Int he world of online dating, I’ve noticed that a disproportionately large number of Italian-American women are obsessed regarding their ethnic identity, compared to other ethnic groups. They’ll identify themselves as Italians, and often state that their ideal match MUST WITHOUT A DOUBT be Italian.
Why aren’t other ethnic groups as obsessed about meeting others of the same (European) ethnicity as Italian-American women?
Probably because of the constraints of cultural baggage and extended family; whilst there’s often no good reason why any two individuals of different ethinicities can’t have a great relationship, acceptance of the partner by the whole cultural machine of the other partner’s family (and vice versa), plus the plain fact that the families themselves might have problems getting on with each other, are factors that unfortunately cannot be ignored.
I doubt very much if the Italian-American ethnicity has a monopoly on this issue.
They’re don’t publish their preferences, but some members of other ethnicities do indeed prefer “their own”: Greek (ala “My Big Fat Greek Wedding”), Jewish, Japanese, Muslim, White, and Black.
Among the last two, just variations of skin tone are enough to disqualify potential mates. One black comedienne said this (paraphrased):
“I brought home a new boyfriend who was very dark. My grandmother came up to me and asked, ‘Why’d you bring home that black thang?’ I said, ‘But Grandma, we’re black!’ She replied, ‘We’re not that black!’”
I know a Macedonian guy whose parents are a bit scandalized that he’s dating a girl from Iceland.
Elmwood,
Do you have any info about where geographically you’re seeing this?
I agree with Mangetout in general, but having lived all over the USA I’ve also noticed that it varies greatly by geography.
In particular, it seems that in NYC folks stay very close to their heritage and you’ll see 3rd generation native-born americans still speaking the ancestral language and having a distinct accent.
The same thing is exceedingly rare on the West Coast.
That doesn’t answer why Italian-Americans (“IAs”) seem to you to be different from other groups.
Perhaps the other groups are even more insular, and as a result tend to gather at ethnic-specific dating sites. The IAs, OTOH, are too mainstream for ethnic-specific sites, so you see them at general interest sites. Meanwhile they still see themselves ethnic enough to want to date within the group.
You could also view this, paradoxically, as a sign of their acceptance within the larger culture.
[preparing to tread lightly]
If, for example, a Black or Jewish person insisted in their profile that they wanted to date only more of the same, that could be seen by the public at large as quite ethnocentric bordering perhaps on mildly racist. It certainly sounds separatist.
But for an IA, since they’re (in my supposition) more fully integrated, the sting is drawn. It lacks the racist overtone and sounds a lot more like a mere harmless personal preference.
So as a result, IAs are not as inhibited about making the preference public. the other groups may have the same-group preference even more strongly, but they’ll be quiet about it until they’re emailing one-on-one.
Again it’s just a theory, and an amateur one at that.
I agree that it’s not just Italian-Americans. Perhaps the reason you’re not seeing similar ads from Jewish people is that you don’t visit http://www.jmatch.com
Good points, all.
I live close to ground zero of Cleveland’s Jewish community, and … well lucwarm, you’re right, I’ve come across very few Jewish women on match.com. Punch in 44124 in http://www.jdate.com, though, and there’s HUNDREDS of women in my age range.
I tend to see the emphasis on Italian ethnicity here in Cleveland, and when I’m browsing through ads in Buffalo. I used to see it a bit in Orlando, but unlike Cleveland and Buffalo, the women usually didn’t say that their matches had to be Italain and/or Catholic.
I guess this brings out a bigger question … why are Italian-Americans collectively more insular than other long-established European ethnic groups in the US?
Because Italian-Americans are likely to speak the same “language”…I’m not talking about English or Italian here, but body language. If we’re with other IAs, we tend to use a lot of meaningful hand gestures, and we understand each other better. If we’re NOT with a lot of other IAs, and are isolated from them for a while, we tend to lessen or stop using the gestures. This probably isn’t the whole reason, and the women you’re seeing ads from probably don’t even conciously realize that…but we do have our own culture, and our own traditions. Generally, we (people of any background, not just IAs) just feel more relaxed when we are with people who understand us.
Oh yeah…old nonPC joke: How do you get an Italian to shut up? Tie his hands together.
This is funny to many Italians, because it’s so true.
Well, it’s good that you chose to tread lightly on the above point, because I won’t go off on ya’. However, does it really sound separatist to say that “Birds of a feather, flock together”? And even if it does, what are you going to do about it ?? Are you gonna get down on the pigeons hanging out peacefully in Rockefeller Plaza for not hanging out with the seagulls??!! Come on! Give us a break.
I don’t think it’s separatist at all to prefer your own ethnic or cultural group when forming friendships or relationships.
The point is that we all seek out as friends, partners and spouses those whom we haves something in common with, or people with qualities that we like. In other words, invariably we seek out people like ourselves.
Would you call such people “classists” or “separatists”? I think not, because to do so would be incredlibly hypocritical and a cheap shot.
Not that I wish to start an argument, but I’d like to suggest that there is an immense difference between a) evaluating people as individuals to see if they have sufficient in common, and are compatible to be your friends; and b) ruling people out as a class from even being considered
I would indeed call the latter “being separatist”
It wouldn’t matter if they ruled people out because they think “women are just different from guys”, “I went to an Ivy League school, would only embarrass people who didn’t”, or “Italians can only freely communicate with people who share their ethnic roots”. [If the latter were true, then would you accept it as a reason for Italians not rising as far in business on average? I wouldn’t. And if they rose as far, in spite of this ‘handicap’, that’d assert a profound superiority “We can be equal with one hand tied behind our back”]
We don’t come pre-packaged in ethnicities. There are too many counter examples. We do come prepackaged as individuals, without exceptions (even Siamese twins have distinct personalities.) Are you saying that someone who isn’t typically Italian -who might not get along with or agree with stereotypical Italian values- should forever be exiled to a no-man’s land between ethnicities, never to truly belong anywhere? “Be true to your kind, because no one else can/should/will ever really accept you?”
I wouldn’t wish to ‘belong’ to an ethnic group that was systematically excluded by others. So I try not to systematically exclude. The two got hand in hand. Excluders create the excluded. it’s just more complicated than the one-on-one we call ‘prejudice’.
Yes, what you describe is a very human tradition, across all ethnicities I know, and no, I wouldn’t want to force anyone to pursue a social agenda, at the cost of their own personal comfort. Relationships are hard enough as it stands. But is it separatist?
Yup.
I’m the son of a Greek immigrant father and a West Virginia mother (at the county fair, they wouldn’t let me anywhere near the sheep!)
Being a half-breed (quoth Cher: “how I learned to hate that word!”), I was considered inferior goods by my father’s friends’ daughters, and have never seriously dated a Greek-American woman.
I have for some reason had a high proportion of Jewish girlfriends, and find their families share the Greeks’ very strong aversion to their daughters marrying outside the faith/community. (Which might explain why I’m still a bachelor).
They also seem to have the same loud, demonstrative manner that Greeks do (FWIW, ‘My Big Fat Greek Wedding’ reminded me more of my Jewish girlfriends’ families than my own Greek/Hillbilly one).
Actually, in SOME places, it’s not enough to be Italian-American! Mores, cuisine and attitudes differ (sometimes subtly, sometimes importantly) within Italy, and among Americans from different regions of Italy.
You think a tradition-minded Sicilian family in Bensonhurst will be overjoyed when Sonny brings home a Neapolitan girl from Bay Ridge? Don’t be so sure!
Sicilian - Neopolitan would be okay but Mama Mia! Don’t be bringing home one of those Genovese!
Frankly I have nothing constructive to add, being an Italo-American Jew, am sure it has something to do with wanting to be with someone who gets the jokes and doesn’t think flinging spaghetti at the walls is the way it is done.
Not all the Jewish women on match.com or other mainstream services may identify themselves as such. I’m on match.com, and I don’t. Reason? I don’t want anyone assuming that I’m only interested in dating Jewish guys. It narrows the options, you know?
I have friends whose families hail from Rome and northern Italy and they continually emphasize that they are not Sicilians and they are not southern Italians.
Come on, we are just skimming around the truth. The Real Reason is:
Because Italians Do It Better. 
Okay, okay, it is old and corny, but it neeeded to be said, right? Sorry.
Lynn, that joke about tying an Italian’s hands to shut him up is still making me giggle after half an hour!
acsenray, I think what you say happens more or less everywhere. I’m sure that it happens even in the smallest states, like, say, Monaco or Vatican City. “Oh, I’m not like those nasty people living 100 meters away!” Consider the long tradition of local independence.