I wish we had the ability to have recalls here in NY.
Not that I would oust Gov. Pataki, on the contrary, he’s been a breath of fresh air after years of the intolerable Mario Cuomo.
Of course our local liberal press loathes the idea; while talking a good game about democracy, they don’t believe the masses are capable of making “clear, thought-out” decisions except during regular elections. They feel recalls are knee-jerk reactions.
But that is exactly what is needed, the ability to hold people accountable every single day they’re in office. No grace period for “good behavior” after they screw up and all seems forgiven or forgotten.
If someone is a criminal, or incompetent, it is a necessity that you can remove that person without waiting until the next election.
These “frauds” tend to behave during election years and sad to say the people have a short memory.
Strike while the iron is hot.
Also note that many other democracies have “no-confidence” voting in their particular systems and things seem to work.
I’m sorry, was there supposed to be a point to that sentence?
As for the rest of your ranting, it does nothing but point out that you don’t like Davis. Well, DUH! I think we already understood that.
I think most of us in this thread are agreeing that it’s a poorly conceived law. Both the threshold to trigger the recall and the simple majority to enact it are too low.
They have a chance to correct their mistake in THE NEXT ELECTION CYCLE. I guess you missed that part.
My evidence would be the FACT that there are more than enough democrats to pursue a recall and get 50 percent. I have no idea whether that will happen only that it could happen and that in of it self is pretty stupid.
You see nothing wrong with the goverment being rotated every few months?
For the record, I’m a republican and I don’t live in California. Davis doesn’t seem like a very good leader but he did win the election and should have his full term to prove his policies are right or wrong.
This is going to be great…after all this sound and fury, and millions of dollars from Issa and the general fund, we’re going to replace Gray Davis with his Lt. Gov, Democrat Cruz Bustamante (if the current polls are to be believed).
Not what the Republicans had in mind, I’m sure.
California Republicans are famous for shooting themselves in the foot (Bill Simon and Michael Huffington being the shining examples of the best and the brightest that they can find for state-wide office) – but this takes the cake.
Did the voters actually get that bill drafted through a referendum or is it like every other law that is passed, more or less at the whim of the legislators?
IIRC from my California History class, Initiative, Referendum and Recall were the brainchildren of Sen. Hiram Johnson, leader of the Progressive Movement at the beginning of the last century. These were reactions to the state of California politics then, when the legislature was a wholly-owned subisidiary of the Union Pacific Railroad.
I’m referring to California and Davis, what in the world are you referring to?
“the goverment being rotated?” “every few months”? Are you posting to the same thread you are reading from???
Blowero said
Okay, here’s the point. When necessary to reiterate what has been said, it is polite to do so accurately… You can do so via quotes, or by paying attention to the wording. It is not nice, and it isn’t fair, to make up words and act as if they were spoken by another…. OR, on point… I commented “Perhaps the real problem with a two party system is” which is not equal to your reflected, “So the 2-party system sucks.”. You are referring to my comment in a way that is misleading and inaccurate. Please, try to be a little more careful when quoting me. Thank you.
The purpose of the law is not to protect the elected official, it is to protect the people. It is uhm…the will of the people, (all 34.000,000 of ‘em), that this poorly conceived law exist.
Have you ever tried to get 50% of a group to agree to anything…? Easy? Simple majority is a basic concept of free government. Majority rule I think they call it.
erislover
The Recall law is defined in the California Election Code, starting in section 11000 (in general), and 11100 (for state officials.) Also see sections 18000 up.
It was enacted by the legislature by, for, and in the name of the People of the State of California. And, yes the Governor signed it!
The “more or less at the whim” legislators are long gone, having been recalled and sent packin’ already. Our lawmakers now prefer a coin to whim, finding the 50/50 odds that calling “heads or tails” provides more aligned to our “Majority Rule” philosophy that that “whim” thing you’re apparently used to.
I’m sorry, Beryl, but I find it slightly speculative to think that all laws are the will of the people when in fact pretty much no people are ever asked about most laws. That was what I was taking exception to, that if a law exists it must be because the people wanted it. People vote, when they vote, for representatives who run on various platforms but are under no major pressure to conform completely, only enough to stay in office.
Why, you might as well say that whoever wins the referendum here is acting in the will of the people. Perhaps all 20% of them.
Count me in with those who think that the recall law is a bad idea. I think Davis has been an awful governor, and that he’s little more than a self-absorbed, access-selling, money-making machine. But that is neither here nor there in determining whether the recall system is a good one.
The most amazing thing, to me, is that Davis was only re-elected less than a year ago. And since then, he’s really done nothing different than what he did for the whole of his first four-year term. It’s not like he suddenly became Mr. Hyde after four years as Dr. Jeckyll–Californians knew exactly what he was like when they re-elected him. If they’re happy to recall him now, it doesn’t say much for their intelligence or perspicuity last November, or now for that matter.
Would your way be possible, that we could, as voters, have a say in every law that was enacted, it would be the greatest democracy ever. Unfortunately it isn’t possible, so we try our best to elect officials who have the same or similar philosophy as ours. There are times though, when that elected leader looses all confidence. When s/he demonstrates that they are incapable of making correct decisions, and that the ones they make are such that they are running the ship of state onto the beach. It isn’t so much a matter of two or three years and it will be over, instead, in this case, two or three more years may leave a mess that the children of this state will have to clean up. When this is possible, it is time to act. Acting against Davis, if it is unfair, can’t be more unfair than requiring this States children to pay the price for the this officials errors in judgment. The real problem with the recall isn’t that it is too easy, it is that the law allows everything that can crawl out from under a rock to apply for the job. Compared to some of the competition, Davis looks like a winner, and that is, IMHO sad. I hope I am wrong, but the governors history in Sacramento proves otherwise.
Thanks.
I agree with this. What’s the point of having a Lt. Govenor’s position, other than to take over for the Governor if he is replaced? The California recall process is insane. If the governor is recalled he ought to be replaced by the lt. governor, (or the state secretary of state or senate majority leader or some present existing office holder in the line of succession) not by somebody with $3,000 and 65 signatures on a petition.
Wrong again…Are you really so sheltered that you don’t know what this is about? It is not about an election we RECENTLY had, Not about losing, it is about ineptness, a solvent future, limited deficits
Not quite, Davis would stay in office until the Secretary of State certifies the results of the election. That process takes a couple of weeks I believe. It may even be longer as some counties say that their counting may take longer this election.
However, there may be a statutory deadline by which the Secretary of State has to certify, as was the case in Florida in 2000.
As for the concepts of the referendum, initiative, and recall, they are all part of the California Constitution and can only be changed by the voters themselves. The Legislature could put such a measure before the voters although I doubt that the Legislature will want to tackle that issue immediately as it will be too busy mopping up the blood after this election.
It is not about an election we RECENTLY had, Not about losing, it is about ineptness, a solvent future, limited deficits