPGs).

I don’t have a dog in this fight, since I’m waiting to see where more good RPGs (and, to a lesser extent, the big two Square-Enix titles) end up before buying the latest generation (and waiting for bugs to be worked out), but having enjoyed the PS for so long, and seeing the console’s “commitment” to RPGs, it’d be a shame if it expired. (Or rather, it probably won’t expire, just flounder.) But right now, we’re only comparing inital hype/reactions/libraries. I think it’s fair to wait a bit.

48

[QUOTE=Carnick]
For someone who loathes how the game industry has been co-opted by the jock culture, it’s great news to see consoles return to their roots - quick, simple, fun games.
[/QUOTE]

And this is why I’m waiting, with bated breath, to throw my hands in the air and scream “YESSSSSS” if the PS3 gets stuck in third place. Ooooh, the sweetness.
Viva la Dreamcast!

49

[QUOTE=Martin Hyde]
I do play most of my FPS games on a PC, but if you’ve bought any of the recent PC shooters you’ll find out you won’t be playing them on a $750 system. A true gaming rig is way out of the price range of your average console player (not meaning they necessarily can’t afford it, but it is outside the price range they consider acceptable fro a computer.) Most people aren’t willing to by a $2,000+ computer system.

I just recently built a new gaming rig and the video card alone cost more than the PS3 premium system (and yeah, games like BF2142 on my system blow any PS3 graphics I’ve seen out of the water, dispelling the myth that Sony spread pre-launch that their system would top any PC gaming system.)
[/QUOTE]

Most people aren’t willing to spend $600 on a console either. My point is, if you’re the kind of person that has the luxury cash to buy a six hundred dollar game machine you can probably afford a good gaming PC. I have a great PC with SLI video cards and all that jazz, so I might be biased. Still, BF2142 manages to run on my friend’s three year old system. It’s not pretty, but it works.

50

[QUOTE=Tabby_Cat]
Viva la Dreamcast!
[/QUOTE]

I miss my Sea Man. He’s been floating at the top of that tank now for years, poor abandoned fish-guy.

51

I still have my Dreamcast and play Shenmue every now and then (I still think that’s one of the most underrated games of all time and definitely one of the most revolutionary, and unique, games ever.) Power Stone isn’t bad either. The Dreamcast is a sad story.

52

[QUOTE=Leaper]
I dunno, what is it about the Wii that’s so hot? I don’t think I would ever get used to its style of controls. Plus, that style really doesn’t lend itself well to some genres, especially the one I really like (RPGs).

[/QUOTE]

Point and click doesn’t lend itself to RPG’s? There’s about twenty-five years of computer games that go against that. Most console RPG’s only need a direction pad and three or four buttons which the Wiimote can do even without the nunchuck attached.

53

[QUOTE=H3Knuckles]
I’m kind of surprised by your opinion, Red. Most gamers would say the opposite; that Gamecube was a much better deal than N64. As a diehard Nintendo fan from wayback even I think so.
[/QUOTE]

To continue this little hijack… it surprises me to hear this. Everyone I know remembers the N64 with fond memories, and remembers the Gamecube as the weakest system in its generation by far. This could be a fairly long discussion, so I won’t get into it… but I really don’t know many people in RL other than my resident Nintendo fanboys who would defend the Cube against, well, anything but the PS3 :wink:

[QUOTE=Just Some Guy]
Point and click doesn’t lend itself to RPG’s? There’s about twenty-five years of computer games that go against that. Most console RPG’s only need a direction pad and three or four buttons which the Wiimote can do even without the nunchuck attached.
[/QUOTE]

To be fair, I don’t think there have been that many good ‘console’ style RPGs for the computer… but that shouldn’t hurt the Wii at all, because the answer is (or SHOULD be, at least)… the Classic Controller. The best console RPG systems, IMO, were the SNES and the PS1… and the Wii Classic Controller can do everything those two controllers can do (and the system itself can do anything a SNES can do, at least! :p).

54

[QUOTE=Leaper]
I don’t think I would ever get used to its style of controls. Plus, that style really doesn’t lend itself well to some genres, especially the one I really like (RPGs).

[/QUOTE]

Something that a lot of non-Wii owners don’t seem to get - and the blame lies with Nintendo, what with their commercials featuring people jumping around and full-arm swinging the wii remote like monkeys - is that the controllers respond to extremely subtle gestures just as accurately as wide-swinging monkey man gestures. I’ve been playing Zelda, sitting on my ass, making no greater movements than I make with a normal wired controller.

55

[QUOTE=H3Knuckles]
Besides, every Playstation has had a lackluster launch, as far as I can recall.
[/QUOTE]

You might want to define “lackluster” because I recall the PS2 selling for thousands on ebay at the launch. There were problems with production, but there weren’t PS2’s sitting on the shelf.

Also, someone made a mention about how the Dreamcast had a great launch and then crumbled before the PS2’s onslaught, and that’s why we shouldn’t make gloomy predictions for the PS3: bad comparison. Both the Dreamcast and PS2 had stellar launches, but the PS3’s launch has been poor in terms of sales vs available units.

56

[QUOTE=Paul in Saudi]
Sony?
They got in the cell phone market. They got beat. They pulled out.
They got in the flat-screen market, couldn’t compete, now LG make all Sony flat-screens
They got in the MP3 player market. Couldn’t make it work.
Now they are getting beat in the game marketplace. What was their last big hit? The Walkman?
[/QUOTE]

But you can’t beat their slogan: “Sony. Because Caucasians are just too damned tall.”

:wink:

57

[QUOTE=Kiros]
To continue this little hijack… it surprises me to hear this. Everyone I know remembers the N64 with fond memories, and remembers the Gamecube as the weakest system in its generation by far. This could be a fairly long discussion, so I won’t get into it… but I really don’t know many people in RL other than my resident Nintendo fanboys who would defend the Cube against, well, anything but the PS3 :wink:
[/quote]

You’re in a definite minority, then. The 'Cube had its strengths, but the N64 had about 3 good games and an abundance of crap, in adition to a total and complete lack of content in most games. The 'Cube isn’t and wasn’t perfect, but it has a good selection of stuff and solid, if not amazing, hardware.

58

[QUOTE=smiling bandit]
You’re in a definite minority, then. The 'Cube had its strengths, but the N64 had about 3 good games and an abundance of crap, in adition to a total and complete lack of content in most games. The 'Cube isn’t and wasn’t perfect, but it has a good selection of stuff and solid, if not amazing, hardware.
[/QUOTE]

Okay, we do this hijack after all :slight_smile:

I tend to feel that the N64 had… probably the best Mario game ever, the best Mario Kart game ever, the best Starfox game ever, one Zelda game that was absolutely top-rate and a second that was playable, and two truly amazing play-with-other-people games in Smash and Goldeneye. Some other pretty high quality stuff, Paper Mario, Ogre Battle, the first Wave Race when it came out. The selection after that was weaker than normal for a system, but still had a few decent games. Mostly, the N64 gave you a lot of things that you couldn’t get from the PS1 or Sega Saturn (even if it was virtually devoid of good RPGs) - and they were REALLY GOOD things. Mario/Starfox/Ocarina hold up even today against any set of three games from any system.

The Cube had (relatively) weak installments in many of the signature series (Mario Sunshine (weak), Wind Waker (good but not on the level of Ocarina), Starfox (very weak), and Double Dash (hated, though I realize some people loved it); it made up for that a little with Metroid Prime (best game on the system IMO). Smash held up well to its predecessor. Another Paper Mario that was similarly good to the N64 version. Put Fire Emblem opposite OB64, and put Resident Evil 4 opposite Goldeneye (though RE4 didn’t have nearly the multiplayer greatness of Goldeneye, the single player was better IMO). After that stuff… the GC had a much stronger set of support games than the 64 did on the face of it… but it was mostly above-average to very-good platformers and sports games - while the PS2 versions of all the sports games were better, and it had a better platformer selection overall. So it’s a nice thing if you already have a Cube, but most people wouldn’t buy one for that stuff.

I should note that I haven’t played the GC version of Twilight Princess. Though I hear it’s every bit as good as the Wii version, it will be associated (perhaps unfairly, since it was developed for GC) as a Wii game because it was by far the best title out for the first several months of Wii-ness. It’s a point for the GC that it can be played there, but… not as big a one as it might have been since more people will end up playing it on the Wii.

I guess I’m willing to say the the GC had a deeper library, but I buy the Nintendo consoles for the core titles, and the N64 did a much better job with all of the traditional Nintendo series except for Metroid. Of course, they can share the title of the two most absolutely terrible RPG systems of all time - we’re not exclusive on stuff like that :stuck_out_tongue:

59

My history with Sony purchases:

  1. 27" Trinitron. Fantastic purchase, still going strong to compliment my new Sanyo Z5 FP.
  2. Sony receiver (don’t recall model). Constantly goes into “Protect mode”, regardless of how loud it’s being played.
  3. 5 CD changer. Worked OK for a while, then kept on spinning, taking about 30 minutes of shutting it on and off before it would stop on a CD (once it stopped on one successfully, it would be OK until you opened it up again to replace a CD, then repeat).
  4. PS1: Great purchase.
  5. PS2: Disc read error.
  6. PS2: Another disc read error. Had to purchase it on account of the library built from the first one.
  7. Was late learning my lesson with the 2nd PS2, so I didn’t buy this, but received a VAIO laptop as a gift. Backlight went out within 2 months. Then this turned out being one of the models recalled for having the tendency of exploding.

So, basically, the PS3 has no place in my home, and this coming from someone with a need for a high def media need. I’m willing to pass up on great films in HD if it means keeping the Sony brand out of my house. Hell, I’m willing to pass up on future Final Fantasy games to keep it out.

As for the Wii, I don’t really get the hype. Zelda was great (I only made it through the first temple), but there was nothing to it that couldn’t be done with a plain ole console controller. Monkey Ball was fantastic with the Wii controller (never played it on other consoles, but with a normal controller it would be too easy), but that was it.

The original Xbox didn’t exactly get me excited, but it looks like the 360 is going to be my console of choice (it’s going to be as expensive as the PS3 with the HD-DVD add-on, so I’m in no rush to buy it).

60

[QUOTE=smiling bandit]
You’re in a definite minority, then. The 'Cube had its strengths, but the N64 had about 3 good games and an abundance of crap, in adition to a total and complete lack of content in most games. The 'Cube isn’t and wasn’t perfect, but it has a good selection of stuff and solid, if not amazing, hardware.
[/QUOTE]

The Nintendo 64 is, by far, the superior system. As others have noted, the N64’s revolutionary games redefined entire genres.

Furthermore, it seems the masses agreed, if sales are any indicator as the N64 sold over 32 million units while GameCube sold a paltry 21 million (Wikipedia).