I like the idea of wind generators but I don’t have any great love for the giant turbine monstrosities that are the current norm. It’s not something I would want to live next to and any other man-made object that routinely killed birds on such a large scale would be banned.
There are a lot of interesting designs that are in the pipeline and hopefully they can be scaled to match or beat current designs. I like the idea of roof mounted turbines that line buildings. Assuming they’re quite. Looking at the design it seems like it would be easy to acoustically dampen any noise.
But getting back to cars. I would like a hybrid electric that uses a purpose built generator for electrical power only. And I’d like it to use capacitor batteries which are very light. They’re not power dense for their size but you could stick them anywhere in the car that’s wasted space. Bumpers, fenders frames… etc. They don’t need to drive the car long distances and would make the car much lighter and more power efficient. In essence, it would be more efficient than a pure EV for around town where it’s most needed. And that type of battery charges super fast.
A dedicated direct-to-battery generator would maximize efficiency because it would be tuned to operate at a specific RPM.
That’s what I want. Batteries that aren’t dangerous, will charge fast, and are light weight. A generator that is small and simple to build. The combination makes a vehicle that covers a broad range of requirements with the least amount of resources. All of it can be constructed with current technology and doesn’t require chasing battery technology 10 years down the road.
The problem as I see it revolves around pure EV’s. They drive the need for power-dense batteries. The goal is faster charging batteries but is based on heavy battery packs needed for longer distances.
if we thought in terms of a lighter vehicle for around town where most of the driving is done then we could break away from this mentality of pure EV’s. The battery is the tail wagging the dog. I think we should think in terms of a car that does 90% of the CO2 free driving that covers existing power/fuel infrastructure.
If you’re running a line from where the panel is, then that’s the same as just running a new circuit. The dryer thing is useful if you have a very low powered or full panel, and can’t support another circuit, or the dryer is very close to where you need to charge, so can plug a splitter into the dryer outlet.
Or, if you don’t want to spend $200-400 on one of the fancy splitters, you can get one of these
The largest factor in figuring out how much it will cost to add an EV charger is how far your electric panel is from where the EV charger needs to go. If it is close, and there is room in the panel it could be as little as $200 or so (not including the charger itself). If it’s far away, then the cable run could be $1000+, and if you need to replace the whole panel or upgrade service then it could be $10,000+.
For home EV charging there is “optimal”, “good enough”, and “impossible”. I expect that many of the people in the “good enough” category think they’re in the “impossible” category. Obviously money can move you up categories, but even an existing 15 amp circuit near where the car parks is going to be “good enough” for most people.
Not if you drive much, and don’t have a second car. People do depend on having a car handy when they need it. I mean, for many people with access to buses and ride share, having no car at all is good enough. But if you are used to using a car to get around, it can be a really big downgrade.
From an article at the University of Michigan. Unfortunately the original government sources for some of these numbers have been removed by Trumps pro-oil regime.
And if you don’t want to read the whole paragraph, here is the key takeway, “Bird deaths caused by windmills account for only 0.01% of cat-related bird deaths. Impacts upon bird populations are negligible when compared to other human-caused activities.”
You want batteries stored in dedicated crumple areas like bumpers? Plus, most modern cars don’t exactly have a ton of “wasted” space (or at least not when you’re trying to keep said batteries secure and protected!), and you’d be running a lot of supplemental conduits/wires from these individual batteries or small banks to the drive engine. That’s waste in and of itself as well.
“Most people”. We should trying to convince people EVs will work for them, not banging on and on about the edge cases where they won’t.
If a 15 amp circuit can add 40 miles in 10 hours, then all you need to do is average 40 miles per day, and plug the car in for 10 hours each night. If you can’t do that, then your not in the set of “most people”.
If you have a 70 mile round trip commute, then 15 amps alone isn’t going to cut it. If that one time you had to drive 200 miles in 2 days, then don’t worry about it, just use a DC fast charger to top up if such an unusual situation comes up again.
they store lead/acid batteries in fender areas now along with other items.
Capacitor batteries are nothing like lithium batteries. There should also be available space in the traditional engine bay because a small ice generator and a driver motor don’t take up the space like an engine transmission does.
I believe the excessive charger cost argument in older homes generally revolves around needing to replace the existing panel. A new circuit/line isn’t cheap, but nothing like replacing the panel.
I know my circa 1970 home’s panel is too full to add a new 220 circuit - when/if I get an EV, I’ll need to go with the splitter. Although one electrician suggested ‘twinning’ some of existing 110 circuits which I guess would be another option.
It’s even less demanding than that because it is over the whole seven day week averaging 40 miles a day (280 a week) and averaging 10 hours a day. If you sleep in on weekends, or just don’t rush out, and get 15 hours those days … well it just tops you back off.
Again I quoted bumpers, not fenders. And I’m not an EV engineer, but I do recall most capacitors are going to discharge their storage capacity quite quickly, which means your ICE engine is going to be running very frequently to keep them topped off. Which means you may get some of the same efficiencies from the all electric drive train, but I suspect the net result is going to be similar to the current generation of hybrids - ICE almost all the time, with some savings from the electrical drivetrain especially for stop and go driving and initial acceleration.
Which means (back to US EV market) that you’ll be adding another comparatively niche vehicle to the market that doesn’t please anyone. And I say that as a PHEV driver, who is fully experienced in getting “Not one of us!” from both sides (rarely, to be fair).
Most people don’t want to downgrade their driving experience. “If i want to drive 200 miles, i need to make a special trip and sit in my car for half an hour before i start” is a downgrade. I think we should be trying to convince those people for whom an EV is an upgrade:
Anyone for whom it’s moderately affordable to install a 220V outlet, who doesn’t do a lot of road trips
Anyone for whom it’s moderately affordable to install a 220V outlet who has access to another car for road trips
Anyone who has access to any 15amp outlet who doesn’t routinely drive more than 30 miles per day and who has access to another car for exceptions.
That’s a lot of people.
For other people who routinely drive, and have access to plug in a car, i would recommend EREV and PHEV cars, not a BEV.
That’s a big improvement in carbon emissions, and an upgrade in experience.
And for people who have no place to plug in a car, if your car is reliable, stick with it. Look for a hybrid or a more energy efficient car if you need to replace it.
It very well could though. If you gain 40 miles each night, you are only losing a net of 30 miles each night. That is 150 miles lost during the week. You can regain that over the weekend. And if you have to travel over the weekend and live in a metro area, or even small city that has lvl 3 charging (they are popping up in small citys), you can grab a refill there.
Well the people I know who have electric hybrids drive mostly on the electric motor. If they take a trip it’s electric until they run out of battery and then the car switches over in a seamless transition. It’s the best of both worlds.
And it’s not capacitors. It’s capacitor batteries. They’re very lightweight. the idea is to lighten the weight of the vehicle making it more efficient. There’s no reason for 300 mile range for an around the town vehicle. They also charge quickly so regenerative braking will be faster/more efficient. There’s no downside to this.
I’m just imagining a world of BEV’s where ICE are trying to catch on.
Most people don’t want to downgrade their driving experience. “If I want to drive regularly, I need to make a special trip to a stinky gas station every week, instead of only needing to use public charging once every couple months. And what’s this about oil changes? Is that for real?”
We overestimate the inconveniences of the rare instances, all the while discounting the routine inconveniences of ICE vehicles.
You know how many times I’ve had to visit a gas station and refuel in the last 2 years? You know how many oil changes I had to do? You know how much vehicle maintenance I’ve had to do…at all? To be honest, I have swapped winter tires but I do that myself and also did that with our ICE as well. I have a hydraulic floor jack and I’m not yet old enough to pay someone else to do that. Getting close though
It would be an interesting study to show how much time an ICE owner spends in a year driving to a fueling station, fueling and doing maintenance vs an EV. I know that most months, my EV is way lower than our old ICE.
I had a PHEV for a while, and when i got rid of it (it was a lemon, and had all sorts of issues) i can’t exaggerate how annoying i found it to need to buy gas all the time. Because with the PHEV, i almost never needed to do that. It did need oil changes and all the routine maintenance that an ICE needs. It’s one of the reasons i jumped to BEV this time, I’m looking forward to not needing to deal with that crap.
But i think the sales pitch should be geared to the large fraction of Americans for whom an EV is a quick upgrade. That’s a big market. And as those people upgrade to EVs, infrastructure will follow.
Sure, but I’m just saying that a BEV is probably a quick upgrade even for the majority of people who would only have access to level 1 charging at home. Anyone whose average daily driving is going to be covered by 10-12hrs of level 1 charging is going to be typically driving around on a pretty full battery and be able to do the odd unplanned longer trip without issue. Especially if there are any level 2 chargers in places they routinely go anyways where they can catch up on their state of charge if they’re a bit behind.
Obviously this doesn’t apply to people with longer commutes, or people who don’t have access to even level 1 at home.
Yet we have on this very board, many people bringing edge cases, reasons it can’t work for them, and on and on. How do we convince our own enlightened board that they can work for a large fraction of us? I’ve given up. I’m tired of hearing how they routinely drive 1000 miles in a day while hauling a ton of hay in the trailer and they only stop for a total of 30 minutes. (that’s bit of hyperbole, but that is how it reads to me at this point).
If we can’t get this board on board, or at least open to the idea that they could work for many, we are facing a losing proposition.
Exactly. Most people who drive a 50 mile round trip five days a week, and who stay home to late morning and drive less on weekends, will over the week stay near the same charge, some weeks up a bit and some down.
Even using your assumptions, really it is a minority of people.
People do depend on having a car handy when they need it. I mean, for many people with access to buses and ride share, having no car at all is good enough. But if you are used to using a car to get around, it can be a really big downgrade.