Is the God of Islam a Pagan god?

[John_Kentzel-Griffin]

Off to Great Debates.

DrMatrix - GQ Moderator

[Zagadka]

Well, considering one of the dictionary definitions of “pagan” is

1. One who is not a Christian, Muslim, or Jew, especially a worshiper of a polytheistic religion.

one would presume not. Though one of the secondary definitions of “pagan” is

3. A non-Christian.

one could presume so, though that definition is a bit archaic.

To be fair, pagan in the modern sense, no, Allah is not. He is monotheistic, organized, and not “natural.”

[Will_Repair]

@rjung

I believe you are wrong here. It’s Muslems == Abraham -> Moses -> Jesus -> Mohammad.

I evidently did not make clear the major point I was trying to make. The worship of God by Abraham was spread by Moses and reiterated by Jesus but that message was corrupted or ignored. The message (Koran) was sent to Mohammad to restore the worship started by Abraham. For instance the method of prayer is the same (so believed) as the one practiced by Abraham. In short the message of Mohammad is to get back to the basics of worshiping God as practiced by Abraham.

[Polycarp]

@Renob

The Muslim God and the Christian God are certainly not the same. While Muslims may believe they are worshipping the same God as Christians and Jews, Christians do not hold a similar belief towards Allah. In fact, there are essential differences between how the two see God, not the least of which is that Christianity believes thta Jesus was/is God while Islam simply recognizes him as a prophet. There is also the little matter of the Trinity, as well as fundamental differences in the nature of God that are different between Islam and Christianity, even going back to how each perceives the nature of how God created the world (and I’m not talking about evolution, I’m talking about how God labored to create the world in the Christian view and how God simply spoke and the world was created in Islam).

Now if you’re trying to say that there is only one god and we all worship the same god in different ways, then that’s one thing. But to say that the God of Islam and the God of Christianity are the same underestimates the fundamental differences between the two religions.

Well, let us examine this set of assertions.

1. “Christians do not hold a similar belief towards Allah.” I count several people known to me to be Christian, plus myself, who have said otherwise above. May I suggest the old adage, “All generalizations are incorrect,” for your pondering? Perhaps the appropriate step would be to insert “some” into your comment.

2. Since Jews do not believe in the Trinity, it would follow from your assertions regarding Islam that you are prepared to say that Christians do not believe in the same God as Jews.

3. Regarding Creation, I’m under the distinct impression that Genesis specifies that God called things into existence by commanding them to exist – which John further specifies is done by God’s Word bringing all things into existence. How this differs from your summary of Koranic Creation teaching should be clarified.

4. Regardless of the term Al-Ilah’s ancestry with reference to a moon god or a supreme god in a polytheism, the point remains that Mohammed proclaimed Allah as a monotheos – the only God worthy of being called God – and equated the God which he understood to have spoken to and through him with the God of Abraham.

[PatriotX]

@Renob

The Muslim God and the Christian God are certainly not the same.

Muslims worship the God of Adam, Noah, Abraham, and Moses, - the great I Am.
Christian also worship the God of Adam, Noah, Abraham, and Moses- the great I Am.
Since I Am’s what I Am’s…

[tomndebb]

Since I Am’s what I Am’s…

And this is why the anchor shows up in Christian symbolism?

[astorian]

I do not wish to minimize the real and important differences among Christianity, Islam and Judaism, but it’s absurd to suggest that Allah is a pagan god, or that he is not the same god Christians and Jews pray to.

In case you didn’t know it, not all Arabs are Moslems. There are many Christian Arabs, too. Here’s a question for you: What do Christian Arabs call God?

If you guessed “Allah,” give yourself a pat on the back!

Every Christian church teaches that the God Jesus called “the Father” is the same God who gave Moses the Ten Commandments. And every Moslem believes the God Mohammed called “Allah” is the same God that Jesus called “the Father.” So, to that extent, there’s an underlying connection among the religions. Hence, while I’m a Catholic, I have no doubt that I could contruct a prayer that I could say, together with an Orthodox Jew and a Shiite Moslem, without any of us thinking he had compromised his beliefs. I COULDN’T do that with a Hindu or a Wiccan.

[clairobscur]

@kniz

As to Allah being a moon god it should be noted that it is believed Yahweh started out as a volcano god and was later combined with the sun god, El.

Well…I’m somewhat unconvinced by the “volcano god” part. AFAIK, it’s a theory only based on the interpretation of some verses of the bible added to the proved fact that there was “sacred mountains” where worship took place in this area. By the way, isn’t it simply a mountain god, not a “volcano god”? How many volcanoes are there in Israel?
The “El” part is much better attested, on the other hand. Though it seems to me that El wasn’t a sun god, but a ruler god, with rather extended attributes since the local polytheistic religions were deriving toward henoteism (the main city god, El, or Baal, for instance, progressively swallowing the attributes of the other members of the pantheon until they became unimportant secondary figures). But maybe I’m wrong and El was indeed a sun god. I can’t find my references about him right now. Would anybody know for sure?

[clairobscur]

@Renob

The Muslim God and the Christian God are certainly not the same. While Muslims may believe they are worshipping the same God as Christians and Jews, Christians do not hold a similar belief towards Allah.

You should have wrote : some christians do not share a similar belief. There are plenty of christian who do believe Allah is the same than the christian god, and plenty of christian theologians. You might personnally disagree, but your opinion isn’t a general rule.

In fact, there are essential differences between how the two see God, not the least of which is that Christianity believes thta Jesus was/is God while Islam simply recognizes him as a prophet. There is also the little matter of the Trinity, as well as fundamental differences in the nature of God that are different between Islam and Christianity,

These differences have already been mentionned as being the mains ones which allow both Muslims and Jews to state that the christians are roaming towards idolatry. They don’t prevent them from believing christian worship the same god, and, as I already wrote, it doesn’t preven plenty of christians from believing the same, either.

even going back to how each perceives the nature of how God created the world (and I’m not talking about evolution, I’m talking about how God labored to create the world in the Christian view and how God simply spoke and the world was created in Islam).

Seems like a very minor point to me. Especially since christians disagree amongst themselves about this one.

[Kimstu]

astorian: Hence, while I’m a Catholic, I have no doubt that I could contruct a prayer that I could say, together with an Orthodox Jew and a Shiite Moslem, without any of us thinking he had compromised his beliefs. I COULDN’T do that with a Hindu or a Wiccan.

Dunno about Wiccans, but I’m sure you could construct such a prayer with many Hindus as well; it is quite common among Hindus to consider their multiple deities as just aspects of a transcendent unified God who can be identified simply as “Bhagavan”, “Lord”.