Is this a religious contradiction?

Persecution is a serious charge. You’d better better be prepared to back it with facts up lest you be guilty of bearing false witness. You can bring your faith into the public sector, but you have to take it back home with you when you leave for the day. You yourself can promote your faith within the public sector, but you cannot use the government’s power to promote your faith for you. The public sector must be fair to all and the rules must be the kind that apply to everyone. That means they must be reality-based, not faith-based. Facts and logic apply to everyone, faith does not.

There are 2 things to keep in mind when talking about faith:

  • There is no evidence to back up the many claims made by people of faith.
  • Faith is hotly divisive and leads to bitter conflict and prejudice.

Don’t play the victim as a substitute for proving your supernatural claims.

I predict smclauren will never again post in this thread.

Not talking about symbols.
Jesus went out hunting sinners like us in order to save them. In the process, he never condoned evil.
I don’t care if you disagree. Sounds like you need Him as much as I do.

It’s funny. I didn’t even see this before I posted.

You do not need him, and neither does anybody else.

Well, it weems they had taken the law given by Moses and perverted it into a bunch of traditions that became their “religion” and gave them a one up on every Jew who couldn’t keep it. Trouble was, they couldn’t either. Neither can we. Not even the law originally given by God before modification can be ket perfectly except by One Person, one infinitely merciful person who would even forgive you. Are you better than the ones who think they are better than you?

So maybe you can answer my question. What exactly did Jefferson mean by “a high wall of separation”? Or, for that matter, by “eternal hostility”?

The last part was left off of the inscriptions in the Jefferson Memorial, in the interest of brevity.

See also this book.

Yes, I am.

And your God is not.

To whom did Jeffeson write the letter containing the phrase “separation of church and state” in the first place? It was a group of Baptists who were afraid that the same situation they were leaving in England would be repeated here, a state church like the Church of England. Jefferson was trying to reassure them that this would not happen. The Constitution says that Congress shall make no law establishing a religion or prohibiting the free exercise thereof. I guess nowdays the free exercise of religion could be construed as seances, devil worship or even killing of infidels. I think back then they just wanted to have their own Christian denomination. Do a Google search on Jefferson’s letter to the Danbury Baptists and click on the first few links to get a good idea of both sides/interpretations.

Cite? (In this forum, it’s your job to provide the cite.)




It doesn’t really offend me that you think you are better than others. It’s part of human nature, I guess, to want to be one up on the next person in some way. Jesus came to save us from all that nature and give us His instead.

Maybe some Christians think they are better than those people who have had abortions. Maybe some think they are better than the violent people who attack clinics. Maybe some realize they are not any better and their only hope is faith in Jesus and His sacrifice on our behalf. Point is we are all imperfect in comparison. God hates pride.

The book looks like a real chiller. There really is a lot of deception we need to be careful not to be snared by. Who is the author of deception and lies? He’s a lot smarter than you or me. Don’t let imperfect Christians, like me, keep you from Christ.

I don’t know about the spirit in which this song was written, so I hope it doesn’t offend. But it really seems to fit.

“He said goodbye to the angels of heaven and He came to earth as a common man.
He taught us how we could love one another there was healing in his hand.
There were those who believed and followed Him and there were those who wanted Him dead.
They thought the grave would silence Him forever, but they found out instead.”

“You can close your eyes. You can say it’s a lie you can stick your head in the sand.
You can turn away, even try to explain that He was just another man.
Well they nailed Him to the cross by his hands and his feet and they put Him in the ground.
Three days later everybody found out that you can’t, no you can’t keep a good man down.”

“I hear you say that it all sounds crazy, it’s a good story but it can’t be true.
How could a man who was dead and buried mean a thing to me and you.
Here we are two thousand years later and still the choice is just the same.
You can say that you don’t believe it but it doesn’t change a thing.”

Thats what free exercise of religion would mean to some radical fundamentalists, no?

I did provide the cite if you have the capacity to do a Google search and click on the first few options as I suggested. The second one has the letter in its entirety and an interesting discussion of what different people thought he meant. You will decide for yourself, I’m sure.

Depends on what you have faith in. See reply to BrainGlutton.

I guess people of faith believe that one species can evolve into another.

Jesus didn’t go out hunting people who were sinners,(when they were stoning the prostitute he said; "who ever is with out sin cast the first stone"the people came to him,he defended sinners and didn’t speak very well about the people who thought they were so perfect. He just went and preached, He never condoned evil but he didn’t go around demanding the people wear their religion on their sleeves,he was very critical of the Pharisees who made public display of their religion. He defended the publican in the temple, and said the pharisee’s prayer wasn’t heard.

If you need Jesus you better start re-reading what people said he said and did. There is no proof that Jesus said anything but if he did he said a lot of contradictory things.


If you follow that to its logical conclusion you might discover something that “nobody expects”.