Millions,
So I’m having a pleasant, rainy-day conversation with a fairly uppity liberal (I am in San Francisco) and we start talking about old wait-staff jobs we’ve had. It’s all chuckles and reminiscing until I make a racial comment. This girl, who’s white by the way—and a black studies major, takes extreme offense, calls me racist, and the pleasant rainy-day conversation devolves into an angry argument with raised voices. My question rests on the nature of the comment itself, which I don’t think is racist at all. A little lead in, then the comment:
I worked at a steak house growing up which was located in a predominantly black area. Very American cuisine (potatoes, meat, greens, cheesecake—you know the deal). It was my experience that at least 98% (no joke) of the African Americans who came in ordered their steak the same way. So my comment:
“Black people like their steaks cooked well-done.”
This, ladies and gentlemen, is what launched the tirade. Poppycock, I say. Is it stereotypical? Sure. In my experience, it was true. Both the black patrons of this restaurant and the black co-workers & friends I’ve had have backed this theory up completely. So, I ask, is this racist? If I’d said “French people like their steak rare,” wouldn’t that be the same thing? OrI can’t imagine being screamed at for that. I’ve always thought of racist comments as those which demean an entire race based on little, if any, evidence. But well-done steak? I thought I was just pointing out the obvious.
(p.s. To the moderators: if this belongs in “MPSIMS,” by all means move it. I thought that, since I’d most likely get opposing view points, Great Debates would be a good spot)
I would say it is not racist. I think your “friend” over reacted.
A statement that paints a group of people with a non negative broad brush is at worst careless, not racist.
Only problem I see is your statement is questionable in that it is a universal one. It may just be in that area you grew up in black folks in a very large percentage like their steak well done, while half way across the country they prefer them medium rare. IOW, it might be a regional thing.
Besides which, as far as I’m concerned, your statement merely declared the excellent taste and right-thinking of blacks. If you want a rare steak, eat a cow on a hot day.
Another vote for “not racist”. If you wanted to be extra careful about avoiding even the appearance of racist generalization, you might have phrased it “Black people tend to like steaks well done” or “A lot of black people like steaks well done” or “There’s a tradition in American black culture of having steaks well done”.
If indeed true (and I’m not questioning your personal steakhouse experience, but it might just reflect a local or regional preference rather than one among black people in general), I wonder why it is.
“In my experience, black people like their steak well done”
not only not racist, but quantified (I think that’s the word I’m looking for)
by adding the qualifier, you move the statement from “generalization” to “speicific circumstance”
I’m white, and I like my steaks well done. If I wanted to negatively characterize blacks, I wouldn’t do so by saying they like their steak cooked just like I do.
Possibly a result of the economic discrimination faced by blacks for generations. In my experience, people who “came up” poor tend to eat well done meat because the cuts of meat their family could afford were such that they had to be cooked well done just to be edible. My parents, though white, grew up in poverty and you can’t get either one of them to eat meat that isn’t cooked beyond well done. They hadn’t any childhood experience with medium rare strip steak to draw upon. Their idea of a good meat meal was something like brisket or round steak braised until it was falling apart.
Funny thing was, that thread (I think it was in Cafe Society or maybe IMHO) was one of the most interesting debates then ongoing.
(FYI - I came thiiiiis close to starting an MPSIMS appreciation thread of you. I didn’t only because I thought it might embarass you. But I’d like to take this opportunity to tell you that, over time, I have come to perceive you as one of the most thoughtful and deep thinking posters on the board. While I don’t always agree with your arguments, they are always well constructed and conceived. Sometimes, in fact, I find myself critiquing my own arguments by trying to imagine what flaw you might find in them. Not trying to embarass you here, but I didn’t want to leave that unsaid…)
It’s hard to imagine a more benign racist comment; but according to the definition of racism taht I use (roughly, when youdefine a racial group by characteristics x, y, and z, and then state that the unrelated characteristic W is true of the racial group, you’re being racist), it qualifies. Her getting upset over it was silly, though: it’s about as offensive as if you said, “guys with freckles tend to like red wine.”
When out to lunch with a black co-worker, he ordered steak and I asked him why. He said his parents basically had taught him to, saying that if it wasn’t well cooked, it could be teeming with diseases. When I told him it wouldn’t be and that I ate rare steak strictly, his response was “I’ve been eating steak since before you were born.” One of the best nonsense arguments I’ve ever heard.
Strangely enough those statements are more racist. They imply a lack of ability based on genetics.
The Steak question, as Liberal points out by example is not a negative statement.
