Islam, Christianity, and Judaism vs. Western Lifestyles

Great Debates
1

I don’t really want this to turn into a debate, but I have a feeling that this will end up here nonetheless so I’ll save the Mods some time.

Anyway, I got in a discussion with some friends about the Abrahamic religions ;j and which is the most “pro-western” in outlook. I don’t have nearly enough training in any of the three to adequately show that one moreso than the others is more “western.” Therefore, I turn to you, the minds of SDMB, which religion, scripturally , has the most western slant? I do not care about how any of the religions are actually practiced or what has been done in the past. If we look solely at the texts for each one, which one is the most in line with our society?

Of course, I understand that defining western will likely vary among us all, so actually defining what I’m asking will probably change according to each poster. It won’t be necessary to actually define what western means unless you feel that your actual definition of the word varies dramatically from what the popular consensus would be or it is important in your case. Western can be whatever you feel as long as their is some support for that within our society.

My gut feeling was that Christianity has to be the most supportive of our western lifestyles, but I don’t have textual support. I’m just using my intuition to make this claim. Western society has two major influences, Classical Greek thought and Biblical thought. Therefore, the way I am defining it, Christianity appears to be an inseperable part of what it means to be western. My friends aren’t convinced by my feats of logic.

Looks like I actually may have turned this into a semi-decent debate…

2

sliP: * Therefore, I turn to you, the minds of SDMB, which religion, scripturally , has the most western slant? *

I don’t know about “scripturally”, but I’d suggest that doctrinally, Christianity has two links with classical/western European cultures that Judaism and Islam don’t have, or don’t have as much of:

  1. Its scriptures were being codified in late classical antiquity, by Greek-literate scholars in a Roman-dominated culture. Its ideas were somewhat colored by Greek philosophy, and the language used to write the New Testament was Greek.

  2. Its proselytizing efforts in the first millennium led it to some rapprochement with Western European pagan religions: adopting modified forms of pagan holidays, blending legends of pagan gods with lives of Christian saints, etc.

3

But yeah, the question may be a bit circular. I mean, to the extent that Christianity shaped “Western culture” in Europe and America much more than Judaism or Islam did, Christianity would have to be the “most Western”, right?

4

Since our society has been molded from a Christian and maybe even a Judeo- Christian view, the question may need a little mending. Are there passages in Islam that suggest a style that is more contrary to western values than those prescribed by the other two? Does the Bible and/or the Torah have rules that are more in line with our accepted western standards? I ask because it would seem that Islam is the newest one to shape our culture, though it was the Muslim scholars who preserved the works of antiquity, so maybe pitting the two sides against each other scripturally is not the best. Nonetheless, can a case be made for either side? Even though our society was founded on the Bible, it does not mean that the Bible’s passages were correctly interpreted or even followed when making the institutions that stand for our society.

5

sliP: Are there passages in Islam that suggest a style that is more contrary to western values than those prescribed by the other two? Does the Bible and/or the Torah have rules that are more in line with our accepted western standards? I ask because it would seem that Islam is the newest one to shape our culture, though it was the Muslim scholars who preserved the works of antiquity, so maybe pitting the two sides against each other scripturally is not the best.

Well, to the extent that Christianity largely shaped modern Western culture and Judaism largely shaped Christianity, yes, both of those are more “Western” than Islam.

On the other hand, since Judaism and Christianity both helped shape Islam, and Islamic culture was profoundly influenced by classical Greek philosophy and science, Islam is also culturally “Western”.

To the extent that Islam and Judaism resemble one another more closely than Christianity (rejecting trinitarianism, Semitic-language scriptures, lots of cultural contact in the medieval period, somewhat similar roles in Western society, less impact on European cultures), I suppose you could say they’re less “Western” than Christianity.

And of course, all these remarks apply only to Western Christianity, i.e., the Roman Catholic Church and the Protestant denomination. Eastern Christianity is rather different in its history and influence.

Basically, I think I’m going to withdraw my attempts to answer your question, because it’s just a huge foggy mess. There are so many features of “Westernness”, and they are shared with so many different traits in these different religions, that I think you will find it impossible to nail down an answer.

I’m sticking to what I said in my previous post: The question is circular. Since Christianity had a much greater formative influence on Western culture (and vice versa) than either Judaism or Islam, Christianity is automatically the “most Western” of the three. Make of that what you will.

6

The more I think about it, the more I think it may actually be answerable. If we completely ignore the cultures that have arisen, the schisms that happen, it may be possible. Simply, if an Alien came to Earth with no previous knowledge, looked at the West and then had access to all three holy books which one would he say caused this. Can we really see a link between Christianity and what arose? Does Islam and Judaism have things that would show that they weren’t the founding religions? I think it may be easier to work backwards then work foward from the creations of each respective religion.

7

There are remarkably few aspects of Western culture, even historically, that can be attributed to any of the Abrahamic religions. Western culture has been shaped far more by secular scholars and scientists than it has been by religion. There are some near-universal human beliefs that happen to also be part of the Abrahamic religions that are practiced in Western culture; ‘thou shalt not kill’, for example, and prohibitions against theft and lying, and an encouragement to treat others as one would like to be treated.

Probably the most important determining factor in how much a given culture will be influenced by a given religion is the degree of participation expected of the religion’s followers. Christianity, undoubtedly the dominant religion in Western culture, requires rather little of its believers, particularly among Protestants. Protestantism has a minimal level of participation – all the follower must do is believe in Jesus, and their salvation follows. Church attendance is usually weekly at most. Catholics do have a bit more involvement, but both have one thing in common: their religion does not, for the most part, affect many aspects of daily life.

Judaism, in the orthodox form anyway, requires more of its believers than Christianity. There are strict dietary laws to be followed, and certain activities are prohibited for one day each week. Islam requires substantial participation of its followers; they must pray five times each day, follow dietary laws, and attend services regularly. Orthodox Islam, and to a lesser extent orthodox Judaism, have a great influence over the believer’s everyday life. Decisions on how to act, how to dress, how to eat, and even sometimes what to do with one’s life are deeply influenced by religion.

That is not to say that I would argue that there is anything wrong with beliefs that influence everyday life; I believe that anyone may practice any religion they choose provided they do so of their own free will and do not harm others. But I would argue that Western culture is shaped to a very large extent by the relative freedom of actions and thought that Christianity allows to a somewhat greater degree than the other Abrahamic religions.